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    Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
    This, right here, is my toughest challenge as a dad.

    You don't realise what a selfish prick you are until you have kids.

    My current issue is my phone addiction because I get minutes of me time when I hide between chores for a few moments.
    I'll dip into here, Facebook or Marvel Puzzle Quest because I can squeeze those in, rather than anything long.
    Consequently, when I do get time to do stuff when the kids are in bed, I'm still fiddling with my phone, because it's a habit.

    I don't want the kids' abiding memory of me is my head in the phone.

    I'm not one of those blokes who can happily abandon the missus for a weekend of football/golf/fishing, but I do miss the days when at the weekend I could put something on the telly that I want to watch for a couple of hours.
    This!

    I'm the same. My daughter is only 2 so I can't leave her for a moment. On odd occasions she will play on her own for a bit and I'll get my phone for some mental down time, but then I'm infinitely aware of how this looks to her.
    At the moment I do at least get some game time in once she's in bed, but I know this will change once baby number 2 arrives. My gaming days may well be numbered.
    I feel very selfish that I just want some alone time. I'd love just a weekend on my own.

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      Originally posted by Nico87 View Post
      On the sleep issue, I don't know how it is elsewhere but as a father here in Norway you get the first two weeks after birth off with full pay. You then get 12 weeks off with full pay whenever you want, but most guys take those 12 weeks after the mother is done with her 8 months off with full pay. It works out great sleep wise as there's no chance in hell that I'm up half the night when I have work, and we did the opposite when I had my 12 weeks off.

      First 8 months or so he might as well have been a crying pear to be honest. I felt guilty for not being there more mentally, but I just had a strange feeling for those 8 months, as if I didn't know what I was doing coupled with him being super attached to his mum. All her attention went to him obviously so maybe I didn't feel wanted? I also kept my gaming habits from before the birth, or thought I could have them cause I thought that could be perfectly combined. It got much better in his 9 month though and I really got that connection with him then. He's 2 and a half now and life is perfect - and I get to do whatever I want (well, almost) after 19:00 every night.

      Another thing, we never really put up the fight to make him go to sleep (in his own bed) again after midnight, so he sleeps in our bed from around midnight. I thought it'd drive me mad but I LOVE waking up to his face every morning and I get scared as hell when he's actually slept the night through in his own bed and he's not in our bed when I wake up. Wrecks the sex life a bit but plenty of time for that before midnight.
      Yeah, it's just two weeks here in the UK.

      Those early days are crazy tough for all the reasons you've stated. You didn't give birth, but your world has been flipped upside down too, but it's like your feelings are the last thing to be considered.

      Early gaming habits used to be playing until the midnight feed, then bed.

      Nowadays, it's bed at 8 for my son, but he faffs about, so we tell him to get ready earlier.
      Eventually he'll click that if he gets a wriggle on, he'll be able to have some more time doing fun stuff.

      As for the bed, we've always agreed the kids don't get to sleep with us. We just wouldn't get any sleep because they're such wriggler jigglers!

      Originally posted by Cassius_Smoke View Post
      This!

      I'm the same. My daughter is only 2 so I can't leave her for a moment. On odd occasions she will play on her own for a bit and I'll get my phone for some mental down time, but then I'm infinitely aware of how this looks to her.
      At the moment I do at least get some game time in once she's in bed, but I know this will change once baby number 2 arrives. My gaming days may well be numbered.
      I feel very selfish that I just want some alone time. I'd love just a weekend on my own.
      Glad it's not just me.

      People fail to mention just how boring it can be interacting with your kids.
      "Oh, you want to read Peppa Pig, again? No problem!"
      Another reason to glance into the mobile portal of distraction.

      My wife keeps talking about screen-free weekends and I think I might go insane.

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        Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
        As for the bed, we've always agreed the kids don't get to sleep with us. We just wouldn't get any sleep because they're such wriggler jigglers!
        When my first was just a few days old, I made the decision to kick her into her own room. The reason was that my wife wasn't sleeping - she was just watching her. I needed to put some distance between them. So we've always had our kids go to sleep in their own beds since then and they stay there and, man, all these years later I am so glad we did it that way because what little evening and night we have now has become so precious to me. As they get older, they stay up later and you get far fewer breaks and you just run out of any alone time at all. And some friends still have their kids in the bed at age 6 or 8 and they have long given up the battle to try to get them into their own beds and that's just going to get awkward when they are teenagers and bringing boyfriends or girlfriends back.

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          Became a dad on the 17th of December and I can relate with many of the replies here.

          Our baby boy is only one month old and he's very loud. He's not one of the quiet ones. Everyone says it will get better, we'll see

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            My cousin once said 'You give up your life to have life'. At the time it washed over me, but now I know its so true. Your life is changed in a way you can't possibly imagine once you have children. The life you had is no more, for the sake of creating new life.

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              My missus kept the babies in their moses basket beside her side of the bed for the couple of months (never, never in the bed) till you get past the point of worrying they might choke or lie on their face or something in the night. Then slide the basket into their bedroom till they start to fill it - then toddler bed without any covers etc. Now that SFJr1 is comfortably at an age where he could safely sleep in our bed with us it's something my missus tries to resist the obvious temptation of but only because it'd breed bad habits in him, he'd want our attention and mess about then struggle to go back in his own bed. I can understand the temptation but one of the worst mistakes couples make with kids is making the kids the centre of the marriage and having them with you 24/7 awake and asleep just wouldn't be good. That's just one component, with the idea of entertaining a third child in discussion currently we've had more and more discussions recently about the importance of maintaining time, space and boundaries for ourselves as individuals and a couple so never to tempt the fate of so many others who's marriage breaks down when the kids grow up.

