Google Stadia: Thread 01

[MartyG]

Gaming eight hours a day?! Are these people privately wealthy?!

These people never sleep

[Digfox]

I just think there are interesting possibilities there to be explored. I'd be interested to see what someone like Kojima would dream up to use the technology for, for example. As much as I dislike this Google effort, I'm not ready to say yep, complete waste of time, bin it, let's use consoles and hard drives and discs for ever and nothing else.

There are. There are numerous scenarios which you can do when the client and server are near each other. Stuff you can't do on traditional hardware, i.e. 1000 player Battle Royale. Streaming is the future otherwise Google and Microsoft wouldn't be investing in it. As their execs have mentioned it's not about selling to the tens of millions but rather the hundreds. Google do invest billions in services that don't necessarily take off. They will save more on their tax avoidance this year anyway.

As you say it will probably compliment local hardware for some time. It doesn't mean consoles or PCs are going anywhere. Lag is a problem right now even on local hardware, something people often overlook. TESO right now with all it's EU Megaserver issues makes Stadio look like a 240hz monitor plugged into a GTX 2080ti.

That said Google probably do deserve some criticism for how they have launched this initial phase of Stadia.

I run downloads overnight - you'll pass 105GB after a week's or so play

Just one example of a problem streaming does away with. Btw with the issues I had with my Xbox One X recently I ended up downloading Shadowkeep 3 times. Unique example or not, that sort of issue goes away with Stadia. Steaming games solves many issues that local hardware has. Although hopefully with Sony pushing improvements in PS5 downloading hopefully 175GB downloads and whatnot become slightly less common.

[MartyG]

But it creates more issues than it solves as far as I'm concerned. As I already said, this isn't about improving the end user experience (even if the marketing is suggesting otherwise). If you're having download issues, this is surely going to translate into a bad experience for a streaming service that's reliant on good, always on internet.

And really, do people want a 1000 player battle royale? It's bad enough playing with 49 randoms.

[Neon Ignition]

I think the most startling thing for me is how consistently Stadia performance isn't up to par with a gaming PC's performance. This is bearing in mind that we're just 12 months away from the launch of a new generation of consoles too, to see its performance fail to meet muster with ease isn't reassuring either.

For Google to invest in the tech makes sense, like Sony putting money into VR, the applications outside of gaming make it highly valuable. For gaming though - I don't think they'll be making a second iteration.

[MartyG]

The fact that the 4K stream of Red Dead isn't 4K says it all - it isn't rendered in 4K, it's 1080P upscaled and streamed at 4K - you have to ask at that point, why? Just have it stream at 1080P and be less heavy on the internet connection.

The downside with game streaming is it isn't passive - music, movies you can get away with bad connections because you're caching enough data for it not to matter unless things get really bad. Gaming is interactive, you can't buffer for that.

[Digfox]

But it creates more issues than it solves as far as I'm concerned. As I already said, this isn't about improving the end user experience (even if the marketing is suggesting otherwise). If you're having download issues, this is surely going to translate into a bad experience for a streaming service that's reliant on good, always on internet.

And really, do people want a 1000 player battle royale? It's bad enough playing with 49 randoms.

Fair enough, but I thinks it's factually correct to acknowledge that Streaming removes barriers in terms of hardware costs, no downloading, new game concepts, no cheating, continue playing on any device etc. It solves more problems than it creates.

The 1,000 BR example was one of the Google team's simple suggestions of a game that cannot be done on local hardware. There are numerous others.

I think the most startling thing for me is how consistently Stadia performance isn't up to par with a gaming PC's performance. This is bearing in mind that we're just 12 months away from the launch of a new generation of consoles too, to see its performance fail to meet muster with ease isn't reassuring either.

I'm guessing developers aren't bothering with optimising for Stadia's fixed specs and just lazy porting/running the PC version. Google needs more exclusives to help solve this.

The fact that the 4K stream of Red Dead isn't 4K says it all - it isn't rendered in 4K, it's 1080P upscaled and streamed at 4K - you have to ask at that point, why? Just have it stream at 1080P and be less heavy on the internet connection.

The downside with game streaming is it isn't passive - music, movies you can get away with bad connections because you're caching enough data for it not to matter unless things get really bad. Gaming is interactive, you can't buffer for that.

Tbf there are plenty of 'pretend 4K' games on Xbox One X and PS4 Pro. And I'm sure dynamic scaling and checkerboarding will still exist to some degree with their successors. RDR2 is 60fps @ 1080p. Something that home users (not on PC) can only dream about.

