Why microtransactions, IAPs and LootBoxes are here to stay thread

[Cassius_Smoke]

In other news EA says kids shouldn't be spending in FUT. So that's nice.
Maybe, and call me mad, but maybe don't put an online casino in your game and have it rated for kids.

https://www.pcgamer.com/kids-should-not-be-spending-in-fifa-full-stop-says-ea/

[fishbowlhead]

Despite them saying it'd never happen, paid XP boosts have been added to Avengers. This is after they reduced the amount of XP you earn because they said people were advancing too quick. Pretty ****ty.

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/...-never-happen/

Classic bungie move that is. Having fun? Here comes the fun hammer!

[nonny]

Just in time for the surge in players on Game Pass. It's currently seeing a massive influx on the service, I just finished the solo campaign and really enjoyed it but no way in hell I'd be getting into the grind.

[Asura]

Just in time for the surge in players on Game Pass. It's currently seeing a massive influx on the service, I just finished the solo campaign and really enjoyed it but no way in hell I'd be getting into the grind.

Well, yeah - GamePass is going to be the next free-to-play.

Microsoft is giving GamePass members triple-A games every month, sometimes multiple, for peanuts. That can't continue forever.

[Cassius_Smoke]

Well, yeah - GamePass is going to be the next free-to-play.

Microsoft is giving GamePass members triple-A games every month, sometimes multiple, for peanuts. That can't continue forever.

I spoke about this before.
I don't care what MS are paying to have games on GP, it can't possibly cover the cost of selling the same amount full price. They'll have to find ways to make that money back.

[Asura]

I spoke about this before.
I don't care what MS are paying to have games on GP, it can't possibly cover the cost of selling the same amount full price. They'll have to find ways to make that money back.

It's simple, they're playing a zero-sum game.

It's like on the Epic store; all those "free" games aren't free, you're just being subsidised by all the kids spending money in Fortnite.

[fishbowlhead]

It's simple, they're playing a zero-sum game.

It's like on the Epic store; all those "free" games aren't free, you're just being subsidised by all the kids spending money in Fortnite.

Makes me chuckle every time i see people commenting on “but but gamepass is profitable now” takes me about 30 mins to stop laughing.

[nonny]

This is the reason Halo Infinite is F2P... But personally I don't mind that in the slightest.

I don't think the micro transactions there are intrusive and whilst the model they have for earning XP has ruffled feathers the way they've structured battle passes for cosmetics is decent.

Basically I don't mind a good F2P implementation if it's not play to win and the core game loop is fun. With Halo, at least for me... it's something I'd be putting hours into regardless of entry price.

As for the whole of game pass being F2P... Well we're in the ramp up phase aren't we. They're still trying to grow the numbers and the pricing reflects that. I'm sure that there wil be price hikes in the future and so on but as a value proposition I find the service is solid this far. Will it turn into the ultimate F2P cash cow in future? Who knows what it will look like in 5 years...

[MartyG]

If only there was a well written article explaining it all

[fishbowlhead]

If only there was a well written article explaining it all

Well, might be “well written” if they had any factual numbers, which i wouldn’t believe unless i was actually put in-front of their stats live on the MS system. Otherwise as usual MS just pluck the best sounding number they can come up with and push that.

[MartyG]

I imgine even if they did there'd still be negative nelly posts here. Game Pass is successful the moment the income exceeds that of game sales. As I've pointed out many many many times before, how many games do MS need to sell a month to bring in the same income? Can people do the maths as I rather suspect that Microsoft can and already have.

[nonny]

It's a good article as it does lay out everything we know externally and explains it all.

I think the only thing I don't agree with is the direct comparison to Spotify and Netflix because whilst it helps to explain the concept it also isn't that useful because Game Pass is (currently) running alongside conventional purchase options in the same ecosystem.

You can still buy physical copies or digital copies of the content inside game pass and avoid the subscription altogether.

