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Why microtransactions, IAPs and LootBoxes are here to stay thread

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    #31
    The ESRB is in deflection mode - feeble attempt to make it look like it's doing something. They may as well have a label on the game box that says "Contains Game Disc"



    It does absolutely nothing to address the concerns that publishers are exploiting gambling mechanics in videogames and dresses up the excellent DLC content of games like The Witcher III as being the same as the insidious loot boxes of Battlefront II. Codswallop.
    Last edited by MartyG; 28-02-2018, 07:24.

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      #32
      Seems pretty weak. I don't suppose it'll have much effect on EA and the like. I guess, being positive, it's a step in the right direction??

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        #33
        Originally posted by Asura View Post
        You think so? I tend to think that something is worth what a person is willing to pay.

        Like I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if I sold a game on eBay for $60k. I'd wonder how someone could spend that much, sure, but I'd be fine taking the money.
        A game and a CS GO skin are kind of different in that one could be considered a sort of modern antique, the other...well, what is it? No artistic or cultural value to it really.

        I wouldnt feel bad if I sold a CS GO skin for that much, and stuff is certainly worth whatever someone is willing to pay. But I'm fascinated as to why someone would feel the thing was worth so much. Love to know who it was. Are they mega rich or did they just put themselves in massive debt for this odd digital thing? I have loads of games and tat but it's just incredible to me that someone would buy this intangible bit of kitsch for such a massive sum.

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          #34
          Someone hacked my Steam account once in order to steal my $1.20 pair of worn out old blue and yellow dual handguns.

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            #35
            Originally posted by wakka View Post
            A game and a CS GO skin are kind of different in that one could be considered a sort of modern antique, the other...well, what is it? No artistic or cultural value to it really.
            It's just daft - I've got PUBG skins that are selling for £14 on Steam marketplace - I'm half tempted to sell them were it not for the fact I'm vehemently against this stuff and it would be exploiting the whales that publishers are using themselves.

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              #36
              An interesting article which seems to suggest that the appetite for loot boxes may be changing. I'm not 100% convinced.

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                #37
                I read that more as loot boxes being 'cosmetic only' than any real changes.

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                  #38
                  I think it's a case of, if you dance with the devil...

                  People are desperate for shiny new consoles to be released every few years so that they can have better graphics and bigger games. There's obviously a cost to all this and game development budgets are going up all the time. No one is willing to pay more than £45 for a game (barring collectors, but that's a completely different market) so the developers have to recover the cost in other ways.

                  Did we really need the PS4 and Xbone? What was wrong with the previous gen? It's not as if the graphics were unbearably ugly or the games primitive to the point of redundancy. There's clearly a market out there for these consoles but that comes at a cost which no one seems willing to pay. If people want the shiny new consoles and games they have to pay for them. If they don't then stick with the previous generation.

                  The industry will only stick with DLC, loot boxes, etc. if consumers want them to. However, there's no fantasy land where development costs go up with each generation but game prices stay the same. Either we pay more for our games or we stick with the technical level we currently have.

                  I really don't understand the mentality of 'I want better graphics and bigger games but I refuse to pay more than £45 for it. If the games industry can't figure out some magical form of economics that makes this possible than SCREW YOU EA!!11!!1!!'

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                    #39
                    Originally posted by BigDeadFreak View Post
                    The industry will only stick with DLC, loot boxes, etc. if consumers want them to.
                    This is the key thing.

                    The "rising cost of games development" is a thing, but it doesn't scale linearly. Tool improvements and better workflows definitely allow developers to do more for less. When it comes down to it, the videogame industry is enormous in terms of revenue.

                    The only things that will stop loot box stuff is either legislation (which won't really stop it; it'll just push for new solutions that do the same thing but get around the wording of the law) or, and this is vital, consumers stop buying the stuff. I mean look at what's going on now, how ANTHEM is in limbo because of the Battlefront II fiasco.