Whilst I agree with you, even now on dedicated gaming boxes we have lag and desync issues etc. with many online games. Streaming might have issues in these early days but with online games the current situation is often not perfect either.

[Neon Ignition]

Which underlines the issue. Casual audiences are the kinds of people who bought into the Wii or spend time Candy Crushing on their phones, they aren't going to give a damn about what Stadia offers. The key audience will be those already engaged in gaming actively and the question then is what does it offer them that they can't already get?

Founders with say RDR 2 will cost them knocking £180, I can order a PS4 with the game right now for the same price off Amazon and it won't stop working if the network disconnects, has resell value and plays the same. I don't have to download an initial update which is a plus with Stadia but that really isn't a problem putting off gamers, plus in 12 months PS5 will sort much of that issue with the game.

The one thing I was quietly bracing for was the potential that RDR2 was going to launch and be able to show off the features that are causing high end PC's issues with the game because of how Rockstar have over future proofed the port. No such risk it seems as the Stadia version will be the worst performance 'current' version in a year.

[Team Andromeda]

With xCloud you have to take a controller with you, which doesn't really make it convenient even without having to bring the console with you too and there are definitely issues with the screen size due to lack of optomisation. It'll be the same with Stadia on a small screen.

X Cloud is in the Beta and MS and 3rd parties are going to make accessories for the phone to be made in a controller and going forward its going to be compatible with a wide range of Android systems not just phone but Tablets (some are already)

So I don't get where you get the small screen brief from

[Team Andromeda]

Anyone who buys this, and posts on this board, should be whopped half senseless with a large slipper.

I've got mine (sorry Van) and I have to say it's not too bad. Its nowhere near what was promised, but it works and it's kind of impressive

[MartyG]

Fair enough, but I thinks it's factually correct to acknowledge that Streaming removes barriers in terms of hardware costs, no downloading, new game concepts, no cheating, continue playing on any device etc. It solves more problems than it creates.

On the flip side it removes any kind of modding (a big draw of PC gaming). The are some positives, but we'll have to agree to disagree that it solves more problems than it creates and if the overall experience is bad, it doesn't matter how many issue it solves.

[vanpeebles]

I've got mine (sorry Van) and I have to say it's not too bad. Its nowhere near what was promised, but it works and it's kind of impressive

Very disappointed in you. We will be sitting down, and having a long talk!

[Team Andromeda]

Very disappointed in you. We will be sitting down, and having a long talk!

LOL, you can get the pints in mind and we can also make fun of Pinny and Sunderland LOL

[vanpeebles]

LOL, you can get the pints in mind and we can also make fun of Pinny and Sunderland LOL

Sounds good!

[Digfox]

Which underlines the issue. Casual audiences are the kinds of people who bought into the Wii or spend time Candy Crushing on their phones, they aren't going to give a damn about what Stadia offers. The key audience will be those already engaged in gaming actively and the question then is what does it offer them that they can't already get?

Founders with say RDR 2 will cost them knocking £180, I can order a PS4 with the game right now for the same price off Amazon and it won't stop working if the network disconnects, has resell value and plays the same. I don't have to download an initial update which is a plus with Stadia but that really isn't a problem putting off gamers, plus in 12 months PS5 will sort much of that issue with the game.

Maybe but I think 150GB downloads (like RDR2) are a problem. I can certainly think of Wii or DS owning friends and family that never purchased newer consoles that would balk at that. Also a lot of games aren't offline anymore and therefore whether your internet connection cuts on Stadia, PC or a console the game isn't going to work in any case. Most gamers only play a game like COD or RDR2 for a few hours anyway (the trophy/achievement data often supports this) and this is probably very true of casuals.

On the flip side it removes any kind of modding (a big draw of PC gaming). The are some positives, but we'll have to agree to disagree that it solves more problems than it creates and if the overall experience is bad, it doesn't matter how many issue it solves.

Sure, modding is a benefit to a PC gamer albeit one that is declining (i.e. try and mod GTA Online or protected folders with Game Pass PC installs). But I think Stadia could certainly offer the same mods as consoles, i.e. Skyrim or Fallout 4. In that sense Stadia is closer to just being another console format.

[Brad]

Giant bomb say it’s the worst way to play games. Vs pc, Xbox or PS4. Low res, artifacting, lag etc. Basically doesn’t do what they said it would (negative latency lol) plus you have to buy the games still, at same price as on consoles basically and google could turn the platform off or ban you on a whim at any time.