Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Dune Prophecy & Messiah

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #91
    So, we saw Dune on Friday at the IMAX.



    This is difficult as I've read the book, played some of the games and seen the David Lynch film a number of times, so I know quite a lot about the material. Also saw the TV movie, though that has little bearing on all this as I barely remember it.

    I agree with something that was said above by [MENTION=2625]randombs[/MENTION]; the Lynch movie in my case was closer to how I pictured, for example, House Atreides, in my head. Opulent, wealthy; like Tsar-era Russia transplanted to the far future. Baroque, ostentatious, with architecture of dark marble interspersed with gold filigree.

    But this is someone else's vision and I think it's great; the sense of scale is enormous. Truly epic. And the characters feel more like real people, whereas the older movie was acted in a theatrical style, more like the biblical epics of the 50s.

    It was, however, truer to some of the themes of the original book. For instance, the Bene Gessirets in the original movie are portrayed as a religious order who are trying to create the messiah on Dune; in the book, they're a cold, clinical organisation who has seeded every planet with stories of a Messiah so where-ever it happens and where-ever they go, they are revered and worshipped. And the idea that Paul is afraid of his destiny, because he sees, if he gives in to the natural flow of events, that he will lead an army that will utterly destroy all humanity, burn away all remnants of it and leave him alone to dance in the ashes. In the Lynch film, as a remnant of Jorodowsky's original treatment, Paul is seen as more a Jesus figure, when in practice in the book he stands on a knife-edge between ushering in a new golden age for humanity and ensuring its destruction. The newer movie managed to carry these elements much more closely to the book.

    Also I'm keen to hear more from people who haven't seen/read it, because there were some elements that were really brushed over, like using the spice to fold space - which is actually really important to the story.


    (spoilers for the story of part 2 follow)

    Like, it didn't really go into any detail about the spacing guild navigators, and how they fold space.

    That's problematic because of a big part of what the Kwisatz Haderach is - they're a single human who is both a Navigator and a Bene Gessiret, and that's maybe going to either need explaining or be left a little "lite" in the 2nd movie.

    Comment


      #92
      Two points which I think tie in to what you've said and perhaps also explain why I struggled with the plot of the film:


      Spice - I got little sense as to why some dust would allow people to do something so advanced as space travel in that way. I got the idea of humans having limited their reliance on technology but the Spice thing just felt like a weird space dust cheat workaround. Like it allows one set of people to travel the gulf of space and other to... get blue eyes and live in caves.

      Paul - Honestly, I hated absolutely everything about the whole 'chosen one' thing about him. It felt like crap Harry Potter parcel tongue nonsense. I can ride with the idea of people believing a messiah figure and that he could be weighted by the thoughts of others expectations in him that he is that one but to actually have him effectively be space jesus always felt like an eye roll moment.

      But that's why I held off at first, it feels unfair to complain about those things when they aren't faults with the film. They come from the books and the books pre-date all of the things I've seen that feel similar to it.

      Comment


        #93
        Originally posted by Neon Ignition View Post
        Villeneuve, not that I've seen
        Nolan, TDKR and Tenet... I'm tempted to say Interstellar as well
        All good films.

        Comment


          #94
          Originally posted by Neon Ignition View Post
          Two points which I think tie in to what you've said and perhaps also explain why I struggled with the plot of the film:


          Spice - I got little sense as to why some dust would allow people to do something so advanced as space travel in that way. I got the idea of humans having limited their reliance on technology but the Spice thing just felt like a weird space dust cheat workaround. Like it allows one set of people to travel the gulf of space and other to... get blue eyes and live in caves.

          Paul - Honestly, I hated absolutely everything about the whole 'chosen one' thing about him. It felt like crap Harry Potter parcel tongue nonsense. I can ride with the idea of people believing a messiah figure and that he could be weighted by the thoughts of others expectations in him that he is that one but to actually have him effectively be space jesus always felt like an eye roll moment.

          But that's why I held off at first, it feels unfair to complain about those things when they aren't faults with the film. They come from the books and the books pre-date all of the things I've seen that feel similar to it.
          I actually really hated...


          How Paul at one point says he's "the one". Literally uses those words.

          I don't remember that in the book, and it's almost like they're embarrased of the term Kwisatz Haderach and don't want to use religious terms. Dune as a brand admittedly is a bit problematic because the characters believe in a religion that, as a foundation, is a mixture of several real-world religions.

          If they wanted an alternate term, they should've used the translation - "the shortening of the way".

          Also... Just realised, the film doesn't really show the spice other than floating in the desert (though that effect DID look cool). Melange, which is the name of the spice in the book, is literally a spice; you can put it in food. Paul eats a stick of it in the original movie.

          Comment


            #95
            Open it if it doesn’t display the full work of art:

            Comment


              #96
              I assumed the dudes in the convoy with orange gas in their helmets were meant to be Guild Navigators. The convoy visiting Caladan to sign Arrakis over to the Atreideses.

              Going back to the Lynch film, Princess Irulan explaining stuff at the beginning of the film was helpful. Maybe Villeseñor figured people would have a lot of time on their hands during lockdown to read the book

              Comment


                #97
                Legendary makes it official

                Comment


                  #98

                  Comment


                    #99
                    Quite easily the best news I've heard this week. Finally a sequel we all want .. no, need.

                    Comment


                      Denis Villeneuve’s “Dune” finally hit U.S. cinemas last week following a solid international run from late September. With nearly $300 million at the box-office, studios Legendary and Warner Bros. Pictures greenlit “Dune: Part Two” the other day which will shoot next year for a Fall 2023 release. Now in a new interview with THR, Villeneuve […]

                      Villeneuve says that he feels making Dune: Part Two so fast is something of a burden but that it's important it arrives as quickly as possible given it's the second half of a single film. He says that the second entry won't be released via streaming on release, he made that part of his contract when agreeing to make the next chapter. Beyond that he still likes the idea of adapting Dune: Messiah as a closing third entry and then beyond that is attracted to making large scale productions for the coming years.

                      Comment


                        First outing at the cinema since Bladerunner 2049. This was fantastic, it was somehow both massive in scale and tightly shot at the same time, as always with Villeneuve it was a masterclass in cinema photography.

                        Story wise it was as id expect it to be, could of done with extra exposition for newbies of the universe but that’s always going to be the case with something like Dune.

                        Can’t wait for the second part.

                        Comment


                          I just ordered The Art and Soul of Dune from Amazon JP.

                          They have an English copy for around £70 and 2-4 week shipping, whereas the Japanese one is £35 and arrives tomorrow. 50% cheaper and a good incentive to brush up on my reading skills

                          Hans Zimmer did a companion soundtrack for it, too:

                          Comment


                            Last edited by randombs; 17-02-2022, 00:03.

                            Comment


                              Having spent much of the first part setting up its universe, filmmaker Denis Villeneuve has already discussed how “Dune: Part Two” will allow him to go deeper and weirder. Speaking with Empire recently, he explained how he used the first movie to introduce Herbert’s complex universe to a broad public which also resulted in a […]

                              Part Two will focus more on House Harkonnen and some of the missing characters from the book. The film will begin filming by late summer.

                              Comment


                                Gimme, gimme now.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X