Improving XBOX RGB Quality?

[Escape-To-88]

Had an Xbox for a number of years now, and after recently setting up my Dreamcast again and being dazzled by it's wonderful RGB output I'm a little pee'd off at the crap RGB from the Xbox.
I'm running a modded Xbox in NTSC mode with an offical RGB lead, but while the picture is pretty decent it's not fantastic.
In the past I have used a modded lead with the xbox and an old 1084s monitor and the output was fantastic, but sadly the monitors in storage at the mo.
Just wondered if anyone knew/makes any cable hacks to get a nice vibrant, clear picture? Or failing that any sort of bios hack/upgrade.
I haven't gone Hi-Def and don't plant to for a while so looking for a decent solution for my trusty CRT TV and xbox.
thanks a lot.

[fallenangle]

I've never had anything but good results from all my RGB SCART leads both XBox official and various cheaper independent brands.

I was wondering if your TV might be the cause of your trouble with the NTSC modded XBox. The problem is that some TVs (in my case a JVC 32" widescreen) may not support RGB via SCART when used for NTSC sources. For some mysterious reason it defaults to composite hence the IQ drop.

Try swapping to PAL/turning off the chip and see if you get an improvement. If it's not this I can't think what to suggest.

[randombs]

weird problem, but the fact that you're bigging up dreamcast's rgb means you obviously know when it's running in rgb and when it's composite

if you're using xbmc/avalaunch try forcing pal60 and see if it does make a difference. rgb is rgb, i've been told, so whether it's pal or ntsc it won't affect the colours or anything (only via composite/svideo). i was convinced that my xbox looked a bit better in pal60 over rgb than ntsc but i'm pretty sure i was just assuming it as opposed to it being true

p.s. your avatar roxxx!

[Escape-To-88]

p.s. your avatar roxxx!

thankyou dear boy! It's no sexy asian chick but that high-top fade was too tasty to resist!
Yeah I've tried PAL60 etc. without much luck. I mean it's a good picture, just looks a little muddy compared to my U.S DC or my U.S Ps2. Sadly some o the Xbox emu's run slightly jerky in PAL60 because of the colour mode of course...hmmm someday I'll have HD, someday.

[anephric]

The Xbox has (had) notoriously mushy RGB. This was allegedly sorted on later Xbox iterations but mine (1.1) is pretty dark. Going prog-scan helps, but it's still dark (ish). I struggle to see stuff in shadow in Halo 2 on my progressive CRT, for example, and I'm a high gamma whore.

[Lyris]

Yep, I've heard it was pretty naff. Component Video out (which I'd imagine is derived from the same RGB that goes out over the RGB cable anyway) looks good on my May 2005 bought Xbox, but still nothing LIKE as good as the GameCube's 480p video.

So Anephric's idea of it being fixed later could be right.

[Escape-To-88]

Cheers guys. I have a bios flash that supposedly sorts it out, but I can't see how it would improve the picture a lot? and I fear I may knacker my box as it's untested.
Hmm..how do I tell what version box I have?

[fahrenheit]

Funnily enough, it has just been revealed (yesterday?) that the Xbox has a flicker filter value that can be applied by the devs when producing the games. It defaults in a value of 5 (0 being no flicker fix and 5 being max). Its almost exclusively set to 5 in every Xbox game.

New patching software called, and I hope I can say this...Flicker****er XBE Patcher just came out the other day. http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=541927

[Pavey]

Paul, to check what version you have -

Click

[Lyris]

Funnily enough, it has just been revealed (yesterday?) that the Xbox has a flicker filter value that can be applied by the devs when producing the games. It defaults in a value of 5 (0 being no flicker fix and 5 being max). Its almost exclusively set to 5 in every Xbox game.

New patching software called, and I hope I can say this...Flicker****er XBE Patcher just came out the other day. http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=541927

Unfortunately I noticed this long before and it drove me nuts! I'd rather have jumping lines than blurring.

Apparently 480p over Component escapes the filter. Too bad it's still not as good as GameCube 480p...

[randombs]

wow @ fahrenheit's suggestion, didn't know about that.

but doesn't flicker filter just soften the image a bit? in emus and xbmc and stuff you can change the value and i don't notice it getting brighter, just softer

escape, what's this magic bios thing?

and as for the xbox versions, yeah i heard that too, where the newer encoders are better for rgb but lose certain things that almost noone will care about (vga resolutions and stuff). no disrespect to the linux users or vga cable owners - i would've built one myself but just stumped with component - i'm talking marketing talk

[Lyris]

but doesn't flicker filter just soften the image a bit? in emus and xbmc and stuff you can change the value and i don't notice it getting brighter, just softer

Yup, that's it exactly. It blurs detail.

[randombs]

so... when we're talking about weak rgb i just assumed it implied the brightness, colour vividness, etc.

on my 14" telly, when i used the xbox/ps2 i'd have to pump the brightness up to 25 (max is 32) for it to look normal. with the saturn/dc/cube, i'd only need it at 5 or 10

[Lyris]

I'm not sure about that myself, but I know when I use 480i from my Xbox, it looks totally wrong with the wrong black level so I have to turn the Brightness DOWN.

It's one weird console, I can say that much.

[Escape-To-88]

Yeah I knew about the flicker filter settings and have searched for about 2 years but only came up with a program line edit in Halo 2 (when installed on the H/Disk) that you can set the value. But this new program looks as though it's a universal flicker filter remover.
All the xbox emu's have flicker filter removers and look 100% better afterwards, perhaps I'll give this new prog. a go. Cheers Fahrenheit.