The Scottish Referendum III: If At First You Don't Secede

[nakamura]

Yeah that is what I have been seeing recently. Shame, I would love Scotland to go it alone and be a success.

[Neon Ignition]

I think it's just a case of burn out. After the first vote, Brexit and then the pandemic a move to independence would be another uncertain upending of the table and people's thirst is just tapped out. Trouble for the SNP is it's their main ticket, if they don't pursue it then they're failing their own members but if they do they risk a lot.

I assume that's why Johnson has dialled down his opposition. If the SNP have their vote and it fails to secure Independence again the SNP won't be able to push for it again possibly within his lifetime.

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/20/snp-and-scottish-greens-expected-to-confirm-power-sharing-deal

<insert not sure this will go how you think it will gif>

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/sturgeon-s-independence-blow-after-no-enthusiasm-in-france-goes-against-our-ambitions/ar-AAOD4nD?ocid=spartan-ntp-feeds

It's said that a narrow majority of Scots side with Westminster over the SNP in believing that Scotland should not proceed with an Independence Referendum unless the UK Government permits one to take place.

[fishbowlhead]

Good. Now everyone shut up about it. Dead, done with.

[Asura]

Good. Now everyone shut up about it. Dead, done with.

Honestly, they really should. I mean, the SNP can't, because it's kinda their raison d'etre, but I mean more that Brexit must show them that even if they win via 50.4% of the vote, that's not a good thing. Splitting the electortate of a country isn't a good thing. They should hold off until such time as they believe there's an overhelming desire for independence.

[Neon Ignition]

If they do get it and it fails a second time it'd be interesting to see how they approach that scenario as the SNP being in a position where it they pretty much literally can't even properly discuss independence as a realistic consideration is a bit like the Green Party being barred from pushing for green initiatives

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/court-ruling-could-torpedo-nicola-sturgeon-s-plans-for-second-scottish-independence-referendum/ar-AAPcKsv?ocid=spartan-dhp-feeds

A new court ruling could threaten efforts to hold a second referendum

[wheelaa]

I think you underestimate the ferocity of hatred the SNP have towards the English.

If they can happily neglect education, health, policing etc throughout their tenure, while continually pushing the leave agenda - heck, they've even continued the push during a sodding pandemic - then overstepping the mark with, what ultimately is a couple of phrases that were only included for political purposes /tension in the first place, is nothing.

Don't forget, so desperate are they to wave goodbye to us English heathens, they produced one of the most lie-ridden, speculative political documents ever seen, as full of idiocy and deceit, as it was light on actual facts (their 2014 plan).

A political party lieing to its populace to push an agenda is not just a south of the border problem.

PS - Neither is a political party helmed by a sex-pest a south of the border only issue...

[Asura]

I think you underestimate the ferocity of hatred the SNP have towards the English.

If they can happily neglect education, health, policing etc throughout their tenure, while continually pushing the leave agenda - heck, they've even continued the push during a sodding pandemic - then overstepping the mark with, what ultimately is a couple of phrases that were only included for political purposes /tension in the first place, is nothing.

I mean, as an English person, criticising this would be a pots-and-kettles situation. Brexit had the same problem; one side of the vote is ideology for ideology's sake, and the other was more about pragmatism (with some ideology, admittedly).

The Scottish independence movement is similar; there's a decent wedge of the Scottish population who would vote for independence even if, as a side-effect, it was guaranteed that a third of the population would instantly drop dead the moment the vote went through. They want it for ideological reasons irrespective of what it means.

[wheelaa]

I don't disagree.

It's all quite amusing really.

Although I feel sorry that as a nation this will be hanging over heads until the 'correct' outcome is voted for.

[CMcK]

I think you underestimate the ferocity of hatred the SNP have towards the English.

If they can happily neglect education, health, policing etc throughout their tenure, while continually pushing the leave agenda - heck, they've even continued the push during a sodding pandemic - then overstepping the mark with, what ultimately is a couple of phrases that were only included for political purposes /tension in the first place, is nothing.

Don't forget, so desperate are they to wave goodbye to us English heathens, they produced one of the most lie-ridden, speculative political documents ever seen, as full of idiocy and deceit, as it was light on actual facts (their 2014 plan).

A political party lieing to its populace to push an agenda is not just a south of the border problem.

PS - Neither is a political party helmed by a sex-pest a south of the border only issue...

There is so much wrong with the above post it’s not even funny. Or worth correcting.

[Neon Ignition]

Nicola Sturgeon plans to relaunch campaign for Scottish independence | Metro News
Sturgeon is today making a renewed push for a Scottish Independence referendum.

I get it's their 'thing' but it feels like they're now aiming for the worst timing possible

[Asura]

I get it's their 'thing' but it feels like they're now aiming for the worst timing possible

Brexit shows though that if they make it about ideology, they could win. People seemingly will vote for that above other causes.

[Neon Ignition]

True, god help them if they do though. The economics were bad the first time around. Trying to go solo, outside the UK, outside the EU, during a cost of living crisis... they'd be out but I doubt they'd recover from the damage.