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United Kingdom VII: Taking Pride in Your Success

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    Originally posted by wakka View Post
    Yeah we still get to moan about it though. And we don’t have to qualify the moaning by saying, well, you know, to be fair on poor old Boris and Matt, Labour were at it too.
    I guess it particularly irks me that the Conservatives are lining the pockets of their associates during a pandemic, when an estimated 120K deaths have happened, where the contracts have resulted in sub-par equipment, delivered too late or sat rotting in containers.

    Quadrupling the cost of body bags seems a tad tasteless.

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      Politicians have always been corrupt, but they occasionally were forced to resign or be sacked. Now they can just do what they like.

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        It's important to understand why these things occur - it's stated above that "nothing is going to happen" - but that's because of the system, not because of the government; getting rid of Johnson at the next GE won't end Cronyism because Starmer would be at it just the same.

        What people should be saying is bad system - not bad government - fight for changing the right thing.

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          Hancock and co are smug pricks. Starmer seems to have some morals, at least.

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            Originally posted by MartyG View Post
            What people should be saying is bad system - not bad government - fight for changing the right thing.
            Starting off by banning the party whip, with a severe penalty for anyone who is caught doing it under the table.

            MPs are voted for by their constituents; they should be free to vote on issues in the manner their consitituents want.

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              Originally posted by Neon Ignition View Post
              https://www.theguardian.com/politics...087933c5fda795
              And despite the obvious facts of 2021, instructions from the Government and sheer common sense... EasyJet has seen a 6x increase in bookings to other countries for July onward.
              From 1 to 6 bookings.

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                The system is weak, but none of this would happen if we didn't have such a pathetic Prime Minister who daren't sack anyone, mostly because he wants to keep his corrupt buddies happy. If he derails the gravy train, he won't have as many pals to look after him after he inevitably gives up politics. He also knows that the public are stupid enough to be easily distracted, so he can just ride everything out.

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                  Originally posted by Hirst View Post
                  Politicians have always been corrupt, but they occasionally were forced to resign or be sacked. Now they can just do what they like.
                  It's this. Plus, when the like of Neil Ferguson felt compelled to quit for breaking lockdown, but when Cummings did it, he was praised by MPs for his heroic behaviour.

                  One rule for them.

                  As you say, now there appears to be no repercussions for abusing your position, so they're even more brazen in doing what they like.




                  Originally posted by MartyG View Post
                  It's important to understand why these things occur - it's stated above that "nothing is going to happen" - but that's because of the system, not because of the government; getting rid of Johnson at the next GE won't end Cronyism because Starmer would be at it just the same.

                  What people should be saying is bad system - not bad government - fight for changing the right thing.
                  Definitely disappointed in Starmer's role as the opposition (although part of that is the farce of PMQs allowing Johnson off the hook), but I don't think I can agree with the statement "Starmer would be at it just the same".

                  If he does, then it's because the current Government have paved the way with how to abuse the system, get away with it and now, no longer feel the need to apologise or resign.

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                    Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
                    Definitely disappointed in Starmer's role as the opposition (although part of that is the farce of PMQs allowing Johnson off the hook), but I don't think I can agree with the statement "Starmer would be at it just the same".
                    It may be a different person reading Kinky Matures Adult Photo Magazine, but both are still looking for a NSA arrangement

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                      Originally posted by MartyG View Post
                      Cronyism - both the Blair and Brown governments have awarded contacts to friends and donors - this is basically how government is setup to work, the bit the public see of MPs in the debating chamber makes up the sliver at the top of the iceberg - everything that gets done in Westminister is about greasing palms.

                      It's exceedingly naive for anyone to believe this is purely the reserve of Johnson's government.
                      I don't think anyone is naive about what has gone on before, but they seem to be ramping it up and becoming even more brazen with it. Between the theirs nothing we can do (yourselves) to the mass public that are distracted with clapping, pensioners walking round gardens and when they can book that easy jet holiday were obviously completely ****ed.

                      I really wish we would all wake up and realize that this is our money and work towards holding them to account we really do seem to forget that its our Tax that their getting fat off of.

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                        Of course cronyism is rife throughout previous governments too. The thing that makes this example particularly wretched, however, is that it involved public health with people surely dying as a result of urgent Covid-related contracts going to Tory friends and acquaintances who had no competence to deliver.

                        I agree with the sentiments above on accountability. The lack of it is the real problem here. The effectiveness of the social media lie machine, combined with utterly brazen disregard from politicians who are effectively scoring points now for who can be the most lawless, is depressing. I can't see a way out of it as it is an unprincipled approach that is likely to be attractive to any sitting government from now on. Why would you resign for wrongdoing/lawbreaking when there's literally no need?

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                          In the usual system, a (reluctant) tendering process exists to try and make cronyism difficult. In practice, it usually means everything gets outsourced to an underperforming “service provider” like Serco who will offer a cut-throat price and generally fail to deliver or that the tendering process itself will be manipulated to favour a particular firm. At the very least, it makes it less easy to award it to your mates.

                          In an emergency situation, we went around this process with an argument that speed was required. This should have meant we could get things like PPE more quickly by directly approaching (and being approached by) companies who had the necessary manufacturing capabilities to get it done. This is not what happened – there are numerous stories of UK manufacturing firms who were ready to go and just needed a nod, but were more-or-less blanked by the government. What actually happened is more-or-less anyone with the ear of a Tory MP said “yeah I reckon I could do that” and once given the OK would then start trying to procure/produce PPE from scratch regardless of knowledge, experience or capability. This meant that rather than British factories working round the clock to produce PPE to the correct specifications, we were left with chancers trying to do it with varying degrees of success – loads of it was junk and not fit for purpose, much of it took weeks to arrive from overseas. Regardless of whether anyone got paid, it exposed people to risks and inevitably caused deaths.

                          To put it bluntly, in a life-and-death situation we ignored the most capable people in favour of letting golfing buddies with zero/little experience in the sector have a go trying to source it off AliExpress for the potential of a nice little earner. Why anyone who isn’t already in their gang would vote for them is beyond me, they would throw anyone/anything under the bus if it made them a single pound richer. They are laughing at you.

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                            From 1764

                            They hang the man and flog the woman
                            That steal the goose from off the common,
                            But let the greater villain loose
                            that steals the common form the goose.

                            The law demands that we atone
                            when we take things we don't own,
                            but leaves the lords and lady's fine
                            who take the things that are yours and mine.

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                              The FDA has cleared the Johnson & Johnson single dose vaccine.


                              The Government has failed to deny reports that vaccination has slowed down due to stockpiling vaccine doses for delivering second doses

                              The Governments hotel quarantine system for new arrivals is in tatters as it emerges 99% of arrivals aren't attending it.

                              Oxford has begun studies into developing the AstraZeneca vaccine into pill or nasal spray form

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                                Williamson says that even in a utopian idealistic scenario there is zero chance that the announced roadmap for scaling down lockdown will be accelerated.

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