                    The thing that concerns me about this is that I believed the above had already happened - when the Facebook game bubble burst, that we would see freemium not disappear but become significantly less prevalent. I thought after millions upon millions of people had spent money in Farmville and Candy Crush then moved on, they might be hesitant to spend money in other freemium games further down the road. However, mobile gaming keeps on trucking despite this, and it isn't because of kids stealing their parents' credit cards; it's small purchases from a legion of normal people who are largely silent in conventional videogame discourse. The sorts of people who would never buy a conventional game but somehow end up spending >£100 in Hay Day.

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                      #40
                      Originally posted by BigDeadFreak View Post
                      I think it's a case of, if you dance with the devil...

                      People are desperate for shiny new consoles to be released every few years so that they can have better graphics and bigger games. There's obviously a cost to all this and game development budgets are going up all the time. No one is willing to pay more than £45 for a game (barring collectors, but that's a completely different market) so the developers have to recover the cost in other ways.

                      Did we really need the PS4 and Xbone? What was wrong with the previous gen? It's not as if the graphics were unbearably ugly or the games primitive to the point of redundancy. There's clearly a market out there for these consoles but that comes at a cost which no one seems willing to pay. If people want the shiny new consoles and games they have to pay for them. If they don't then stick with the previous generation.

                      The industry will only stick with DLC, loot boxes, etc. if consumers want them to. However, there's no fantasy land where development costs go up with each generation but game prices stay the same. Either we pay more for our games or we stick with the technical level we currently have.

                      I really don't understand the mentality of 'I want better graphics and bigger games but I refuse to pay more than £45 for it. If the games industry can't figure out some magical form of economics that makes this possible than SCREW YOU EA!!11!!1!!'
                      I think you've missed the point entirely.

                      I don't think many people on this forum don't like lootboxes because they want to spend an arbitrary amount on a videogame. They largely recognise the exploitative, predatory and manipulative practices. Particularly when someone like Take-Two CEO Strauss Zelnick, states that GTA V is 'under-montised'. This is about greed for the developers and publishers. They love the 'uncapped' nature of the revenue and the minimal comeback consumers have under current legislation and consumer protection. However, of course there will be those who like the potential reduced cost for vdeiogames and don't care if others are spending hundreds or thousands of pounds on the same game.

                      The industry will stick with DLC, Lootboxes etc. as long as they are making record profits. If and when they become less profitable or legislation reduces revenue then some developers and publishers will switch to other business models. What is beyond doubt is lootboxes are impacting game design much more than other business models like fixed price, DLC or subscription. Even if videogames are getting more expensive, with increases in staff budgets and advertising, a game simply does not need to be a gambling simulator or employ a mobile game progression system to be profitable.

                      As for hardware, this is irrelevant. The platform holders are spending less on R&D, don't sell hardware at loss and enjoying record revenues through their digital storefront and subscription models. So progression in new hardware is not going to affect or change how third-party publishers monetise their games.
                      Last edited by Digfox; 07-03-2018, 18:35.

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                        #41
                        Also, you really think publishers would stop filling games with season passes, loot boxes and microtransactions if they raised the entry point to £60+?

                        Pull the other one, it makes King Kong fall out of the sky onto Andrew Wilson's noggin.

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                          #42
                          It's all in the delivery. In theory cosmetic ones in a game such as BF5 are alright as the season pass has been abandoned. I'm not going to buy loot boxes so in those terms they're a perk that's saved me £35 on a season pass. I barely even notice they exist in COD, I wish they'd abandon season passes.

                          They slip over the line so easily though. Personally, I've no idea why people would want to pay for a loot box as opposed to simply buying the DLC you actually want via microtransaction. It's like consumers are actively chasing the crappest buying method they can.

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                            #43
                            Hot on the heels of the Netherlands declaring loot boxes are gambling and therefore illegal, Belgium has had its say.Th…


                            This seems like quite a blow to loot boxes!

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                              #44
                              Ha! Good. Hopefully theres a European version of these games without the lootboxes.

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                                #45
                                Good news! At the simplest level publishers may just avoid Belgium (and/or Holland) but there is still more change coming before this storm is over.

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