Everything else they go through holds merit. Though Jim Ryan might be eating those words if recent commentary is anything to go by...

We will see... the future is, interesting.

[Asura]

This is the reason Halo Infinite is F2P... But personally I don't mind that in the slightest.

I don't think the micro transactions there are intrusive and whilst the model they have for earning XP has ruffled feathers the way they've structured battle passes for cosmetics is decent.

Basically I don't mind a good F2P implementation if it's not play to win and the core game loop is fun. With Halo, at least for me... it's something I'd be putting hours into regardless of entry price.

Just bear in mind, those companies don't put F2P in just because people might occasionally toss them a dollar.

If you're playing a successful freemium game, you're playing a game which is funded by the people spending huge amounts in-game; the "whales". If the whales didn't exist, the game wouldn't exist.

If only there was a well written article explaining it all

Well-written, perhaps, but it lacks the key detail and instead focuses more on the cultural shift that GamePass represents.

I disagree with the (quite positive) premise of the article; it just seems like a lot of gymnastics to get away from the point - you can't pay less for content while giving the developers the same amount, surely?

All of these debates are hypothetical at present because we have two systems; we have people buying games, and GamePass as contemporary things. As a result the picture is too complex. But I can't get over how all the artists on Spotify say that they earn sod-all, or how Netflix is in so much debt, and wonder if that's where we're going (admittedly the article mentions this).

I imgine even if they did there'd still be negative nelly posts here. Game Pass is successful the moment the income exceeds that of game sales. As I've pointed out many many many times before, how many games do MS need to sell a month to bring in the same income? Can people do the maths as I rather suspect that Microsoft can and already have.

Potentially it is, but isn't that a problem? If Microsoft got to the point where it's just not worth releasing "other" games on Xbox because GamePass exists, then we'll have come full circle, and changed back to how things were in the 90s, when what does/does not go onto console is decided by a bunch of suits in a room, instead of a more open storefront where consumers can make up their own minds.

So much of what's been good about media since the proliferation of the internet is seeing control of entertaining wrenched from the grip of the hookers-and-blow executives. They practically seem to exist to make sure that really bold, innovative titles get pushed out of view.

It's kinda funny in that article, where they're suggesting it's not so bad, because Tim Schafer thinks it'll let him be more creative. Tim Schafer. One of the industry's probably top-20 famous people.

It has to sell millions to work; surely that means that the only games which they'll want are those which are milquetoast, middle-of-the-road fare. It's not a coincidence we're having this conversation just after The Avengers came out, the best example if-we-ever-needed-one of a free-to-play game with a cover price slapped on top. And listing the existing games isn't a way to dispute this, as again, those generally started life in other places which weren't like this.

[MartyG]

No it's not a problem, it's just a threshold line. It's not exclusive as this isn't the only avenue for games purchase, games development or games sales. It's simply the model Microsoft is choosing to follow, probably because long term it will be more successful for them as they move towards a greater emphasis on SaaS and increased ARR. People are free to not purchase Game Pass in exactly the same way they don't have to purchase beer, likewise developers don't have to put their titles on Game Pass just as they don't have to sell Carlsberg lager.

There are thousands of games out there that don't sell a million copies and can still claim to be successful, it's simply a matter of context.

[Asura]

No it's not a problem, it's just a threshold line. It's not exclusive as this isn't the only avenue for games purchase, games development or games sales. It's simply the model Microsoft is choosing to follow, probably because long term it will be more successful for them as they move towards a greater emphasis on SaaS and increased ARR. People are free to not purchase Game Pass in exactly the same way they don't have to purchase beer, likewise developers don't have to put their titles on Game Pass just as they don't have to sell Carlsberg lager.

There are thousands of games out there that don't sell a million copies and can still claim to be successful, it's simply a matter of context.

I think it's more analogous to the idea that people can still buy physical movies alongside the existence of Disney+, but now Disney have announced their future content isn't going to come out on UHD in many territories and the rest of their content likely isn't going to be far behind.