The Treasure Interview

[gizmo1990]

So why are they being so cautious when it comes to proper next-gen 2D titles. I would been far more excited if they had made a hi-res beautiful sequel to one of their heroes games rather than putting them on the GBA.

Because their not stupid?

Seriously, to even consider making a 'high res' 2D game would require enormous resources that even bigger companies would shy away from. Not to mention the fact that 2D is now seen as old hat by the mainstream.

[Ady]

the GBA market is all about licensed titles these days!

So is the console market...

[muddy]

from a business perspective (speaking as somone who has run his own business for the last 3.4 yrs) what he says about choosing platforms and making games that won't take massive amounts of time to do the hi-res graphics, he's dead right.

Treasure are a small team, and they know that if they expand and take on the 30+ people teams to do more work, then the creativity and magic of Treasure will be lost. No doubt about it.

They have to choose carefully which platform to target, how long development will take and what kind of rewards they will reap. If they set themselves a target where development takes way too long, then the operating costs will kill the company in the meantime... we've seen that happen in the games business once or twice.

I could go on about it, but after reading the interview it made me admire them from a business point of view as well as a gaming one. I like their fierce indepence, how focussed they are, and that they develop completely to their strengths.

yay for treasure!

[eastyy]

couple of questions
How come konami asked them to do gradius 5?
And did they make a silpheed game but did not put there name to it?

[muddy]

And did they make a silpheed game but did not put there name to it?

that one is easy. somebody paid them extra NOT to advertise the fact that they made it. happens a lot.


edit: sorry, re-read the initial post... I don't know if they did make it, but I did answer the why!

[Leon Retro]

You guys are acting like Treasure are a tiny company like Triangle Service- when in fact they are a bigger and more respected company than you think.

Nintendo asked them to make WarioWorld.

Sega asked them to make Astro Boy GBA.

Konami asked them to make Gradius V

Sega love the company and are funding their Heroes game.

There is probably even more stuff they have done to prove they are not considered light-weights by the industry.


This is a company that is filled with people that prior to Treasure worked on big names suchs as Castlevania 4 and Contra 3.

They are known as a highly talented dependable outfit.

If they want to make console 2D games- they can, and probably with a lot of financial backing from a big publisher.

The company know they may never sell big numbers- and the CEO even mentioned 80,000 is a good figure to him. This is a good attitude- because there is no way his games are gonna sell a million, however good they are.

The GBA market is virtually dead for original games. I truely believe putting Guardian Heroes and Gunstar Heroes on the GBA is a waste. Even if they are decent titles- they would stand much more chance if created to a high standard on a console.

The CEO said a lot of negative things about hand-helds. He mentioned the screens are too small, and this restricts the type of gameplay they can offer. He hasn't got the enthusiasm or commitment to allow his teams to produce high-end 2D titles- and this attitude may back-fire on the guy.

I just want to see Tresure using their talents to the fullest. Obviously I don't want them to make copy-cat or licensed titles- I just want glorious gameplay drenched console masterpieces.

I have a passion for Treasure and any company with the guts to make unique interesting titles. Some of the attitudes in this thread are very low on expectations for the future of 2D and unique games in general!

[Team Andromeda]

To make somthing like Contra III or Axelay takes a Team of 8 or so people, but that was back in the old days

To make a 3D game takes way more than that these days. Also games like GH II have been in development of over 2 years .Handheld like the PSP or DS just weren't ready then so the GBA was the only way to go
Treasure are happy with the 2D (it what they excel at) You see 3D titles from them as well. You're worrying about nothing mate.

Looks like thier new 360 game with be inpart 2D . Can't wait to see what those guys can get up too on next gen Hardware

[Leon Retro]

To make somthing like Contra III or Axelay takes a Team of 8 or so people, but that was back in the old days

To make a 3D game takes way more than that these days. Also games like GH II have been in development of over 2 years .Handheld like the PSP or DS just weren't ready then so the GBA was the only way to go
Treasure are happy with the 2D (it what they excel at) You see 3D titles from them as well. You're worrying about nothing mate.

Looks like thier new 360 game with be inpart 2D . Can't wait to see what those guys can get up too on next gen Hardware

TA you are a great guy, but you seem to have a problem understanding my posts. I have never mentioned anything about 3D games, or that Gunstar should be on PSP or DS.

I know Treasure make 3D titles-I love FreakOut on the PS2 etc..

The whole issue is from my point of view the waste of the Guardain and Gunstar names.

I would have been much happier to have a true graphically amazing follow-up to Guardian Heroes for my PS2, and the same for Gunstar Heroes.

Guardian Heroes pushed the Saturn and is still a gorgeous game. Gunstar Heroes pushed the MD and is still amazing. Both games were commercial titles- but with the Tresure magic. They didn't sell in amazing numbers- but they are respected and fairly succesful titles.

