The "Let's not suck at Street Fighter' Thread

[Pikate]

Basically I'm trying to get to an "Okay" level at Super Street Fighter 4 and I'm learning a lot but the "Shoryuken" forum is just cryptic and a bit advanced for me and I know some of you here "invested" half your teen years in this series so I thought I'd try a few questions...

(For reference I'm pretty much playing exclusively with Sakura since she's fast, agile and I can pull off all her moves, Supers and Ultras fairly reliably.)

1. Online, what does the below mean? I know it's Battle Points and Player Points but "for dummies" what is the difference between them and what are the figures on the right? Are all 4 specific to each individual character?:

XXXPP / XXXX
XXXBP / XXXX

2. I get what an "Anti-Air" is and can pull Sakura's off but is that a trump card to any jumping kick and I'm just timing it wrong or is "Anti-Air" for when they just plain jump in?

3. Zangeif/El Fuente players always beat me by knocking me to ground once then flopping/dancing over me so I can't get to my feet and gradually just die, is there anything to combat/defend against that or is it just an unfair exploit?

4. I tried watching online replays of better Sakura players and noticed they do a ground LK or MK before launching into a Shunpukyaku or Shoryuken. Is that something I need to learn before I rank up to face better players or is it not that essential. I'm thinking I need to learn how to link moves together into combos but I can never time it right in "Trials" mode and it seems beyond my current ability, any tips for that?

5. What is an EX move? I thought they were holding down MK + MP but that's a Focus Attack? For Sakura it says EX moves are "armour breaking" does that mean they're indefensible? And how do I do it? It say's the same as a Shunpukyaku but with this input instead of a normal kick:


Is that press two buttons or rapidly press any kick button twice or both?

6. Would I be better playing as Makoto or Fei Long (Kato outfit!) rather than Sakura?

Any help or other tips not touched on would be greatly appreciated

[endo]

Just spotted this before I go to bed so I'll just answer a couple of quickies.

1. The BP/PP are battle points and player points, which you earn, on a per character basis, from playing online. You earn player points just for winning matches, but you only get battle points from winning ranked matches (think I got that the right way round). There are two sets of each type of points because one relates to vanilla Super SS IV and one relates to Arcade Edition.

2. Anti-airs aren't a magic tool against jumping kicks by any stretch. You should be looking to use them against jump-ins obviously, but that's only a really basic explanation-like most aspects of Street Fighter systems you really need to dig deep to get the most out of it. The best way to do that is play loads.

4. Combos aren't the be all and end all, particularly in this game. You'll need to get a grip on them for sure but it's really important to master the basic game: footsy, pokes, zoning and all that. Srk can be daunting but there are some great beginner guides on there.

5. EX moves, put simply, are a stronger version of a regular special move. Not all specials have an EX version, but when they do (shown in the move list), they're normally performed by doing the regular special move motion but pressing two kick or punch buttons instead of one.

[speedlolita]

XXXPP / XXXX is the amount of player points they have in total and their overall rank.
XXXBP / XXXX is the amount of battle points they have in total and their overall rank, or vice versa with the above.

An anti-air is a move that punishes an opponent for jumping. For Sakura you could use a shoryuken for example.

Block in the opposite direction that your brain tells you to block. You'll get used to it. That's called a cross up.

Good players are very unlikely to get hit by medium or heavy moves due to the amount of frames they take before hitting. Linking from a lower frame startup or from a little more range guarantees a connection. With Ryu for example I do a low medium into shoryuken which is fairly safe and pushes them away too, if the kick hits the shoryu is guaranteed to also.

An EX move is pressing two of the same kind of button, be it punch or kick. This will use two of your four ultra bars. So to do her EX shunpukyaku you'd do a reverse qc motion and press circle and R2.

I think Fei Long is considered the better in terms of character tiers but I like Makoto's game honestly. Her focus attack has silly range and she has some nice stuff to play with. For example you could begin a focus attack and if they come close to interrupt you could either dash out of the focus attack (double tap a direction) and do a command grab for example or release the focus attack at maybe level 2 to counter them. Sakura isn't a terribly easy character to use for a beginner but neither is Makoto. Fei Long would teach you a fairly good understand of SF as he's has a matter of fact approach, at least in my opinion.

[dataDave]

Research "bread and butter" combos for Sakura and take it from there. Those are the only combos you need.

Also, look into block strings, safe jumps, and tech throws.

[Mayhem]

Most of the stuff is covered here, but I'll chime in a bit. Sakura is fairly low powered and low stamina compared to many other characters, so you have to be technically better (imo) in order to do well with her compared to some others. Learning how to play as Ryu, aside from the specials, will make your Sakura play better. The whole crouch LK/MK thing to fireball is a spacing ploy that better players will use, but it isn't essential for you to go down this route to begin with.

Against El Fuerte and Zangief... with the latter, and probably the former, you'll most likely want to employ a "keep away" game. So use moves such as the fireball to space them away from you, even if they block, hey that's a little chip damage towards victory. If Zangief spins through, try to punish the frame delay at the end of the move with another fireball that hits just as the move ends. If he jumps over the fireball, use an anti air move to keep him away. If he uses Banishing Fist, dash back (double tap opposite direction to how you are facing) and throw another fireball.

Admittedly some of this is easier for me because I tend to play Sagat, and Sagat is built for nuking Zangief players. Obviously he struggles a little against some others, but he's a pretty reliable character with good solid moves and defence. If I lose, it's because the other player was better, and I rarely get whitewashed online.

[Asura]

This makes me think about how I haven't played SF4 for over a year. I really like what they did with Gen, though I never quite got the "tenpeat" achievement on 360.

