Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Employment contract question

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Employment contract question

    For the past year and a bit I've been doing part time work for a small (american) family-owned school here in Osaka.. in that time they have treated me and all the other teachers like disposable tools, they don't even care if we don't have a break to eat during a 12 hour shift etc etc.

    Following some recent events I have decided to finally throw in the towel, and told them this saturday would be my last day with them. The contract I originally signed said you have to give three weeks notice, however that contract was also for a specified term of 1 year (dated). As I said before, I've been there for a year and a bit... they never asked me to sign a new contract for the 'bit'.

    When I pointed out to them my contract has already expired, they said that it was renewed automatically. Is that possible in legal terms? I didn't sign and wasn't asked to sign anything after the dates specified in the original document. When I have been in other companies on a yearly contract (it's common here as the employer is absolved of any responsibility for you) there has always been a big hoo-haa at renewal time.. lots of paperwork and signing.

    Basically I just really want to bail out ASAP as the owner is a passive aggressive asshole and he will treat me like **** if I have to spend time in his company after handing in my resignation. I've seen it before. I actually had to write a reference for the last teacher who left there because the owners completely ignored his requests.

    I expect by walking out before pay day I will be throwing away the salary for the work I have done in January (about 40,000yen), which I can't really afford to do, but I'm not sure that would stop me. Any thoughts?

    #2
    Obviously falls under Japanese laws so this may not be the case however...

    1: if the contract says it'll automatically renew it's probably enforcable so long as the terms don't change.
    2: if the contract is a "you cannot work here without one" type. There's usually some kind of 'implied consent' law where you know about the contract, have seen the terms and, although you haven't signed it, by working there you've effectively agreed to the terms. Tends to crop up at places like tescos or McDonalds where employees think they're being smart and don't sign. It is however incredibly hard for them to enforce certain things with it and they'd have a tough time in court.

    Comment


      #3
      I don't really understand what your question is.

      I seem to remember reading elsewhere that if an employee wanted to quit asap in the second or subsequent year of a contract, two weeks notice was usual if there was disagreement about it.

      It sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it. You want to be paid as the expired contract stipulated, but not to be bound by the notice period in it. Three weeks doesn't seem too unreasonable to me?

      Is this your secondary / tertiary job? I assume you're working legally? For the record, employers most certainly are not absolved of responsibility for employees who have been there for several years - renewable contract or not.

      Comment


        #4
        Cheers. I'm not so worried about legal ramifications tbh as I've seen enough teachers walk out on the spot to know they won't do anything about it, i just like to have all the facts before I do something rash!

        Stroppy - yeah it's a secondary job - I work for the BoE through ECC the rest of the time and have my visa through them. Three weeks would be fine, but you really need to know the people involved and the working environment to understand why it's tough. To be honest it goes against my nature to quit any job in this manner but they have pushed me too far. Obviously I would like to get paid for the work I have done but as mentioned, I'm prepared to lose that money if it means I can get the hell out of there.
        Last edited by Darwock; 29-01-2009, 08:57.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by abigsmurf View Post
          Obviously falls under Japanese laws so this may not be the case however...

          1: if the contract says it'll automatically renew it's probably enforcable so long as the terms don't change.
          2: if the contract is a "you cannot work here without one" type. There's usually some kind of 'implied consent' law where you know about the contract, have seen the terms and, although you haven't signed it, by working there you've effectively agreed to the terms. Tends to crop up at places like tescos or McDonalds where employees think they're being smart and don't sign. It is however incredibly hard for them to enforce certain things with it and they'd have a tough time in court.
          I think that is highly unlikely to be the case in Japan, especially for foreign workers, who need proof of employment for their visa to be renewed. Everywhere I've worked has been zealous about having its workers contracted.

          Might be worth a phone call to the General Union.

          Just read your edit. Nothing will happen to you if you quit. Even if you were under contract, doing anything to stop you would come under throwing good money after bad.

          I promise to use no more cliches in this thread.
          Last edited by DeathAdder; 29-01-2009, 09:01.

