Nintendo Switch: Thread 07

[Dogg Thang]

when I think about other Nintendo systems and what I most recall for them by comparison so far the Switch will mostly be defined for me by how much it's allowed me to keep catching up some of my Steam indies backlog etc. .

Yeah, I would understand this and would have to agree. While the Switch delivers for me in ways so far beyond most Nintendo consoles (at least recent ones), if we were to only look at the first party Nintendo games and compare across their systems, I don't think the Switch would look so rosy. And as for your ranking of Odyssey, I'd also tend to agree... but with the caveat that the standard is so high among those games that being second-last for me doesn't really mean a negative. I would certainly place it way above Sunshine, which was the only real blip in the series for me even though it looked gorgeous.

One other thing about the Switch is that I never thought in a million years that it would get the 3rd party support it has. I mean, who would blame any publisher for staying well away after the WiiU?

[Neon Ignition]

Yep, Odyssey is definitely a very strong game, like all Mario's they shine as soon as you compare them to anything not-Mario more that if they did make a direct sequel there'd be a fair few things I'd want to see addressed compared to the likes of Galaxy that was and remains pure classic.

What's been fairly nice with the Switch when it comes to third parties is that it's picked up steam whilst also still avoiding a lot of the obvious titles. You don't see any Creed, Call of Duty, Battlefield etc because of the power difference which means those that do appear get more exposure than normal. It's a curious thing when they do turn up too like Doom, The Witcher 3 (for me though the recent Wolfenstein compromised itself a little too much to fit on the system so the idea of Witcher 3 of the upcoming port of Outer Worlds feels like stretching the hardware too much).

[Dogg Thang]

I think when it comes to games like Doom, the Switch is like that kid in class who used to get loads of praise for getting a D because everyone was so used to them failing when the straight-A kid barely got a mention. That sounds harsh but you know what I mean - we don't expect it to be able to deliver something like that.

[Neon Ignition]

Weirdly Doom I was alright with, I think that the positive response it got has fuelled Bethesda to bring all the FPS line to the Switch but the later stuff isn't as well suited. Despite enjoying it enough I think I'd be wary of playing Doom Eternal on it

[teddymeow]

Odyssey is incredible. MK8 Deluxe is brilliant. BotW is, well, okay I guess (not being sarcastic - it's never really got under my skin).

I've no interest in the third party stuff as I can generally play that on a more powerful system.

[Nico87]

Odyssey is incredible. MK8 Deluxe is brilliant. BotW is, well, okay I guess (not being sarcastic - it's never really got under my skin).

I've no interest in the third party stuff as I can generally play that on a more powerful system.

I'm in the same boat as you. I've been through two Switches and one Switch Lite (which I sold after a month) but there's something that keeps me from embracing it as much as I did the 3DS.

I'm of the opinion that if you own a Wii U there's no REAL reason need to get a Switch, and especially so if you have a 3DS as well. What I mean by this in first party terms is that having access to the two Galaxy games and 3D World is MUCH better than having access to only Odyssey. In addition to that you have:

Bayonetta & Bayonetta 2 - available on both
Breath of the Wild - available on both
Captain Toad - available on both
DK: Tropical Freeze - available on both
Galaxies + 3D World > Odyssey
Kirby's Adventure + Epic Yarn > Star Allies
NSMBU - available on both
Wind Waker HD > Link's Awakening
Xenoblade > Xenoblade 2
Yoshi's Woolly World > Epic Yarn
No equivalent for Luigi's Mansion 3 on Wii/Wii U (why wasn't the original ported under the New Play Control! line for Wii!?) and Three Houses is probably better than Radiant Dawn.

I'm not port hating by the way, I understand fully well why Nintendo port their best Wii U games to Switch and I think it's a good strategy to release ports between their Switch exclusives.

As for third party games - no real reason to buy those on Switch unless you really want to play them handheld. Switch has taken Vita's place as a handheld for niche Japanese games and a boatload of Visual Novels, but the best VNs have PS4 ports too (and the PS4 version of Steins;Gate Elite got much better free DLC than the Switch version. Yes, VNs probably feel better on handhelds but I already have a PS4 so I'm good.

Will say this though, I have over 800 hours played in Arms!

[wakka]

To be fair I think we’re at a point where there’s a lot of Nintendo stuff that isn’t ports, especially with Pokémon out this Friday. The WiiU and 3DS stuff was ages ago, anyone who’s a fan will have played all that stuff to death by now.

