Europe IV: The Final Hour

[Neon Ignition]

And with nearly 10 years of having their hands tied by coalitions and minority numbers imagine the free for all they'll pursue now

[charlesr]

I have not fact checked this cos at work on my lunch, but read that:
Labour: 50K votes per seat
Conservatives: 38K votes per seat
And that Labour got way more votes than they did when they won outright in 2005.

[Neon Ignition]

Probably why the Tories keep trying to rig constituency lines

[Asura]

I have not fact checked this cos at work on my lunch, but read that:
Labour: 50K votes per seat
Conservatives: 38K votes per seat
And that Labour got way more votes than they did when they won outright in 2005.

Unfortunately though, none of this matters. The Labour leader can't lose, then fold their arms and be content that they were the better person, or that the system is broken. They can fix those things, but only if they win!

[charlesr]

Greens got 800,000 and SNP only got 1.5x that. But greens got one seat and SNP got 48

[Asura]

Greens got 800,000 and SNP only got 1.5x that. But greens got one seat and SNP got 48

I'm not debating whether the system's broken; it's totally broken.

But at the same time, you might dislike one of the rules of Monopoly, but if you rock up to a Monopoly tournament, you can't play with a losing strategy that would win if the rules were fairer, and claim you should be the winner. You go home a loser, and it's even even worse if it's the third tournament you've attended with that approach.

The day after a lost election is not the time to complain that the system is unfair; it's to work out how, next time, you're going to game the **** out of it, wrap its rules around your little finger, cheat, beg, steal, bribe the judges, play as a boss character, pick an OP item and approach polling day with a poker hand of five aces.

Then, once you're in power, you can try to fix things... But this election has proven that trying to be honest and appeal to the good nature of people is not the solution. You need to lie and appeal to the "haves", because evidently they get to choose what happens.

This is also why I feel I'm done with politics, because saying that stuff above makes me almost ill. I think I've finally turned that corner and any idealism I once had is totally gone.

I thought we were better than this.

[Cassius_Smoke]

Can we think of any positives from the election result?

[Zaki]

Willowdapeeple!

#wank

[Cepp]

Giving up is what they want Asura. Step away for a bit but don't permanently disengage, your country and people need you.

This is a low point for sure, but it's not the end.

[Cepp]

Can we think of any positives from the election result?

Jo Swinson lost her seat? That's about it. You could move to Scotland since they're gearing up for a second indy vote.

[MartyG]

I'm not debating whether the system's broken; it's totally broken.

But at the same time, you might dislike one of the rules of Monopoly, but if you rock up to a Monopoly tournament, you can't play with a losing strategy that would win if the rules were fairer, and claim you should be the winner. You go home a loser, and it's even even worse if it's the third tournament you've attended with that approach.

Agreed, you can't look at it based on the current seat boundaries - it's just a way of denying the result. The Tories still got a substantially greater proportion of the populate vote, about 4 million more votes than Labour, so under PR, Labour's seat count would have changed very little to what it is. The Tories would have gotten less, but the swings would have been to LibDems mostly.

[Neon Ignition]

Biggest perk has to be that amazing, world class, staggeringly perfect trade deal we're about to get with the US! Right?!... err, guys?... hello...?

[vanpeebles]

If we get cheap v8's then I'm all for it

[S3M]

I have not fact checked this cos at work on my lunch, but read that:
Labour: 50K votes per seat
Conservatives: 38K votes per seat
And that Labour got way more votes than they did when they won outright in 2005.

Yep all true 2005 results: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_U...neral_election (The Tories only got 8 million back then)

Today's results, scroll down for full vote numbers.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2019/dec/12/uk-general-election-2019-full-results-live-labour-conservatives-tories

First past the post has had it's days, if you tally Labour, LD, SNP and Greens as the remain votes then it is also higher than the leave vote Tory and Exit party.

Not good signs, as it looks like the country is being dragged in a direction it doesn't want to go. The chance of Civil War 2 seems to be growing by the day.

[MartyG]

First past the post has had it's days, if you tally Labour, LD, SNP and Greens as the remain votes then it is also higher than the leave vote Tory and Exit party.

LibDems were not going to back Labour and Labour isn't a remain party, so they still wouldn't have had enough seats to form a government even under PR.



Without LibDems, the most seats under PR that Labour would have been able to coalition together is 267 compared to 305 for the Tories.