          Comment


            #6
            About the yearly contracts & employer responsibility thing, I've never been too clear about it but in the Nova days it was often cited as the reason why we only got yearly contracts. This job I'm talking about used to have me working there full time (6 days a week and 12 hours a day) but on a part time contract, with no social insurance payments being made. I call that exploitation, lol

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Darwock View Post
              About the yearly contracts & employer responsibility thing, I've never been too clear about it but in the Nova days it was often cited as the reason why we only got yearly contracts. This job I'm talking about used to have me working there full time (6 days a week and 12 hours a day) but on a part time contract, with no social insurance payments being made. I call that exploitation, lol
              Places I've worked at have been very specific at the job interview that there was no guarantee that a contract would be renewed after the third year. Because once you've been there for more than three years, they have to renew your contract if you apply and they have the position available.

              Comment


                #8
                This is totally irrelevant but might mean something to Stroppy.. this school used to employ the black dude who now stars in the Softbank commercials - his name is 'Dante', this school still has a picture of him on their website as if he still f**king works there (right above a pic of me looking really exhausted). Dante could sue them for false advertising using his image, lol

                Comment


                  #9
                  A one year contract seems odd rather than two. Normally, a contract for less than two years would be classed as a short term contract. I know in the UK, you can give a weeks notice if your on contract but most contractors will still give 1 month for good manners.

                  Not sure about Jap law, but in Dubai if you have signed any kind of contractual agreement; should you leave in what may be considered a breach of contract, they will decline to issue you a NOC (no objection certificate), meaning that you cannot work for anyone else for a set period of time. Usually the time until the expiration of your previous contract ends.

                  I'd check it out as japan may have a similar system in place. It basically there to protect its industry & business's from losing workers to either competition or when they feel like moving on for better money.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    You could always give them the notice, go in the next day and if they're unpleasant, walk out. Preferably in front of students and tell them you're ill. Don't both going in again but call in sick everyday.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by NemesiS View Post
                      Not sure about Jap law, but in Dubai if you have signed any kind of contractual agreement; should you leave in what may be considered a breach of contract, they will decline to issue you a NOC (no objection certificate), meaning that you cannot work for anyone else for a set period of time. Usually the time until the expiration of your previous contract ends.
                      I suspect that won't be a problem... as this is not my visa-providing employment I already had to get special permission to work there from the immigration bureau. It's very much considered extraneous work.

                      The responsible adult in me is saying just take it on the chin, go in and teach the last few days and get over it for the student's sake, but after deciding to quit part of me has blown a fuse - I don't feel as though I can tolerate another second of it!
                      Last edited by Darwock; 29-01-2009, 15:04.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        They seem to work in the favour of the employer that after 1yr they can terminate or just auto renew it.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Aside from the problems at the place I'd put in my notice and work it as per the contract.

                          You then hold all the cards, legally and morally. You really never know how burning bridges could affect you later on, for the sake of a few weeks just suck it.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by NemesiS View Post
                            A one year contract seems odd rather than two. Normally, a contract for less than two years would be classed as a short term contract. I know in the UK, you can give a weeks notice if your on contract but most contractors will still give 1 month for good manners.

                            Not sure about Jap law, but in Dubai if you have signed any kind of contractual agreement; should you leave in what may be considered a breach of contract, they will decline to issue you a NOC (no objection certificate), meaning that you cannot work for anyone else for a set period of time. Usually the time until the expiration of your previous contract ends.

                            I'd check it out as japan may have a similar system in place. It basically there to protect its industry & business's from losing workers to either competition or when they feel like moving on for better money.
                            There's no such law in Japan. Some companies stick in a non-compete clause for a couple of years which would prevent you from starting up a competing business of your own, basically to stop teachers leaving and trying to take a load of students with them. But there's no law to stop you getting another job. In Japan it's not falling foul of the law that presents any problem to teachers, it's companies ignoring the law when it suits them.

                            A one-year contract is quite normal here. What is unusual is the apparent presumption of renewal. I suspect that it's bollocks, and if the company wanted rid of you, they would definitely point to the fact that your contract had expired.

                            If you want to go, nothing will stop you, although you might have problems getting any unpaid wages. And insist on signing new contracts in future.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Well, my heart got the better of my head, I just sent them the following:

                              "After some thought - a contract is supposed to be an agreement between two parties. For one party to be able to indefinitely extend the terms of the contract without the written agreement of the other strikes me as unethical, if not illegal. It gives [your school] complete control. This is one example of many where I think you need to have more respect for your teacher's rights. With this in mind I am quitting as of today and won't be at the school tomorrow."

                              Gulp. Pretty satisfying to get it off my chest but I'm waiting their reply with trepidation...

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X