It’s a really cool console. But I’ve sunk way, WAY more time into the Xbox I got last Christmas. Which I never would’ve guessed. I think maybe I’m just a little burned out on Nintendo for the time being. Their stuff is so good and super polished but I’d rather be playing Call of Shooty Modern Propaganda right now.

[Nico87]

To be fair I think we’re at a point where there’s a lot of Nintendo stuff that isn’t ports, especially with Pokémon out this Friday. The WiiU and 3DS stuff was ages ago, anyone who’s a fan will have played all that stuff to death by now.

It’s a really cool console. But I’ve sunk way, WAY more time into the Xbox I got last Christmas. Which I never would’ve guessed. I think maybe I’m just a little burned out on Nintendo for the time being. Their stuff is so good and super polished but I’d rather be playing Call of Shooty Modern Propaganda right now.

I think I'm getting bored of new system = new Mario, new Kirby, new Yoshi, new Zelda, etc. I think one big difference between Nintendo and Sony/Xbox is that they don't really do studio acquisitions. They have Game Freak, Intelligent System and HAL, but those three have always been about Pokemon, Fire Emblem and Kirby.

New IP's for PS4:

Astro Bot
Bloodborne
Concrete Genie
Days Gone
Death Stranding
Detroit: Become Human (also available on PC)
Dreams
Horizon Zero Dawn
Nioh
Spider-Man
The Last Guardian
Until Dawn

New IPs for Switch:

1-2 Switch
Arms
Astral Chain
Daemon X Machina
Fitness Boxing
Labo
Marvel Ultimate Alliance 3
Octopath Traveler (also available on PC)
Ring Fit Adventure
Snipperclips
Sushi Striker

That's a huge gulf between them in terms of budget, quality and sales numbers. Nintendo's new IP's scream low budget, low risk. Granted, they struck gold with Splatoon, but that's four and a half years ago now.

[Asura]

Posted my thoughts about Mario & Sonic 2020 in the thread. Spoiler warning... It's disappointing.

[Nu-Eclipse]

With Odyssey it's Sunshine I'd place it comfortably above, that game forever being the 3D Mario weakest link. 64 though, nah. 64 has aged but for its time it absolutely destroys Odyssey. Aged as it is I would be more likely to return to it as well. I did firmly enjoy Odyssey but there's too many off moments in it that get worse the more into the endgame you get which 64 and the Galaxy games don't suffer from. I hope we get another Mario game on the Switch but I feel little thirst for it in Odyssey 2 form.

Couldn’t disagree more.

64 was ground-breaking for its time, sure. But compared to Odyssey now it is terribly sparse, slow and basic. Odyssey is just far more refined and polished, and above all else, more fun to play - none of this throwing you right back to the central hub of the game when you collect a moon a la 64/Sunshine/Galaxy/Galaxy 2 when you collect stars/shines, just keep going! It’s small refined touches like that improve the 3D Mario quality of life and keep Odyssey fast-paced and constantly enjoyable. Also, you complain so much about Odyssey’s endgame (and wrongly because it is nowhere near as bad as you try to make it out to be) but 64 doesn’t even have one!

Literally the only thing 64 has over Odyssey is its camerawork, which arguably remains the best camerawork ever in a 3D Mario imo - and even then some would argue in favour of the Galaxy games on that score.

Sorry, for me Odyssey is superior to 64 in every serious aspect bar the nostalgia and even that is questionable - Odyssey is the quintessential celebration of Mario with the amount of fanservice and throwback material contained within it.

I consider Galaxy and Galaxy 2 to be amongst the very best games of the PS3/360/Wii generation, and I wanted Galaxy 3 as much as anybody, but Galaxy and Galaxy 2 were commercial flops by Wii standards. In the context of the Switch, a direct follow-up to Odyssey would absolutely be the correct way for EAD to go and I certainly wouldn’t be upset if that did happen. Whether it actually does is another matter entirely.

[Neon Ignition]

But Mario 64's end-game was the 50 Stars beyond the 70 needed to complete the game, it's a lot less than the 1000 or so moons needed to 100% Odyssey but considering it's 23 years ago it was still there.

My issue with Odyssey is, it's not so much disagreeing about the technical superiority of Odyssey which should be without question given it's a newer game by over two decades, but it was certainly regressive for the franchise for me. Far too much of Odyssey is prone to filler, not that great a proportion of those moons are actually that fun to acquire. I know a good number of players enjoy the crumb trail nature of them but I didn't appreciate how many required pretty much zero effort to acquire whilst others where so stupidly obscure that it sucked the fun right out of them. I think Odyssey is the one Mario where the more I stuck with it post completion the less fun the game became.

