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(Retro) What have you been playing this week? Vol.2

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    Originally posted by ZipZap View Post
    I've been playing SMB2 as well. After spending months playing Mario Maker 2 I've actually got quite into all the super difficult kaizo stages, but I'm not sure the SMB engine is quite up to it! Jumping off enemies in particular is a lot less graceful than on the newer games. The one thing I do like going back to the originals is that I don't have my thumb pressed on the run button all the time in the way I do with Mario Maker, where the standard jump has become largely pointless.

    I love the look of SMB3 Allstars. Because it's such a leap from the other three I think it benefits from the SNES make-over in a way the others don't.
    Yeah it can get a little trickly haha. It's renewed my interest in Mario Maker 2 actually and something I'm keeping an eye out for now.

    I started playing through Chocobo Racing via my PS3, just doing the story mode which is quite adorable. The game itself it very C-tire or even D-tier as far as kart racers go, and really wouldn't get a look in if it wasn't for the SE/FF characters.

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      Been playing through Street Fighter Alpha from the Anthology collection on the PS2, going through arcade with all the characters. Been enjoying it but the ps2 d-pad just cripples my thumb after 20 minutes, I’d forgotten how bad it was for 2D fighters, might have to start looking into getting an arcade stick for the PS2. Do you guys have any recommendations?

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          It's funny how time works. I remember thinking of the SNES as retro in the late 90s but still struggle to count the PS3/360 in that category today. I'm sure that wouldn't be a problem if I was 10 or 15 years younger.

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            Originally posted by Cepp View Post
            It's funny how time works. I remember thinking of the SNES as retro in the late 90s but still struggle to count the PS3/360 in that category today. I'm sure that wouldn't be a problem if I was 10 or 15 years younger.
            Same here, theres no way I consider 360 or PS3 retro. One reason could be due to the lack of a huge generational leap like we got from the jump to 3D graphics from 2D. Or simply because of the number of remasters or ports that have little in the way of improvements.

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              Originally posted by Ghost View Post
              Same here, theres no way I consider 360 or PS3 retro. One reason could be due to the lack of a huge generational leap like we got from the jump to 3D graphics from 2D. Or simply because of the number of remasters or ports that have little in the way of improvements.
              I do wonder how people that are say, 20 years old, view 360/PS3 graphics today.

              I think its mostly just age and the way we perceive time as we get older though. The PS3 launch wasn't that long ago in my minds eye.

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                Originally posted by Cepp View Post
                I do wonder how people that are say, 20 years old, view 360/PS3 graphics today.
                I guess they just see modern games as shinier, more impressive versions of what's gone before. The PS5 remake of Demon's Souls is a perfect example of how the older PS3 version looks rougher but is essentially the same game.

                It's not anything like the jump from 2D Zelda to Ocarina of Time. That felt pretty groundbreaking.

                I see a clear lineage from the PS1 to the PS5. Each PlayStation generation has refined the visuals etc... in all genres to make things easier on the eye and more impressive. At some point the PS6(and its rivals) will continue the refinement but won't be anything radically different to what's gone before.

                I see a clear connection between machines like the Atari 2600, Master System and SNES. 8 & 16-bit gaming have a lot in common, even if 16-bit machines offered a nice refinement in all areas over 8-bit. When the 32-bit generation began, I felt a clear shift away from what had gone before. I feel that modern machines can trace their roots back to that point in the mid '90s when 32-bit became a thing and developers really embraced creating 3D games. Modern machines -- and gaming culture in general -- have little in common with the 8 & 16-bit era.

                Of course, not everyone shares my point of view. Some just see gaming history in terms of generations. Supposedly we're now entering the 9th generation. So they would say because 7th generation gaming is pretty old, it can be termed 'retro'.
                Last edited by Leon Retro; 28-09-2020, 16:36.

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                  For me the Saturn/PlayStation is the last generation I consider to be retro, and I wouldn’t even count the N64 in that. It’s a pretty simple definition for me: 2D = retro. Yes the PlayStation was predominantly 3D but there was just enough 2D on the machine to make the cut. Stuff like the Dreamcast, although having 2D games, doesn’t really have any 2D hardware ergo that’s not retro either.

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                    So I’m still playing Record of Lodoss War for the Mega CD and have opened up quite a bit of the map now. The difficulty has shot right up now and the current battle I’m trying to conquer has enemies with 500 health that kill me in an instant. Furthermore it doesn’t let me move elsewhere on the world map so I’m guessing I either need to win this battle or at least trigger an action in it to progress.

                    I’d still been getting very frustrated by the weapons and accessories in shops not giving any information on what kind of stats upgrade they offer or even which character can equip them. Some items I’d purchase only to find none of my characters could equip them and consequently ended up selling them back for half price.

                    As I was going to bed last night, I thought to myself: I wonder if there are weapon stats in the manual? So I look and there it all is:



                    That’ll teach me not to RTFM in the future! I just figured being all in Japanese there wouldn’t be much point in me reading it, but like in the game all the weapons are or English origin and therefore in Katakana. There’s another page with spells that I also found useful.

                    Incidentally, for the Japanese speakers, is there any information in the above page on using the crossbow? I bought one and equipped Wood with it but I don’t seem to be able to use it in battle. I’ve gone back to equipping him with a Rapier +2 for now but want to try the crossbow.

