Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Why microtransactions, IAPs and LootBoxes are here to stay thread

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
    I think I'd probably agree with that, tbh!
    Half-Life, Unreal Tournament, Quake 3: Arena, Kingpin, No One Lives Forever, Max Payne, Roller Coaster Tycoon, Jedi Knight III, Command & Conquer, Full Throttle, Red Alert, Diablo, Duke Nukem 3D, Grand Prix, Civ II, Riven, Age of Empires, Total Annihilation, Starcraft, Baldur's Gate, Commandos, Hidden & Dangerous, SimCity 3000, The Sims, Black & White and Return to Castle Wolfenstein!
    I don't disagree that the 1990's-(early)2000's weren't a great time for PC gamers. It was this more this wally was saying that was the only one 'golden' era and that I must be young or unaware of those games to make this statement. For me after the decline of PC gaming in the mid noughties when piracy, low sales and games not being released on the platform, the PC has returned to a period of strength. I think that there can be multiple great periods and the last 3 to 5 years has been a phenomenal time to be a PC gamer. [MENTION=345]Superman Falls[/MENTION] hits the nail on the head, in that the depth and breadth of PC gaming now is far greater than it was back then.

    However some of the things that have made modern PC gaming great are true of the consoles too, and this is why I used the example in response to [MENTION=5490]wakka[/MENTION]. I wouldn't want to miss out on some of the current great games. 2017 was full of classic game released on lots of formats.

    Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
    You're going to end up with a two-tier gaming experience where you can either play fairly basic Indie games or you can play polished big studio games, but accept there's an up-front cost, season pass, DLC, loot boxes and in-game purchases to add if you want anything other than a hobbled game that last for more than 3 months.
    In previous generations I would have bought far more games, including lots of the big releases. Where as now I'm spending more time and money but on fewer games. Where as in the past I would have lapped up games like Forza 7 (pardon the pun), SW:BF2 etc. I think even if a game has a business model that stinks you can still play it, I just try and choose carefully now.

    I also think it's not that black and white. There's stuff out there like Warframe or Elite Dangerous that are very polished and unique experiences that wouldn't have come out from an AAA publisher. There are multiple tiers of gaming available rather than simple indie or AAA.

    Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
    It's not going to happen.
    The genie is out of the bottle.
    Yeah, Star Wars BFII and Destiny 2 have less players, but they're not going to stop pushing their luck.
    I think politicians, and public bodies are increasingly becoming aware of these new business models and legislation and policy will catch-up, just perhaps not as fast as we want. PUBG with it's 'cash out' fits the very definition of gambling as recently defined by the UK Gambling Commission. Either way publishers and developers won't have this free reign to themselves forever but I agree lootboxes aren't going to just disappear when such huge sums of money are being made from them.

    Btw Destiny has sold more units and been more profitable than the first game, so even if more people have dropped it now, the recent outcry has little or no effect so far on Activision's sales.

    Originally posted by QualityChimp View Post
    Remember Forza 5? You had to grind for years or pay real cash, then everybody complained and they did a u-turn?
    Well here we are and EA and Bungie etc. are still trying to see how far we'll bend (over).
    Not sure if you missed my quote. I believe SW:BF2 will probably be EA's 'Forza 5 moment'. In future they'll simply withhold microtransactions until after the release such as Microsoft do with their games now.

    Originally posted by Asura View Post
    Certainly I see Bungie in a very different light now, since their staff departures and this whole thing over Destiny.

    There seemed to be something of an astroturf PR thing with Destiny 1 to try and thank Bungie for the good bits and blame ActiBlizz for the bad bits, but personally I think that was a ploy. Bungie made the decision to go to Activision of their own volition; it's not like they were naive enough to think that wouldn't affect their games.
    I said this on the old forum, but Bungie are massively constrained by that 10-year contract. I am convinced we will get cut and paste style efforts now in the series, mirroring Call of Duty with incremental gameplay built on the same techniques. I believe Bungie's hands were all over the decision to build the game around Eververse. If fact Activision probably weren't as close to the detail of how these systems would work. We still don't know the penalty that Bungie incurred when D2 was delivered a year late, but it was clearly in Bungie's own interests for the game to sell as well as possible. They aren't the only developer who seemingly isn't getting the fair share of the blame *cough* Turn 10 (amongst others).

    I regret buying D2 and almost certainly won't buy their games again unless something drastic changes.
    Last edited by Digfox; 11-01-2018, 15:17.

    Comment


      #17
      Who's looking forward to Anthem?

      Comment


        #18
        Originally posted by dataDave View Post
        Who's looking forward to Anthem?
        I'm sure EA were. Now I'm not so sure.

        Comment


          #19
          Interesting short opinion piece on how consumer rights on digital products needs to be updated:

          Comment


            #20
            Nothing new or surprising, but a recent survey found many developers aren't abandoning Lootboxes and don't see a problem with them:

            http://www.pcgamer.com/gdc-survey-in...nt-going-away/ (taken from ResetEra)

            The backlash against loot boxes was strong in 2017, but the results of a Game Developers Conference survey of more than 4500 developers who have attended a GDC event in the past three years strongly suggests that they're not going away anytime soon. 11 percent of developers who responded to the survey said they are currently working on a game that will monetize via the sale of "paid item crates," and some developers say they're necessary to ensure the continued stability of the industry.

            Comment


              #21
              I'd like to think Hellblade proved more about stabilising the future of the industry than Loot Boxes did. Publishers need to reduce the emphasis on AAAA projects and milking the teats of those titles as hard as they can. More lower budget, lower risk stuff than could potentially springboard new ip whilst at the same time reduce the amount of times companies take 5yrs+ to get a single product out the door.