None the less it's still pretty much the peak Switch game because as I've said, the Switch absolutely does not get credit for Breath of the Wild, Mario Kart 8 etc. My original slight is more that the Switch list would be:

-ARMS
-Astral Chain
-1-2 Switch
-Daemon x Machina
-Fire Emblem: Three Houses
-Kirby: Star Allies
-Mario + Rabbids: Kingdom Battle
-Mario Tennis Aces
-Marvel Ultimate Alliance 3
-Labo
-Pokémon Let's Go
-Splatoon 2
-Super Mario Maker 2
-Super Mario Odyssey
-Super Mario Party
-Super Smash Bros Ultimate
-Xenoblade Chronicles 2

It's great the system is finally seeing Pokémon arrive in a console digestible version and it'll be nice to see Animal Crossing finally rear its head again but in terms of Nintendo Console Hall of Fame line ups the Switch is... pretty weak. As much as I enjoy the system now I don't feel I'm lined up to consider it in the same light as the other systems when the time comes to move on and it hasn't really swayed me from concerns about Nintendo dropping the ball again like they did post-Wii.

[Nu-Eclipse]

But Mario 64's end-game was the 50 Stars beyond the 70 needed to complete the game, it's a lot less than the 1000 or so moons needed to 100% Odyssey but considering it's 23 years ago it was still there.

I feel like you’re being disingenuous now.

Let us be clear - collecting the last 50 stars in 64 simply isn’t an endgame of any kind (I’m pretty sure that 60 stars were required to see an ending in 64?). Yes, they’re needed to 100% the game but they’re not absolutely necessary to see an ending at minimum, which is literally the rule for every 3D Mario and definitely a rule for Odyssey - you don’t need 999 moons to see an ending at minimum.

And 64 definitely had filler moments, many of which were even more basic than those found in Odyssey. To suggest otherwise is laughable.

By every possible metric, Odyssey is a superior game.

[Zaki]

Odyssey is fantastic!....but....I still prefer the Galaxy games.

I wish they'd get a resolution bump and get ported to switch in a bundle.

[Dogg Thang]

it hasn't really swayed me from concerns about Nintendo dropping the ball again like they did post-Wii.

For me, the third party support is what shows they haven't. Because honestly, the lack of it is what killed the WiiU and made it a difficult proposition for buyers. Even on the Wii, as huge as it was and with the amount of third party stuff on it, it didn't have the games support for I guess our types of gamers on that system. Because if the stories are true, they didn't really sell on the system - because it was being sold more like a toy than a games system. I think that haunted the WiiU and I fully expected it to be worse on the Switch because those who were burned on the WiiU wouldn't return. But that's not the case.

You can prefer the line up of other Nintendo systems of course. And I agree with you on the first party titles and yet that's probably more about personal taste for me. And you can say it doesn't get credit for BotW or MK8 and nevertheless it offers those games so they count in some form. And with all that in mind, and even with the build quality (and other obvious failings the system has), I can't see what criteria the system could be said to have dropped the ball when stacked up against the WiiU.

[Neon Ignition]

Mario 64 definitely had filler content but by comparison it's a drizzle compared to the bucket load Odyssey pours in. In the end it's by the by as it's completely optional so something the player can strip from the experience if they choose to. Plus, the Galaxy's are the far better games anyway

I think, with the third parties, the Switch is definitely the best Nintendo has had it since the 16 bit era but my concern would be that they're a little moth-to-a-flame potentially. As in, it's on Nintendo that the system launched so strongly and so third parties began to be attracted to the Switch but if Nintendo personally fumbled the next system I'm not convinced third parties wouldn't abandon ship quickly again.

It's all definitely imo, there's clearly a lot of people who are very happy with the first party offerings the system has as it's halfway through it's lifespan and so far halfway to meeting the lifetime sales figure bar it needs to meet so on course to hold well for Nintendo as a result. Same with the system benefitting from how few played the WiiU, I just separate stuff like MK8 because it's great to have to play on the system but it's a WiiU game on the Switch in the same way it was great I could buy Mario Galaxy on the WiiU or will be able to buy Last of Us Part II to play on PS5. For me, it's a solid system especially compared to WiiU - just that I'd still give Nintendo's last system the nod for the better big first party line up if the next 2yrs or so don't reverse that.