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Is Western Civilisation in Decline?

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    #16
    I suspected from the title that this thread would be hippy and religion vs science and reality. Not disappointed!

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      #17
      Originally posted by Zen Monkey View Post
      To love the planet is to love all things and, ultimately, have the welfare of all life in mind.
      I don't think the Nazis were quite with you on this point.

      As before, what I feel from your posts is a huge gulf between where you'd like to be, possibly the feelings or connection you aspire to, and where you're at. You seem to have a huge dissatisfaction with the state of your world and, as a result, revere anything which isn't that, be it somewhere else or some other time. In doing so, you're casting judgements while seemingly thinking people shouldn't.

      But I think you should. Judge away. Only by looking and recognising what is wrong, casting judgement on those things, will you see the need to improve and fix them. If you weren't making a judgement that having no insects is bad, you couldn't improve on the situation. And some of that will require judgment of the actions of those creating and contributing to that situation. So you have my blessing to judge.

      But I also believe that there is so much good that fantasies of other times are blinding you to. In aspiring to another place, another time, you cannot see the wonders that are right here. In that, I wish you good luck and a clarity of vision.

      To sum up on the thread topic - I think society has its ups and downs and we have so much wrong and so much to fix. We have the capacity to do so much damage but we also have the capacity for great things too. And many people have it better than ever. History is a dark, nasty, dirty place to live. We have it better. As for people, we shared years with Bob Ross, Mister Rogers, Jim Henson, Big Bird, Bowie, George Carlin and so many, many more. We've been lucky. But there will be others. Personally, I fear for many aspects of humanity (and I don't villify fear the way you do) but I'm really looking forward to seeing where we can go from here.

      Last edited by Dogg Thang; 26-04-2019, 15:38.

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        #18
        Mung beans.

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          #19
          Originally posted by Zen Monkey View Post
          This is where religion has its place. It can help us recognise and confront the ugliness in ourselves.
          I don't believe religion has a place in this world anymore.

          That's not because it's the downfall of a civilisation. That's because science has progressed so far, along with society being allowed to break out of organised religion in day to day life, that people can view our world from a scientific viewpoint.

          True love and peace is found inside each of us. We don't need a religious construct to frame it.

          If you find religion a comfort blanket then who am I to judge, you should believe in whatever you want. But I feel teaching religion to children and forcing religious beliefs on a population to be truly abhorrent. And I practise what I believe, I refused to be a Godfather to my beautiful Niece as her parents were forcing their (I'll be honest, non-existent) beliefs onto their child. And I was brought up CoE and have pulled away from that Church since I was a teenager, for it's sins.

          I find comfort in love, charity, kindness, poetry, nature, technology and works of art. Religion is blindness. Kindness is free.

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            #20
            Originally posted by Zen Monkey View Post
            This thread's gonna be a corker. You'll see.
            I doubt it what with the forum being dead and all...

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              #21
              Originally posted by Wools View Post
              True love and peace is found inside each of us.
              Except me. Beer and crisps is found inside me.

              Really though, yeah, this. One of the greatest myths that has been perpetuated over the years is that humanity needs religion as a moral compass rather than just basic empathy which we're all capable of and should be nurtured over anything written in an old book... unless it's an old book about basic empathy, I guess.

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                #22
                Someone has been watching too many episodes of American Gods

                It sounds like you yearn for simpler times and somewhat struggle with how society and civilisation is progressing. It kind of reminds me of futsies from Judge Dredd, people who suffer from future shock and find it difficult to cope in a modern lifestyle. We’ve enjoyed years of peace and freedom compared to the dark times in history. Many people talk about “the good old days”, I genuinely think it’s better now than it’s ever been. Mainly because we are able to choose our own way of thinking rather than it be done for us. Rather than be hamstrung I think we’ve grown as a species, to be masters of our own destinies. I can’t wait to see what the future brings.

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                  #23
                  Originally posted by Dogg Thang View Post
                  Except me. Beer and crisps is found inside me.

                  Really though, yeah, this. One of the greatest myths that has been perpetuated over the years is that humanity needs religion as a moral compass rather than just basic empathy which we're all capable of and should be nurtured over anything written in an old book... unless it's an old book about basic empathy, I guess.
                  Hogsback TEA and Doritos are the answer

                  Agreed. Despite being christened, Mum didn't believe (Having no Dad might have been her reason for going all out with a christening!) but all my values were taught by my Mum, Nan, Grandad and friends. I didn't need a religion to lead me through life's moral dilemma's, you just need a good upbringing.