[Geoff D]

3. Zangeif/El Fuente players always beat me by knocking me to ground once then flopping/dancing over me so I can't get to my feet and gradually just die, is there anything to combat/defend against that or is it just an unfair exploit?

Frustrating, yes, but not unfair - both Zangles & Fuerte's game relies on getting in, knocking you down & making sure you can't get away, so whoever you're playing is doing it right. The key is spacing - learning how close you have to get for your/their move to hit; it's trial & error, but once you work it out it becomes slightly easier. For example, I play as Bison - a fraction outside of Zangles' lariat range is where I want to be because my Roundhouse (heavy kick) beats it. The issue is when you play a good Gief who doesn't abuse lariat... It's a tough match up - if you get knocked down you're in the ****, so you need to get away; focus, dash, jump or prayer are your options to get out of grabbing range.

I'm thinking I need to learn how to link moves together into combos but I can never time it right in "Trials" mode and it seems beyond my current ability, any tips for that?

It's just timing - you're either pushing buttons too fast (most likely) or too slow; combos/links are pretty rhythmic, so take a breath and try slowing down a fraction. Bare in mind that the majority of the combos in the Trial are pretty useless in a match situation; as Dave says, search for Sakura's bread & butters - you want to learn 1 or 2 reliable combos that don't leave you too exposed and deal reasonable damage.

6. Would I be better playing as Makoto or Fei Long (Kato outfit!) rather than Sakura?

Makoto is an experts character as far as I'm concerned; very difficult to be effective with, but totally dominating in the right hands.

[k0pp0]

I'm up for scrapping on xbox live, and I'm pretty crap so happy be beaten around to get my game on.

[speedlolita]

Makoto is an experts character as far as I'm concerned; very difficult to be effective with, but totally dominating in the right hands.

She's nothing compared to her 3s iteration! Mimora's reflexes are nuts and a joy to watch.

[Geoff D]

She's nothing compared to her 3s iteration! Mimora's reflexes are nuts and a joy to watch.

Quite - but I'd say that makes her even more of a character for experts.

Having spent lunch mulling over Pikate's questions I keep coming back to the same thing - learn the basics; for attacking, find out what your best normal moves are before worrying about specials (which are your best normals to play keep away & so on) then find out what your best isolated specials are before worrying about combos. After that, find out what your best basic combos are as they'll be the ones you rely on the most.

For defence - learning to block (particularly cross ups). Sounds simple, but a solid basic foundation will stand any player in better staid than trying to learn 10-hits xx ultra.

[speedlolita]

Yeah I definitely agree that she isn't for a beginner.

Honestly, I'd recommend Ryu for a beginning player. I play him myself as my "main" so to speak because he's such a strong all rounder.

Air did a nice video that's kinda of out of date now but the fundamentals are there somewhat to give newer players an idea of how to think.

[Pikate]

Thanks guys, I already feel like a better player just reading those posts and having things click in my head. Will go back through and make a list of things to look up like "Tech Throws" etc.

Honestly, I'd recommend Ryu for a beginning player. I play him myself as my "main" so to speak because he's such a strong all rounder.

I did play through the Arcade Most first with a lot of characters and I definitely think "Shoto" characters are the easiest to get to grips with being based around Quarter Circle Forward/Backwards inputs I can pull off their Specials, Supers and Ultras pretty reliably, occasionally a Shoryuken (Dragon Punch?) will end up as an Hadoken but that's currently not too much of a issue. I get on better with Sakura than the other Shotos as she's faster, more agile and responsive so good for attacking/being proactive whereas Ryu etc can be a little more lumbering. I've also considered the 3rd Strikes as a main but:

Makoto doesn't seem to have as reliable/usable Supers and Ultras, and while she is certainly a stronger character and I probably had an easier time offline with her I did fall into the trap of just blocking then punishing openings with her vanilla Forward + HP x3 or her Dash Punch which I don't think is going to be anywhere near as successful online.

Ibuki I couldn't get on at all but some online are lethal with her so she may be worth another look.

Dudley in Arcade mode was like a bulldozer but felt limited without kicks.

Then as a Wildcard Fei Long has DAT KATO OUTFIT which may be worth adapting to his style for alone.

It's a dilemma for sure though, I really like Sakura and she feels natural to me but then the number of times I've lost online to stronger characters who just had a slither of health bar left makes me think I'd be better off with someone who can take a little more damage and hits a little harder even if I wasn't as skilled with them (i.e. Makoto).

[speedlolita]

Sakura isn't a character for someone who's learning the game I think. Ibuki is tricky to play, never had much luck with her but she has some crazy potential. Dudley isn't all that good compared to his 3s iteration, I wouldn't really consider it. Honestly, stick with a shoto or similar. Ryu hits way harder than Sakura.

[Charlie]

If it's any consolation, Pikate, you can't be worse than me. I've been playing videogames for almost 30 years, Street Fighter for over 20 years, and I'm completely **** at this game. A very sorry state of affairs.

I'm thinking of adopting my mate's philosophy who takes pleasure and pride in being really ****, he usually has a kill/death ratio of 1/25 in games like CoD but says he gets more pleasure in his rare kills than all their kills put together. Haha.

[Pikate]

I'll give Ryu a go later tonight then, maybe he's more suited to online than offline since online is more tactical. What about Yun/Yang? They seem to be popular online, it's hard to tell really as I was looking through achievements of people I've been matched with and they almost all had the "300 Fights" "100 Wins" achievements whereas I've only just got the "10 wins" and am 6 away from the "50 fights". (Currently 11 for 44 or 25% win-rate BUT some of those players were hovering around 2000 BP/PP since I didn't realise players my own level was an option straight away and was going into quick match)