Why are Treasure shying away from making the games their fans want and not being as brave as they have done in the past. I have faith in the company- with the right games they could sell enough on the PS2 or other next-gen machines to have moderate success!


Edit: When the GBA sales of their games are published, I may be right in saying the machine is the wrong place for sequels to two of the greatest games!

[gizmo1990]

TA you are a great guy, but you seem to have a problem understanding my posts. I have never mentioned anything about 3D games, or that Gunstar should be on PSP or DS.

I know Treasure make 3D titles-I love FreakOut on the PS2 etc..

The whole issue is from my point of view the waste of the Guardain and Gunstar names.

I would have been much happier to have a true graphically amazing follow-up to Guardian Heroes for my PS2, and the same for Gunstar Heroes.

Guardian Heroes pushed the Saturn and is still a gorgeous game. Gunstar Heroes pushed the MD and is still amazing. Both games were commercial titles- but with the Tresure magic. They didn't sell in amazing numbers- but they are respected and fairly succesful titles.

Why are Treasure shying away from making the games their fans want and not being as brave as they have done in the past. I have faith in the company- with the right games they could sell enough on the PS2 or other next-gen machines to have moderate success!


Edit: When the GBA sales of their games are published, I may be right in saying the machine is the wrong place for sequels to two of the greatest games!

I'm sorry but you're living in la la land. I really don't think you understand the financial reality of todays video games industry.

In short very few games these days actually make much money at all, out of those that do a small percentage (usually licensed or sequels) make MASSIVE amounts. That is the state of the current market place.

Into this your suggesting that a small company should bet their entire future on a high res 2D game of a franchise very few people have heard of?

[Leon Retro]

I'm sorry but you're living in la la land. I really don't think you understand the financial reality of todays video games industry.

In short very few games these days actually make much money at all, out of those that do a small percentage (usually licensed or sequels) make MASSIVE amounts. That is the state of the current market place.

Into this your suggesting that a small company should bet their entire future on a high res 2D game of a franchise very few people have heard of?

I shouldn't have bothered starting the discussion in the first place!

You and a lot of the other guys here don't have a clue about what I'm getting at- I might as well have posted on an Eskimo forum dedicated to PC gaming; I would probably have a better chance of getting some sense!


Why is it some people here hate to have intelligent discussion and act like headless-chickens at the first mention of Sega-Nintendo-Treasure etc..?

I expected opinions and thoughts- sadly it seems most people here are far less serious about gaming than I imagined.

There is no way I am gonna lower my expectations, and act like some beggar to the industry. Us gamers should have high standards and demands- gaming is about dreams, and sadly Treasure are letting people down, especially themselves at the moment with their lack of ambition!

Wanna buy some passion pills? I have a few left over after sending the rest to Treasure!

[mattSix]

uhh... what's going on here? treasure ceo drops an ikaruga-related sequel bomb-shell and everyone rants on about something else?? get with the program people!

i think a point that's being missed here is that the whole existence of treasure is predicated on not catering to market forces. if they wanted to do 'what the fans wanted' they'd all still be at konami making castlevania X and contra Y, because the fans like the sequels. RS3 = t3h OMFG!!1!

likewise, if they were led only by the gods of marketing, we'd have seen far more 3D pap out of them than we have this generation...

treasure exists to explore new gaming types & create new IP; to influence, rather than follow, the industry's direction.

one thing you can be sure of if 2D is 'dead' to everyone else, it's not dead to treasure - only they will decide when they're done with exploiting non-3D gaming possibilities.

[Leon Retro]

uhh... what's going on here? treasure ceo drops an ikaruga-related sequel bomb-shell and everyone rants on about something else?? get with the program people!

i think a point that's being missed here is that the whole existence of treasure is predicated on not catering to market forces. if they wanted to do 'what the fans wanted' they'd all still be at konami making castlevania X and contra Y, because the fans like the sequels. RS3 = t3h OMFG!!1!

likewise, if they were led only by the gods of marketing, we'd have seen far more 3D pap out of them than we have this generation...

treasure exists to explore new gaming types & create new IP; to influence, rather than follow, the industry's direction.

one thing you can be sure of if 2D is 'dead' to everyone else, it's not dead to treasure - only they will decide when they're done with exploiting non-3D gaming possibilities.

Keep it coming people- these posts are very funny!

Would you not have been happier if this was a head-line " Treasure bring Gunstar/Guardian Heroes sequels to PS2 in glorious hi-res "

I didn't mention Ikaruga because I'm talking about the Heroes games, and any sequel to Ikaruga is an unknown entity at the moment.

You say Treasure exist to do their own thing and make unique games I listed Wario World- Astro Boy- Gradius V and others as examples of the company working with big publishers to make commercial games!