                  And although this isn't a popular opinion, I've always despised how church's form charities and then help the needy. Despite being a wonderful gesture from the outside, I've always felt the seedy underbelly is to get more converts. Another alcoholic or drug user finding god? Oh, did a religious charity have a hand in their rehabilitation?

                  Feel free to strike me down, but I'm truly sick how prevalent religion has infested its way into so many public forms. I have no time for it myself. Despite that, I'm very tolerant! 2 close friends are Jehovah Witnesses and couldn't be more lovely, they just try and convert me when I go over! The guy is very scientific but every unknown element in Space and our lives will be equated to god. He's asked me countless times don't you struggle not knowing? I never have as if their is a god in how he believes it, I honestly don't believe in human religious history and it's many tellings and teachings. If we were created, then I feel to live our life as happily and inquisitive as possible is all he / she / bi / transgender / it / they could have wanted.

                  **** organised religion, let's celebrate us and what we have.

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                    #24
                    There is no Love without Fear. Discuss.

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                      #25
                      Well I know there is no I in team.

                      That’s an upper case i but there is also no lower case L in team either so it works either way. Food for thought.

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                        #26
                        Originally posted by Dogg Thang View Post
                        Well I know there is no I in team.
                        There's a ME if you look hard enough

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by Asura View Post
                          There's a ME if you look hard enough
                          And also meat in spite of what vegetarians would have you believe.

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                            #28
                            I’ve always thought that musically, the last twenty years have lacked any kind of distinctiveness in the creation of new styles or movements.

                            Even if you just take the preceding 40 years:
                            1960s: Rock n roll, pop
                            1970s: Prog Rock, Disco, Punk, Heavy Metal
                            1980s: New Romanticism, Hip Hop, Garage, House
                            1990s: Grunge, Alt Rock, Brit Pop, Boy bands

                            I’ve probably missed some other stuff from that list, and it’s undeniable that some movements were more about creativity than sales (and have since had their importance recognised). But 2000 onwards seems to have been a faceless void.

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                              #29
                              [MENTION=7343]prinnysquad[/MENTION]

                              Hey, HEY, HEEEEEYYYYYY!!!!

                              The 2000s brought us UK Garage and don't you forget it!

                              "Can I get a reeeeeeewind?!"

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Wools View Post
                                I don't believe religion has a place in this world anymore.

                                That's not because it's the downfall of a civilisation. That's because science has progressed so far, along with society being allowed to break out of organised religion in day to day life, that people can view our world from a scientific viewpoint.

                                True love and peace is found inside each of us. We don't need a religious construct to frame it.

                                If you find religion a comfort blanket then who am I to judge, you should believe in whatever you want. But I feel teaching religion to children and forcing religious beliefs on a population to be truly abhorrent. And I practise what I believe, I refused to be a Godfather to my beautiful Niece as her parents were forcing their (I'll be honest, non-existent) beliefs onto their child. And I was brought up CoE and have pulled away from that Church since I was a teenager, for it's sins.

                                I find comfort in love, charity, kindness, poetry, nature, technology and works of art. Religion is blindness. Kindness is free.
                                Yep, I feel if we had the science knowledge a couple of thousand years or so ago then there would be no belief systems at all.

                                Originally posted by prinnysquad View Post
                                I’ve always thought that musically, the last twenty years have lacked any kind of distinctiveness in the creation of new styles or movements.

                                Even if you just take the preceding 40 years:
                                1960s: Rock n roll, pop
                                1970s: Prog Rock, Disco, Punk, Heavy Metal
                                1980s: New Romanticism, Hip Hop, Garage, House
                                1990s: Grunge, Alt Rock, Brit Pop, Boy bands

                                I’ve probably missed some other stuff from that list, and it’s undeniable that some movements were more about creativity than sales (and have since had their importance recognised). But 2000 onwards seems to have been a faceless void.
                                Too right, me and the wife try to reason with the daughter about the music and acts of today compared to years ago. Apparently just 'cos BTS or Swifty have a trillion views or what not it makes them the best ever!

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