                    Edit: I’ve just looked at the image and the crossbow isn’t even listed! Just short bow and longbow. There is one, I swear, it’s in Wood’s inventory right now! Bloody game.
                    Last edited by samanosuke; 28-09-2020, 20:29.

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                      Originally posted by samanosuke View Post
                      For me the Saturn/PlayStation is the last generation I consider to be retro,
                      The 8 & 16-bit era was very distinct for various reasons. Lo-res graphics, CRT screens, cartridges, digital controls, chip music, no internet so you had to get info from magazines.

                      That period could be labelled 'retro' 'vintage' 'classic'. I'd say the 32-bit generation was the start of modern gaming, so I wouldn't include it next to 8 & 16-bit.

                      I know that some people think young gamers would just label everyone that's old as 'retro', but I really think a kid could easily identify 8-bit gaming as clearly 'retro' next to a PS3 that's 12 years old. PS3 gaming is essentially the same as what we have now but not as refined.

                      I don't think the '10 year rule' of tech becoming 'retro' makes sense. It's too simplistic. There should be clear defining features that qualify something as 'retro' 'vintage' or 'classic'.

                      The 8 & 16-bit era was so different in many ways that it isn't merely 'old' but should be given a clear defining label that highlights how different it was. Machines like the GameCube, PS2, Wii, PS3 etc... are merely 'old'.
                      Last edited by Leon Retro; 29-09-2020, 16:53.

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                        Originally posted by Leon Retro View Post
                        The 8 & 16-bit era was very distinct for various reasons. Lo-res graphics, CRT screens, cartridges, digital controls, chip music, no internet so you had to get info from magazines.

                        That period could be labelled 'retro' 'vintage' 'classic'. I'd say the 32-bit generation was the start of modern gaming, so I wouldn't include it next to 8 & 16-bit.

                        I know that some people think young gamers would just label everyone that's old as 'retro', but I really think a kid could easily identify 8-bit gaming as clearly 'retro' next to a PS3 that's 12 years old. PS3 gaming is essentially the same as what we have now but not as refined.

                        I don't think the '10 year rule' of tech becoming 'retro' makes sense. It's too simplistic. There should be clear defining features that qualify something as 'retro' 'vintage' or 'classic'.

                        The 8 & 16-bit era was so different in many ways that it isn't merely 'old' but should be given a clear defining label that highlights how different it was. Machines like the GameCube, PS2, Wii, PS3 etc... are merely 'old' though.
                        I agree pretty much with what you said. Perhaps the 32-bit machines should be considered a crossover generation between retro and modern, especially the Saturn which may well have more 2D “retro” titles on it than 3D “modern” titles if counting the Japanese library.

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                          Originally posted by samanosuke View Post
                          I agree pretty much with what you said. Perhaps the 32-bit machines should be considered a crossover generation between retro and modern, especially the Saturn which may well have more 2D “retro” titles on it than 3D “modern” titles if counting the Japanese library.
                          The argument people have about the term "retro" is what it defines. Does it simply define anything that's 10+ years old? Does the very archaic 8 & 16-bit era of gaming perfectly encapsulate the term 'retro', or should that era be defined as 'vintage' or 'classic'?

                          In my mind, I think the term 'retro' should evoke a time when things were completely different. An era with clear defining features that everyone can recognise as being very different/old fashioned.

                          When you simply apply a '10 year rule' rule for the term 'retro', you end up with the PS4 being retro in 2023. Is it really going to be appropriate to label a game like Death Stranding as "retro gaming" in a couple of years? I don't even think a young kid would agree with that way of thinking.

                          So as much as I'm happy to define 'retro gaming' as being stuff from the 8 & 16-bit era, I know that other people don't agree with that point of view. They are happy to label anything that's merely old as "retro."

                          I think you have a point about the 32-bit era being a "crossover", when all the things that defined the 8 & 16-bit era gradually faded away and became a niche. You still had elements of the previous era, but the zeitgeist was very much focused on moving away from the past with things that would define a new modern era of gaming.

                          I'd say we're still in the new modern era of gaming that was put into motion around 1995. The cultural norms of modern gaming can trace their roots back to the 32-bit era. Things like widescreen televisions, analogue controls, internet gaming sites, disc-based media, red book audio etc... set the standards for modern era gaming. They're things that weren't the norm during the 8 & 16-bit era.

                          We still have retro style games on modern systems, but they don't define what is mainstream. No, they are simply a throwback to games from a bygone era that many people clearly recgonise as being distinctly "retro."
                          Last edited by Leon Retro; 29-09-2020, 17:23.

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                            After a certain point, the word 'retro' is just a term of convenience to avoid clumsy phrases like non-current-gen. I don't think anyone actually considers something like Resi 5 or Battlefield 4 actually retro, in the way that lava lamps or cassette Walkmans are.

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                              Been playing through lots of MSU-1 enhances SNES games this week. Found a different mix of Yoshi's Island which sounds absolutely smashing with CD style audio. Makes you wish the SNES got that CD add-on.
                              3DS FC (updated 2015): 0447-8108-3129

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                                I think anything standard definition 240p/480i can be used with the catch all term of retro.

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