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                Yeah, I can totally understand that thinking, SF. Getting into some real talk right here but my eldest is twelve tomorrow and I realised very recently that in a slow, creeping way for about a decade, my wife and I have basically become more like housemates than a couple. We're brilliant together and it's all so easy and still good now but we shifted into a different mode as parents and the focus went completely away from each other. It was a weird realisation. It's not a terrible thing or some kind of lightning strike to our relationship but definitely something that needs thought in terms of what we do about it. But what was an eye-opener was how it happened over a long period of time without realising it.

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                  Our boys are such a big part of our life (more-so than with most as we get little to no help with baby-sitting due to the fact my mother hates children) that I'm already dreading they day they move out. I just love having them around ... and something simple like getting a hug still makes my day.

                  It just feels like my wife and I are 95% mum and dad and 5% husband and wife ... and I hope we haven't lost anything by the time they leave and we have all that time together again.

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                    My wife and I have got into the habit of having a night away a few times a year.
                    Now, obviously that means having someone you can trust to look after the kids overnight, but if you can wangle it, it's amazing.
                    We like to visit Stratford-Upon-Avon as it's a nice town with some nice places to drink and eat.
                    I booked a surprise trip there in November and we mooched.

                    I can't remember the last time we mooched!

                    We had a drink in a bar and even went into an art gallery. We'd never risk that with two destructicons in tow, so it was lovely to do.

                    I've got a couple of trips planned for our anniversary and her birthday, but just a night away, enjoying a meal and each other's company is a real treat.

                    I can also really recommend The Marriage Course.
                    Now, full disclosure, it's run by the Church, but aside from a prayer at the end, it's not religious or preachy.
                    It's not aimed at people with a troubled marriage (it's not a Relate meeting) or about to get married (there's a similar marriage prep course), but people who just want some advice and suggestions on investing in your relationship.
                    They give the example of a professional sports person doing training sessions, rather than magically expecting to be perfect straight away.

                    We did it about ten years ago and still reference it and recommend it to others.
                    It's only seven sessions and if you want a longer lasting relationship, it's worth that comparatively small time investment.

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                      From the missus parents to people at work, if its not cheating during the marriage it seems to be people having their kids grow up and having the focus return to them as a couple only to realise over the last two decades of child rearing one or both of them have changed and they no longer have much chemistry or in common.

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                        Is there a course that will make it shorter?

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                          As an unmarried, childless person, this is one of the most interesting threads on the forum. It’s a serious no-bull**** zone. Having kids sometimes sounds great to me, sometimes appalling - but it’s fascinating to read all your views.

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                            Yeah. It’s a useful place to vent already.

                            Thanks to places like facebook, there seems to be this idyllic ether of parenthood that you have to experience - a nirvana of family bliss and life affirming wonder.

                            It’s bollocks. It’s sleepless nights, feeling permanently shagged out, being unable to do simple things without factoring-in an epic mission of planning and preparation, having zero ‘you’ time and feeling guilty for even wanting any, the fracturing of your bi-central relationship, and financial stresses. That’s just the tip of the iceberg and I’ve only had the little fat git for 2 weeks.

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                              At two weeks in Prinny you are 100% in the maelstrom of ****. I feel for you.
                              Its so hard for a man too because you feel utterly useless.
                              I know personally that I could help change nappies and stuff but I was basically just a glorified butler at that stage.
                              Plus, and I don't think this is talked about enough, you don't (or I didn't anyway) instantly form a bond with the baby. So I felt like I was giving my best and this little thing was just taking it all with nothing in return.
                              It's completely different now of course.

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                                Maybe because our daughter was in NICU for almost the first five weeks, it was a gradual and slowly more involving process to becoming and learning how to be a parent for the first time compared to some who have the birth, get kicked out of hospital a couple days later and then it’s fend for yourself. She’s now officially six weeks old, and we are still adjusting and tweaking our routines for her. As a prem, her lungs aren’t as developed yet still as a full size newborn, so her cries are not yet ear rattling. Her ****s are, mind heh. She’s still sleeping a lot, so we have both been able to find moments in between the feeding, burping, nappy changing, sterilising and cleaning to watch some TV, catch up with a few friends via messages, and the odd visitor. Sleep is... better for me than the missus, although as our body clocks are not in sync, it means one of us can take over and be okay while the other sleeps a bit. Due to her job, she always went to bed between 10-11 anyhow, and I’m usually up past midnight for starters. The real test will be once I go back to work from paternity leave (although I took an extra two weeks off) and have to get back up at the same times as before, but with less sleep as I’ve not been up until about 9 currently. Work is being supportive which is good, so I suspect maybe some work from home on some days so I don’t have to commute in. Completely can relate to the glorified butler part at times, as the missus is trying to breast feed still as much as possible, so I’m doing many of the other bits to facilitate it all.
                                Lie with passion and be forever damned...

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