              Comment


                #22
                I think there are developers and publishers out there that shun scummy business practices. However the big western publishers just don't care and are ultimately exploring every possible scheme to make more money. And they just love the 'uncapped donations' through Lootboxes.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Getting hard to keep up, but there are a number of governments and authorities proposing new rules or looking in more detail at Lootboxes. the Swedish Government is the latest: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articl...ox-controversy

                  I know on ResetEra there's been a number of these sorts of stories posted. Far too early to draw any conclusion but interesting to watch things develop.
                  Last edited by Digfox; 08-02-2018, 15:43.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Just bumped into this fantastic thread over at 'Era. GI.biz posted a story on the Hawaii proposed legislation in the US. The news item drew a few comments and someone has worked out that some of these are from a former EA employee who has gone full on defensive mode in the comments.

                    As you can imagine it's drawn quite a few responses; https://www.resetera.com/threads/muc...t-boxes.23759/

                    Comment


                      #25
                      It'll be interesting to see how the industry adapts if this stuff crosses over into mobile game territory as well.

                      I have little sympathy for console devs who are exploiting loot boxes to rip off their customers, because when I buy a game for £40 I expect it to be a game; not the base functionality and content necessary to get me to buy more stuff.

                      Mobile games have always been problematic though. Part of the reason the whole freemium thing with all the currencies sprung up is that mobile devs really tried selling low-cost premium games on the platform (Squaresoft, in particular, made a huge effort it, porting things like the PSP FF Tactics and various DS games like Final Fantasy IV, even having big new IPs for mobile like Chaos Rings) but the mobile consumers just would not buy them, no matter how cheap they were*. Consider how people were posting furiously on Twitter about how the developers of Monument Valley could be so greedy as to charge 1$ for the expansion. It was bizarre. People on mobile seem to think that 5$ is some kind of king's ransom.

                      (*in b4 someone says "but X-Com..." - it was one game, was 4 years ago, and was a fluke)

                      Consequently developers had to develop more and more ways to charge for games in little dribs and drabs, and the freemium model became the standard.

                      This change was consumer led. And people bitch about it; people do compain about the models, but they then don't go and buy the alternatives that exist (or at least, in some cases, they just didn't back when they did exist).

                      If loot boxes and other freemium mechanics are outlawed, we might see a proliferation of more premium titles on iOS, which I would honestly welcome.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        I want more mobile games like Horizon Chase. I love paying 2-10 for stuff like that. We should start a thread on the very best mobile games.

                        Was Chaos Rings any good? After FF13 I wouldn't pay $5 for something like PS4Pro-level FF15 (you'd have to pay me my hourly rate to play), let alone some mobile stuff I've not even heard about until now.
                        Last edited by dataDave; 17-02-2018, 04:20.

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by Asura View Post
                          It'll be interesting to see how the industry adapts if this stuff crosses over into mobile game territory as well...
                          Yea, who knows how things will change. I imagine it'll take national or regional changes for this stuff to truly take impact. Historically publishers and platform holders have a tendency to use loopholes (Blizzard in China etc.) or even ignore laws until a precedent is set (i.e. *cough* Valve and allowing users to re-sell their games etc.). I imagine we'll see a variety of things, such as fixed price Microtransactions and other business models become more popular, certainly for the smaller developers and publishers.

                          I would imagine if there are future laws enforced about lootboxes or microtransactions, then it will affect any platform irrespective of whether it's a PC, console, browser or mobile game. The bit which I think cannot be argued against is the exposure of this stuff to Children. And in this sense the ESRB or industry choosing to ignore this or even offer solutions will catch-up with them.

                          What struck me about the post and other recent articles is the way the industry is doubling down on the defensive side. Sure that's not a surprise but it's often quite alarming to see how much of a bubble these developers are in. Before the forum wipe I linked to a very cringy article speaking to developers about their reaction to SW:BF2. Their view of the incident was in an entirely different light. Again that's perhaps to be expected given the impact on their livelihoods, but even so it's interesting.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            At some point the law will catch up and we will see some changes, but it a case of when 1,5,10,15 years from now.

                            You have to ask some serious questions about someone willing to spend $60,000 on a CS:GO skin:
                            http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2018/01/31/someone-actually-spent-over-60000-on-a-counterstrike-weapon-skin.aspx

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by S3M View Post
                              At some point the law will catch up and we will see some changes, but it a case of when 1,5,10,15 years from now.

                              You have to ask some serious questions about someone willing to spend $60,000 on a CS:GO skin:
                              http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2018/01/31/someone-actually-spent-over-60000-on-a-counterstrike-weapon-skin.aspx
                              When asked about the criticisms of such massive transactions, he seemed unfazed.

                              “I didn’t originally get into this game solely for profit,” he says. “I just got very lucky a couple of times, and money is more valuable to different people. I’m very lucky in my financial state to where I can afford to buy these skins and it does not affect me.”
                              He originally bought the skin for $30k and later sold it for $60k.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by S3M View Post
                                You have to ask some serious questions about someone willing to spend $60,000 on a CS:GO skin:
                                http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2018/01/31/someone-actually-spent-over-60000-on-a-counterstrike-weapon-skin.aspx
                                You think so? I tend to think that something is worth what a person is willing to pay.

                                Like I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if I sold a game on eBay for $60k. I'd wonder how someone could spend that much, sure, but I'd be fine taking the money.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X