America III: Going Deutsche

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2019/oct/15/trump-news-today-live-elizabeth-warren-turkey-syria-democrats-impeachment-latest

-Mike Pence says he won't comply with House requests for documents
-A Grand Jury has subpoenaed former congressman Pete Sessions relating to an investigation into Rudy Giulliani
-A federal judge has overturned healthcare protections for trans people
-Giulliani has failed to adhere to a subpoena requiring him to deliver documents relating to the Impeachment Inquiry
-The next Democrat Nominee Debate is about to start just as it emerges Elizabeth Warren is nudging ahead of Joe Biden as nominee front runner

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/oct/15/harry-dunn-parents-trump-white-house-anne-sacoolas

The parents of the murdered teenage boy, killed by the wife of a US diplomat in a road crash before she fled to the US, arrived at the White House yesterday following an invitation by Donald Trump. This is on the back of outcries that the woman in question claimed diplomatic immunity to escape accountability. Trump pretty much used the occasion for his own amusement though by meeting with the grieving parents and then surprising them, Cilla Black style, with the reveal that the woman who killed their son was in the next room for them to meet.

The couple turned down the offer stating it wasn't appropriate given no therapist or mediator was present and they wanted to meet her in the UK where she could answer for the incident. This was Trump's opening for his second surprise that he'd dragged them halfway across the world just to see their faces as he told them - they won't be sending the woman back to the UK.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/oct/15/democratic-debate-joe-biden-elizabeth-warren-bernie-sanders

And how do you know when you're becoming frontrunner? When the opposition all turn to try and knock you when previously they didn't care much. Warren got most of the debate screen time because her rivals couldn't leave her alone, suggestions are she weathered it well.

[MartyG]

Let's not get carried away. Murder requires premeditation and is something The Sun and The Mail would print.

The US is unlikely to give up diplomatic immunity and the UK is unlikely to force this issue, mostly because diplomatic immunity works both ways and protects all our diplomats (spies) in the US too. If the US gave her up, behind the scenes the UK would be giving something back quid pro quo.

[QualityChimp]

The problem is that this is a clear abuse of that protection and she also lied about leaving the country.

I saw this one documentary about a guy abusing his diplomatic immunity and it only got revoked when he got shot.

[MartyG]

That's not how it works though, diplomatic immunity protects diplomats and their families from all prosecution as laid out in the Vienna Convention, it's up to the diplomat's home country to waive that immunity and it's rarely done. The last time the US did so was in WW2.

[Dogg Thang]

I saw this one documentary about a guy abusing his diplomatic immunity and it only got revoked when he got shot.

I also saw that documentary and I still think people learned very little about doing toilet checks.

[QualityChimp]

That's not how it works though, diplomatic immunity protects diplomats and their families from all prosecution as laid out in the Vienna Convention, it's up to the diplomat's home country to waive that immunity and it's rarely done. The last time the US did so was in WW2.

You're absolutely correct and it's important to maintain, but she chose to leave the country and not account for her actions.

I think it's the difference between legally right and morally right, Marty.
Nobody else could get away with something like that, even footballers with good lawyers.

Fair play to the couple for refusing to see her and not play along with Trump's little game.

[MartyG]

When it comes to spooks and their operations, morality goes out of the window I'm afraid. Sadly for the Dunns, the protection of diplomats (spies) internationally outways the death of a lad on his motorcycle. The problem is no country wants to waive that right because of the issues that would cause down the line.

Even if she remained in the country, she still couldn't be prosecuted under the Vienna Convention - individuals cannot waive their own immunity, this can only be done by the home country.

[QualityChimp]

It's getting to the point where it feels like politicians can say, tweet and do whatever they like with no repercussions.

[Lebowski]

It's getting to the point where it feels like politicians can say, tweet and do whatever they like with no repercussions.

getting too!!! they sped past that in a stolen car flicking the Vs a long long time ago.

the majority response seems to be "oh that rascal look at him in his stolen car he tells it like it is"

[Cassius_Smoke]

It really feels like we've over turned a rock, seen the horrible squirming madness underneath and just welcomed it in to our lives.

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2019/oct/16/trump-news-today-live-elizabeth-warren-bernie-sanders-impeachment-latest

The House has voted largely in favour of condemning Trump's decision to leave Syria, a move that Trump hours early referred to as strategically brilliant, those voting against Trump including 60 Republicans.

And new tax records of Trump's relating to two properties have shown major discrepancies between the figures Trump told lenders and what he told tax authorities

[Colin]

Fabricated.

[Brad]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...achment-latest

The House has voted largely in favour of condemning Trump's decision to leave Syria, a move that Trump hours early referred to as strategically brilliant, those voting against Trump including 60 Republicans.

And new tax records of Trump's relating to two properties have shown major discrepancies between the figures Trump told lenders and what he told tax authorities

Someone needs to send in Gerard Butler.

[QualityChimp]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/10/21/want-trump-removed-new-data-shows-that-fox-news-is-huge-obstacle/

Want Trump removed? New data shows Fox News is a huge obstacle.
"A new study just out from the Public Religion Research Institute sheds light on this dynamic in a remarkable way: It shows that rank-and-file Republicans who watch Fox are far more loyal to Trump than those who do not.


The poll, which surveyed more than 2,000 Americans, finds that an astonishing 55 percent of Republicans who watch Fox News as their primary news source say there is almost nothing Trump could do to lose their approval. By contrast, only 29 percent of Republicans who don’t cite Fox as their primary source say this."