Mario's visual style

[Dogg Thang]

I was just looking at the plastic pixel Mario setups I have and it got me thinking about Mario's visual evolution. Not just him as a character - his whole world. Super Mario Bros was obviously very simple visually but established so many of the staple Mario thingies - like goombas and koopas and ? boxes and so on.

As they made more 2D Mario games, the style changed with each one. It wasn't a case of just improving with the technology. They actually redesigned each time with a new sense of style. Yoshi's Island is a particular fave of mine visually, even though (personally) I found the game itself a little weak. The colouring style is absolutely gorgeous.

The enemy design went through a few changes with those design situations. The goombas in SMW look very different, as does Mario himself (his looking up animation is excellent). Each time, they redefined the world.

Well I've been really loving Mario Galaxy as you know. It is stunning and does look absolutely lovely. But, since the series has gone 3D, there has been absolutely no change in visual style whatsoever. The goombas in Galaxy just look like a smoother version of those in M64. Same with every other enemy. And Mario himself.

What happened to the visual creativity?

It's not that Galaxy looks bad. It clearly doesn't. It looks wonderful. But I wonder why there has been no attempt to play with the design elements at all.

Is everyones favourite visually Yoshi's Island?

[Ouenben]

There were goombas in super mario world?!

[MoFo2]

[crocky-chocky]

What happened to the visual creativity?

WHAT?

Galaxy is LOADED with visual creativity. It's difficult to back up my point without potentially spoiling it for folks who haven't played it. But even early moments such as

->Open Spoiler<-

the apple planet that you ground pound for a ruddy great caterpillar to pop out and connect you to another planet, and the giant spider boss inside a planet core

are both creatively stronger ideas than most games.

Mario has to hark back to older games, the previous games have established a pretty solid universe that fans love, so why not?. But Galaxy features a pretty much perfect mix of nostalgia and new design elements...if you ask me.

I dunno, maybe I've missed your point...but I just can't fathom why you think Galaxy lacks visual creativity.

Visually, my favourite Mario is either Yoshi's Island or SMB3. Even though it's 8-bit there's some really nice design touches in there.

[Dogg Thang]

I dunno, maybe I've missed your point...but I can't understand why you think Galaxy lacks visual creativity.

Yep. Point well missed.

Yes there's visual creativity all over Galaxy. I'm not criticising the graphics. But the core staples of Mario have undergone no evolution. In those core elements, there has been no visual creativity since Mario64. Even New Super Mario Bros used the exact same style. In the 2D era, redesigning those elements created a new world each time.

[crocky-chocky]

Yes there's visual creativity all over Galaxy. I'm not criticising the graphics. But the core staples of Mario have undergone no evolution. In those core elements, there has been no visual creativity since Mario64. Even New Super Mario Bros used the exact same style. In the 2D era, redesigning those elements created a new world each time.

Ahhh, right. I think I'm with you now.

You're saying the likes of Goombas and Koopas could have benefited from a design makeover, yez?

In that case I agree.

...though sorry if I've missed your point again. It's too early for me.

[Dogg Thang]

Well, even they still look great. I have no problem with their design at all. It's not that. They may not have even been any better with a redesign. It's just that it didn't happen and it does leave me wondering what overall style sense there could have been.

And also I'm really just reminiscing on some of my fave 2D Mario styles.

[Soi]

I hate Mario's design. Really hate it. He is an annoying smug little high pitched ball-bag of a character. I find his whole world twee and annoying. It was fine when it was low res 2D, but him in 3D just grates on me.

It doesn't stop me enjoying his games though. Galaxy is great, and its world is wonderfully inventive. The legacy Mario elements of the world (Mario himself, Bowser, that twat Peach) are the worst designed bits though.

[Charlie]

I'm with you on the voice. He sounds like a berk.

[Brats]

I dunno. When you'e spent 25 years establishing a well recognised universe, why suddenly go changing? It's like the Bond theme, it's just kind of expected I think.

Mario Sunshine tried to move things further away from the establised Mario template and many didn't like it. Within the Mario cannon, you need to go to the spin offs like Yoshis Island and Paper Mario for the creativity, but the 'core' Mario games should have this consistency.

There weren't any Goombas in Sunshine were there? If so, It's been over ten years since we've seen a 3D Goomba in a core Mario game.

[Dogg Thang]

New Super Mario Bros had goombas.

But every 2D Mario game had a new style. So to use your Bond theme example, it's more like the fact that they get different songs for each movie for 25 years but then, for some reason, begin to use nothing but the 'live and let die' song over and over.

[rmoxon]

I've never played the Japanese game that Super Mario bros 2 is based on, but did that have shy guys and stuff in it? if so I find it quite amusing that some famous mario enemies and imagary comes from a game that wasnt even originaly anything to do with mario.

To be honest though Ive never thought the mario games were that visualy creative before I played Galaxy, even the other 3d games, though the levels were fantasticaly designed, the settings were hardly inspired besides maybe a couple of levels in 64, and they just reused all the enemies that we had seen before in 2d games.

[Ady]

I wouldn't say the visual design has become staid at all. If anything, each Mario game blends old with new as appropriate.

In any event, the Boos in Galaxy differ from those in 64 and the Bullet Bills differ from their SMW incarnations (for the worse IMO - I preferred them when they didn't have arms).

[Dogg Thang]

At the risk of derailing the thread - I notice very few people (including me) ever talk about the GB Marios. I remember loving Mario Land 2 but my memory really doesn't give me any more than that. Anyone remember them?

[rmoxon]

The first two Mario Land games were fantastic, The third one I'm not that big a fan of as I dont particuarly like the warioLand games that much as there is far too much running in a stright line bashing through walls.

Although its been a long while since I played them too I think visualy Mario land looked alot like the first Super Mario brothers, Mario Land 2 had MUCH bigger sprites and had costumes and stuff so probabaly felt more like Mario bros 3?

Like I said they were both fantastic games anyway.