America III: Going Deutsche

[Neon Ignition]

So presumably there's zero chance he won't claim victory on Nov 03, the question left is how long it's all allowed to drag out. Honestly, next time the Democrats are in power they need to not mess around fixing this nonsense.

[MartyG]

He's definitely laying the ground work to try and contest the result - it needs to be a substantial victory for Biden for the Trump executive not to try it on.

I recommend giving that podcast of Seth Abramson I linked above a listen for in-depth coverage of this play.

[Neon Ignition]

30 mins into the podcast and it sounds like Republicans have a route to a dictatorship - jesus America is broken.

[Neon Ignition]

Just finished it - so, basically an unlikely immense landslide for Biden or Trump will stay and have completely broken the system once and for all?

[Asura]

Just finished it - so, basically an unlikely immense landslide for Biden or Trump will stay and have completely broken the system once and for all?

.... because that's what Jesus wants.

[Cassius_Smoke]

Just finished it - so, basically an unlikely immense landslide for Biden or Trump will stay and have completely broken the system once and for all?

What was said that led you to believe USA is going to become USSR?

[Lebowski]

30 mins into the podcast and it sounds like Republicans have a route to a dictatorship - jesus America is broken.

Just finished it myself and they make a massivley compeliing argument on how this will all play out, there seems to be no way out now from 4 more years of trump

how broken is America at present that you have a situation where someone is going to loose but has a path to victory by doubling down on disinformation and lies, its crazy they can then use this misinformation to engineer a trial where their in charge of the outcome.

[Neon Ignition]

That's the thing, the scenario that they're talking about is the one playing out by Trump at the moment and what's stark is that there seems to be no real path to blocking it. I think there's a part in the podcast where the presenter asks the other guy what can be done to block it and he doesn't really offer anything up. It sounds like the impeachment thing where its the lack of will of predecessors to so brazenly use the tactic that has kept things in check but Trump doesn't care and will exploit a blatantly open loophole. Even with a landslide Trump is creating enough false narrative about voting fraud that it still seems an open goal and Democrats are always like Labour, toothless.

[Dogg Thang]

Considered rationality stands little chance against loud angry lies, unfortunately. And any attempt at centrism only serves to enable the extremes of the power structure. It's up to the people now to vote in such numbers that there can be no dispute no matter how many votes are stolen or discounted.

[Lebowski]

That's the thing, the scenario that they're talking about is the one playing out by Trump at the moment and what's stark is that there seems to be no real path to blocking it. I think there's a part in the podcast where the presenter asks the other guy what can be done to block it and he doesn't really offer anything up. It sounds like the impeachment thing where its the lack of will of predecessors to so brazenly use the tactic that has kept things in check but Trump doesn't care and will exploit a blatantly open loophole. Even with a landslide Trump is creating enough false narrative about voting fraud that it still seems an open goal and Democrats are always like Labour, toothless.

makes you really loose faith in the system, It's a pretty poor that its the norm that rigged elections, voter suppression, and misinformation for most Democracy's now. Id include the uk in this too. you shouldn't be able to constantly change voter boundary's to tip results in your favor! and their should be consequences if your found to have been ignoring and covering up that other countries have been interfering with our elections and the Brexit vote.

Any sort of dishonesty and active involvement in the suppression of truth should be enough to get you removed from a position of power. It's gone to far the other way now, in a democracy where supposed to be represented by those we elect not actively lied to by them so they can line there pockets.

[MartyG]

Considered rationality stands little chance against loud angry lies, unfortunately. And any attempt at centrism only serves to enable the extremes of the power structure. It's up to the people now to vote in such numbers that there can be no dispute no matter how many votes are stolen or discounted.

It's the people that will scare Republican senators. I'm fairly certain they don't actually like Trump (they actively tried to stop his nomination as the presidential candidate in 2016) - the scenario Seth Abramson played out does need a lot of cards to fall the right way: the votes, congress, the supreme court, the media, the people.

Mitch McConnell now has the stacked supreme court he's been playing the long game for he can dump Trump now - subverting the election in this way might be a step too far even for a number of Republican senators given it would pose serious long term risks to the union and US democracy, not just in the eyes of US citizens but in the larger world too.

Whilst the scenario is possible, I don't think it's likely to carry large support outside of Trump's inner circle.

I think it's far more likely Trump will just have a big hissy fit on Twitter to an orchestra of tiny violins - we don't have to wait much longer to find out.

[Neon Ignition]

I'm not even sure what the original thinking for some aspects of the system were. Take the Senate Court, lifetime appointments make no sense and neither does any party being allowed to hold a majority of seats especially with such a rule in place. It's an open door to corruption.

Won't the threat of Biden stacking the court lead to heightened Republican support to protect that element?

[MartyG]

Not to the point where it could be detrimental to the US as a democratic nation - there'd likely be some backroom dealing going on House of Cards style - we won't stack the court if it behaves sort of thing.

Anything seems possible in the US at the moment, but I'd like to think that there are enough Republicans still left that are more loyal to the US than they are to Trump.

[Neon Ignition]

Hopefully, I haven't even been there in 8 years and the thought of Trump for another 4 years is beyond coping levels. It's painful that he enjoys the level of support he does, especially given how quick people are to pull up old Presidents on both sides as bad who pale in comparison.

[Dogg Thang]

I feel like the best we can hope for is not Republicans loyal to the US but Republicans loyal to their own self-interest that they see Trump going down and don’t want to go down with him. If they really feel those cracks, and maybe some are already, I think a huge amount of them will abandon him which then only widens those cracks and increases the chances of Trump going down.