The Star Wars Cinematic Universe

[Neon Ignition]

Which makes his now floating appearance in Solo all the more baffling to most

[Dogg Thang]

They’ll be quick enough to drop the cartoons when it suits them.

[Neon Ignition]

Suprised they're so slow, that live action remake money is still on the table...

[Paddy]

Concept art from Star Wars Episode IX: Duel of the Fates

I appreciate its just concept art but they should have gone down this road in the film with Rey having dark tendencies (not just certain abilities) and Kylo coming back to the light (tbh this was sort of covered over the last three films).

Its a shame they didn't go down the possible road if having Rey/Kylo cast aside the light/dark elements of the force and establish something new (that could have been quite interesting but Disney probably didn't want to rock the boat too much).

The films exist now for better or worse. Perhaps we'll get a future standalone film that's more mature and well-appreciated among audiences.

[Cassius_Smoke]

I appreciate its just concept art but they should have gone down this road in the film with Rey having dark tendencies (not just certain abilities) and Kylo coming back to the light (tbh this was sort of covered over the last three films).

Its a shame they didn't go down the possible road if having Rey/Kylo cast aside the light/dark elements of the force and establish something new (that could have been quite interesting but Disney probably didn't want to rock the boat too much).

The films exist now for better or worse. Perhaps we'll get a future standalone film that's more mature and well-appreciated among audiences.

Yeah it would have covered that 'balance' of the force the keep talking about. A mix of both light and dark combined.

[Dogg Thang]

The balance thing was always nonsense. The idea that Anakin brought balance, after being a career murderer, by throwing a guy to his death makes no sense.

Edit: should be noted that the balance thing was prequel nonsense introduced in the same film that gave us midichlorians.

[Asura]

The balance thing was always nonsense. The idea that Anakin brought balance, after being a career murderer, by throwing a guy to his death makes no sense.

Edit: should be noted that the balance thing was prequel nonsense introduced in the same film that gave us midichlorians.

Yeah; related but I'm often surprised how few people realise that Palpatine is also Anakin's "father".

[Dogg Thang]

Well that was nonsense too. I remember actually laughing out loud at the “there is no father” scene in Phantom Menace (full disclosure: I actually enjoyed most of the Phantom Menace ride the first time around).

[Cassius_Smoke]

Well that was nonsense too. I remember actually laughing out loud at the “there is no father” scene in Phantom Menace (full disclosure: I actually enjoyed most of the Phantom Menace ride the first time around).

The start of PM is good right up until JarJar is introduced. Then it goes to ****. It's not even just JarJar that ruins it, the plot just seem to spear off the rails completely at that point.

[Dogg Thang]

I don’t know. There is stuff I love in it, particularly the design, but even at the start the characters are so dry and lifeless. From actors who are capable of great performances. It’s just a bit stuffy or something. But yes, plot wise it pretty much goes tits up at that point and goes all over the place.

The weirdest thing for me revisiting it with hindsight is the gulf in subject matter and tone. Like Jar-Jar and fart jokes and cool pod racing on one hand and a plot about trade disputes and hideously dull council scenes on the other.

Nobody likes council scenes.

[Asura]

I don’t know. There is stuff I love in it, particularly the design, but even at the start the characters are so dry and lifeless. From actors who are capable of great performances. It’s just a bit stuffy or something. But yes, plot wise it pretty much goes tits up at that point and goes all over the place.

The weirdest thing for me revisiting it with hindsight is the gulf in subject matter and tone. Like Jar-Jar and fart jokes and cool pod racing on one hand and a plot about trade disputes and hideously dull council scenes on the other.

Nobody likes council scenes.

Weirdly though, something that hasn't had a lot of discussion is that we now have three, distinct trilogies, and how that affects your opinion of each.

While the prequels certainly had their problems (and I've never considered them worthy successors to the originals, though I liked a fair bit of Ep3), one thing which I would argue remains better about them in light of the new trilogy is that they were a pre-planned, three part story. Maybe not "Lucas had it all back in the 70s" (personally I've never believed that the prequels were much more than barebones notes pre-1997) but at least something that was planned out in advance.

The new trilogy really feels haphazard, and that's a shame. I think in part this is due to the Marvel movies, which weren't created with a trilogy mindset (even though some trilogies exist), and how that whole style has kinda fallen out of favour. Still, Disney should really have insisted that whatever they chose to do, they had a creative direction from day 1 and while changes could certainly be made, they should've stuck to it.

[Dogg Thang]

Definitely these new ones were haphazard. They’re all over the place really. The originals didn’t stick to a plan and generally films wouldn’t but at least having something to aim for initially makes a lot of sense, which Lucas had back in the day. I can’t give the prequels a free pass in that regard because the story was rubbish regardless in my opinion and one huge clanger in there in terms of planning was having to recast Anakin within the one trilogy. To me, that’s a failure. But you’re right that there was at least the feeling of a single path through that story. And yes, absolutely, the new films really have the hallmark of Abrams - set stuff up without having an idea of how you’ll ever pay it off. I’m willing to bet there were probably many plans for the trilogy along the way, Abrams aside, but not enough of any kind of solid framework to stick to and it shows.

[Cassius_Smoke]

I think when you look at all 9 films from a distance you'll see they are all a victim of misused potential. The designs and the over all universe is stunning. The idea of the force and 'space Samurai' is great.
But there is no cohesion even between films, let alone trilogies. The characters are either poorly written or don't have a direct path you can follow. Anakins descent in to the dark side is bad. We are talking about the origins of Darth Vader! Even Han solo serves no purpose in ROTJ.

[Asura]

Anakins descent in to the dark side is bad.

Admittedly this was probably the prequels' biggest failing. That moment where Anakin's mother dies, and he flips out and uses his powers to kill everyone in the town... With a better setup, and better acting, and well, better everything, that could've been one of the best "heel-face turns" in all of cinema. As it is, just like the Padme romance scenes, it just falls flat.

[Cassius_Smoke]

I've said it before, but there are 23 marvel films and most of them have well written characters, a cohesion between films and a path for all the characters you can, and want to, keep up with. You can see that everyone involved cared and had a level of input into the films. Why did the same company mistep with Star Wars?