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Why microtransactions, IAPs and LootBoxes are here to stay thread

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    No, Peter, no...

    Games industry veteran Peter Moore does not view FIFA Ultimate Team card packs as gambling.Moore served as president of…

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      Casinos are clearly missing a trick - give a penny chew for every spin of the roulette table and it'll no longer be gambling - you always get something, right?

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        Let's fill one armed bandits with sweets and put them in schools. As long as its not money you win, and it always drops 1 or more sweets it's not gambling.

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          Sure pete, sure its not.

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            Originally posted by Cassius_Smoke View Post
            Let's fill one armed bandits with sweets and put them in schools. As long as its not money you win, and it always drops 1 or more sweets it's not gambling.
            If you give a Wham bar less than 1% of the time it'll be exactly the same odds as getting the TOTSSF from a gold pack in FUT - so definitely not gambling.

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              The examples that keep being touted such as cigarette cards and stickers are different as they are physical and still had value even if you didnt want them. You could trade them or stick them on someone's book in school. I say this without knowing if you can trade ultimate team players. Can you?

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                Not officially within the game, no.

                But it's a strawman argument anyway. Ultimately it's still a wager: A sum of money (the player's) put against someone else's (EA's) on the basis of the outcome of an unpredictable event (the contents of the loot box). At the base definition, it's a wager. The value of the (sur)prize is irrelevant.

                That said, if the contents have no worth, loot boxes should be entirely free and if the contents have no value, why do some items have lower odds of appearing? The very fact they do have differing odds gives the contents a relative value by virtue that some items are rarer than others.

                EA are being disingenuous at best and blatently BSing at worst, given the way the systems are implemented - to get people to continue to spend their purchased house chips on the hope they'll eventually win.
                Last edited by MartyG; 12-01-2021, 13:50.

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                  I think what Peter is also overlooking is that whilst he's happily enjoying a career that's benefitted due to overseeing the era UT was introduced he's also endorsing, it's also introducing the fundamentals behind gambling after you've already charged the individual £40 for the honour of even reaching the menu screen.

                  It's Corporate Greed: The Game. There's really no need for FIFA etc to be annual and whilst doing so also using these obviously dangerous business models either other than the fact they want money and they know full sodding well what it is. To be honest I'm not that surprised by his take either, there's always been a dominant strain of failing upwards by Moore.

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                    Love the fact that there getting away scott free with getting kids to waste their parents money on gambling. How much can we make a cheap and nasty game for before the laws are passed?

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                      Originally posted by fishbowlhead View Post
                      Love the fact that there getting away scott free with getting kids to waste their parents money on gambling. How much can we make a cheap and nasty game for before the laws are passed?
                      Honestly, while there are some kids doing that, it's really not the majority. Don't make the mistake of thinking that the majority doesn't come from people who spend the money, like it, and would honestly be pissed off if someone took it away.

                      That doesn't mean it's okay; the people who spend all day at Ladbrokes would be pissed off if Ladbrokes closed. Just Ladbrokes and gambling websites aren't propped up kids and neither is EA.

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                        I think your grossly underestimating the amount of cash kids are wasting on fifa, by a country mile.

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                          Yes, its a lot. But not as much as they waste on fortnite skins.

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                            The big difference between fortnite skins and FIFA ultimate team packs is with fortnite you know what you get when buy the skins, with FIFA it’s just pot luck what you get. Don’t get me wrong some of the fortnite skins cost stupid amounts, the amount my nephew has spent is crazy, I’ve tried many times to explain what a waste of money they are but he won’t listen, but it’s still better than gambling away £10’s/£100’s on pure chance and with the odds being so bad you won’t get anything you want. The biggest con is you have to start over each year, this is probably the worst part of it.

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                              It's obvious why devs are been as obtuse as possible and playing it down as much as they to make it not look like gambling because once they get regulated there's no going back and the obscene amount of money they make will be lost as they will no longer be able to prey on kids anymore.

                              Maybe they should do it Nintendo style

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                                Originally posted by gambit6613 View Post
                                The big difference between fortnite skins and FIFA ultimate team packs is with fortnite you know what you get when buy the skins, with FIFA it’s just pot luck what you get. Don’t get me wrong some of the fortnite skins cost stupid amounts, the amount my nephew has spent is crazy, I’ve tried many times to explain what a waste of money they are but he won’t listen, but it’s still better than gambling away £10’s/£100’s on pure chance and with the odds being so bad you won’t get anything you want. The biggest con is you have to start over each year, this is probably the worst part of it.
                                It's just about as predatory though - based on the fear of missing out - they put these skins up for "limited availability" they've artificially introduced, stuck a "R@RE!1!" label on it and jacked the price up. Add a bit of peer pressure and profit.

                                Epic certainly don't deserve any credit for making it a little bit less scummy than lootboxes.

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