Treasure chose to make their first PS2 game 3D. FreakOut is a very nice game- but probably sold a pitiful amount.


My points are these:

Guardian Heroes GBA sold poorly- and the new Gunstar will probably sell badly too.

The CEO of Treasure said selling 80,000 copies of a games is pretty good!

They have always made great games that sell in low numbers. Ikaruga was produced in fairly small amounts because they know even such a great game won't be mass-market.

In recent years they have attracted the respect of big name publishers such as the mighty Nintendo, Sega and Konami.


Taking all this in to account- one can only conclude that putting sequels to their most cherished franchises on a hand-held wasn't the best option. Even having them on the DS or PSP wouldn't have helped!

There is little reason for the CEO not to give the go-ahead for his people to create new console 2D games.

They could be far more ambitious and make their own unique games with financial help from a big publisher if they wished.


They is no doubt in my mind the CEO of the company lacks the vision and passion that is so evident in his staff. I feel sorry for his employee's being shackled to such a degree. The only reason they stay is probably because there is no Treasure equivalent company around, so it's better the devil you know!

Long live the creative side of Treasure- lets hope they stage a mutiny!

[Team Andromeda]

TA you are a great guy, but you seem to have a problem understanding my posts. I have never mentioned anything about 3D games, or that Gunstar should be on PSP or DS.

I know Treasure make 3D titles-I love FreakOut on the PS2 etc..

The whole issue is from my point of view the waste of the Guardain and Gunstar names.

I would have been much happier to have a true graphically amazing follow-up to Guardian Heroes for my PS2, and the same for Gunstar Heroes.

Guardian Heroes pushed the Saturn and is still a gorgeous game. Gunstar Heroes pushed the MD and is still amazing. Both games were commercial titles- but with the Tresure magic. They didn't sell in amazing numbers- but they are respected and fairly succesful titles.

Why are Treasure shying away from making the games their fans want and not being as brave as they have done in the past. I have faith in the company- with the right games they could sell enough on the PS2 or other next-gen machines to have moderate success!


Edit: When the GBA sales of their games are published, I may be right in saying the machine is the wrong place for sequels to two of the greatest games!

Thanks,

Look mate Treasure have to make games with a certain budget in mind , in keeping with the resources available to the company in terms of man power ect.

To make a kick ass PS2 Gunstar Heroes II on the PS2 would take considerable more resources than the GBA version.
Thank to that Treasure can give the GH II boys over 2 years of development time (Crazy for a 2D HH game).

If Treasure expanded in the way you like , I?ll think they would no longer be Treasure But you?re typical 3rd party developer.
At least this way Treasure can make the game they want to make, and do the stuff their way .

Name me another better shooter than Gradius V this gen, becasue they isn't any.
Plus another thing, To make the master piece that was RSG took just 6 people (8 with sound). Treasure don't need massive teams, becasue they're Treasure .

I put money on thier Type-X and 360 games dropping jaws

[ElAlcesDiablo]

Putting aside your burning hunger for hi-res 2d on home consoles for a moment, let's look at the business side of it.

Hi-res takes more manhours, more time, more money.
PS2 and GBA installed base pretty similar in size.
Majority of PS2 owners would look down upon a 2d game, seeing it as archaic regardless of how high resolution it's sprites might be. If it came out in the west it would almost certainly be a budget release and still wouldn't sell many copies.
The vast majority of GBA games are 2d, Treasure can use technical tricks to make a game that will stand out from the crowd.

I'm pretty sure it will sell more on the GBA than it would on the PS2 and will have cost less to make. It's not merely lack of ambition, turning a profit is important and I can't see how pursuing some expensive 2d project would ever pay off.

I expect their next gen efforts will be visually impressive too. But in clever ways, using showy effects and technology to get around the need for high poly models and hi-res textures that would cost them more manhours than they can afford.

I enjoyed Maegawa mentioning that the shmup team works nights because they prefer it. Just fits nicely with this hardcore coding ninjas image.

[Leon Retro]

I have been expressing my thoughts and desires on the whole Treasure situation past and present.

Regarding the future of the company- I hope they do eventually make a gasp-worthy console-based 2D platform extravaganza, whether this comes about through a supporting third party or not is irrelevant; I just want great games.

Guardian Heroes Advance isn't a great game, and it has flopped at retail. I have faith Gunstar SuperHeroes will be good- but once again I would hate to see it fail. Both these games are sequels to two of the most significant titles of all time, and it saddens me that they haven't received AAA console sequels!

Gradius V is a beautiful exceptional title- and shows that with help from a big publisher the company can really succeed. I have worries regarding the CEO's attitude though, I just hope he proves me wrong!

Long live Treasure!