Possible side effects of RGB modding an N64?

[SG]

So, RGB modding the N64. I've tracked down an NUS-001 (FRA) model which I believe is the only PAL version that is moddable.

Before I do this though, I want to be sure... I have heard of cases of white flicker and dark colours. I would rather a smudgier, smooth appearance and non RGB than an RGB picture with these imperfections.

So to those who have done or seen it - or just know about it, can I ask about any side effects? As I don't fancy paying out for another model only to be dissatisfied with the results? If they are shoddy, what about these German guys that do it for 75 Euros on any PAL board? Are they any better at all?

Oh: also, if I go ahead and do it, is any specific wire needed?

Thanks all!!!

[chaoticjelly]

I think the best way is to do the standard RGB mod, and instead of the internal amplifier that can be made, make the RGB amp circuit in the SCART cable.

I've heard that the internal amp can cause flashing etc.

I have read about doing it on any PAL board, I have recently got some programmed chips from eviltim that act as a replacement video chip, but the mod seems quite difficult to do and I haven't attempted it yet, also its not fully tested, not sure about the German one they will be using a similar thing and it may not even be as good as eviltims!

No you dont need any special wire just bog-standard "equipment wire" multi-stranded of course.

Good luck!

[SG]

Thanks, uh... eviltims?

Also, to save me having to buy a French board, etc - if I gave you a while (I'm patient) to master your chip modding ability would you consider doing it for a knockdown price?

[chaoticjelly]

Thanks, uh... eviltims?

Also, to save me having to buy a French board, etc - if I gave you a while (I'm patient) to master your chip modding ability would you consider doing it for a knockdown price?

Yeah, a guy who goes by the handle "eviltim" or "viletim" over at the gamesx forums..

I may consider doing it.. drop me a PM or something.. cheers

[SG]

Will do.

eviltim... he does PAL modding and does a good job?

TBH I've never done anything like this before and I thought it was a question of just soldering 3 wires, yet I see you mentioning things like "internal amplifier" and "RGB amp circuit in the SCART cable" - well for starters I thought that all the modding went on in the N64 - how can the cable affect anything?

[chaoticjelly]

Will do.

eviltim... he does PAL modding and does a good job?

TBH I've never done anything like this before and I thought it was a question of just soldering 3 wires, yet I see you mentioning things like "internal amplifier" and "RGB amp circuit in the SCART cable" - well for starters I thought that all the modding went on in the N64 - how can the cable affect anything?

Hmm eviltim, he created a replacement DAC for the N64 :-) he's in Australia so I doubt he would mod your N64..

Yeah the basic mod (for an early US or JPN NTSC N64) consists of three wires, this gives an RGB picture, but is dark.

To get a bright, normal picture you either have to do an internal amplification mod (this is simply one wire from one point to another point) or make an RGB amp circuit to fit inside the scart cable (consists of some transistors that amplify the signal) the results of either of these will give a brighter, normal picture, however as I said, the internal amp (basically one extra wire) is easy to do, but can cause flashing on the screen.

[SG]

So that would mean that the best bet is putting transistors inside the cable?

And that somehow gives the N64 RGB capability? Linky or explanation at all? I have a feeling that I must have misunderstood... it seems too easy.

[chaoticjelly]

The actual putting wires from the RGB signals output by the NTSC N64 DAC is easy.. you have to do that, and then to get a bright, nice picture, since without an amp its too dark you have to do either the internal amp or the amp in the scart with transistors.

The transistors are pretty difficult to find though.. when I eventually found some I bought the lot

Link to RGB mod (also mentions internal amp): http://www.mmmonkey.co.uk/console/ni...ndo_64_rgb.htm

Link to RGB amp to put in scart (note that the pinouts of the transistors legs can differ depending on the source/region of your transistors - I found out the hard way! ):

http://www.mmmonkey.co.uk/console/nintendo/ntsc-n64-rbg-booster1.htm

Link to eviltim/viletim replacement DAC! check out the installation pictures, very impressive floaty tower of resistors

http://members.optusnet.com.au/eviltim/n64rgb/n64rgb.html

[SG]

OH I GET IT!

From what you said, I thought somehow modding the cable granted RGB - which didn't make any sense.

So RGB mod = dark. CCorrect brightness an be restored either by internal amplification or cable modding.

TBH this seems like a lot of effort to go to for someone who's not au-fait with this kind if thing. I would very much be intersted in your services for this, however.

Do you know why the internal amp mod can sometimes result in flicker? Ideally I'd send off the console to you to have the RGB and brightness moods done once you feel confident enough so I could just whack the cable straight into the back without any fussing around with it. Or do you think you could squeeze it all into an official RGB cable?

[charlesr]

The flicker only affects really light areas of the screen in my experience, so the only game I notice it in is 1080 (bit of a bummer really cos it's my fave n64 game). The colour goodness is worth it imho. Didn't know you could do it on pal boards. Why would you bother when all pal n64 games are a heap of crap?

[SG]

Because the only PAL games I intend to keep are all PAL optimised ones from Rare. The rest I'll be downloading on the Wii VC.

Yes, the rare NUS-001 (FRA) boards have the chip needed, but from what you were saying I thought you had chips to put on any board as that German company do: http://translate.google.com/translat...177%26pwst%3D1

Do you reckon that the GC RGB cable is any crisper than standard composite on an N64 that isn't RGB modded?

[EvilBoris]

No, you'll still only be getting compsite through it

[chaoticjelly]

OH I GET IT!

From what you said, I thought somehow modding the cable granted RGB - which didn't make any sense.

So RGB mod = dark. CCorrect brightness an be restored either by internal amplification or cable modding.

Yeah correct

[quote=groovemeister]TBH this seems like a lot of effort to go to for someone who's not au-fait with this kind if thing. I would very much be intersted in your services for this, however.[/image]

Yeah I can do it no probs.

Do you know why the internal amp mod can sometimes result in flicker? Ideally I'd send off the console to you to have the RGB and brightness moods done once you feel confident enough so I could just whack the cable straight into the back without any fussing around with it. Or do you think you could squeeze it all into an official RGB cable?

Dont know about the flicker issue, ive not tried it myself but someone bought a couple of RGB scarts for their NTSC RGB modded N64s lately off me, and the reason he was buying them was due to the flickering caused by the internal amp.

The RGB amp circuit fits inside the SCART cable no probs, so you can include that with the console and I'll mod the system and then add the RGB amp into the scart. Drop me a PM.

[Ryo Saeba]

[/B]]Why would you bother when all pal n64 games are a heap of crap?

This isn't the case, cause the best version of many of the very best N64 games is the PAL one.
As mentioned, Rare optimised their games for PAL standard and later ported them to NTSC (and thus all their PAL versions run at full speed/full screen and in a higher resolution and are therefore superior to the NTSC versions).

So if you want to get the best possible experience out of something like Perfect Dark, you have to go for an RGB modded PAL N64 and play the PAL version.
Better yet would be an overclocked RGB modded PAL machine (I'm dreaming of aquiring such a beauty^^'), which would give you a noticable framerate boost, which is of course especially nice in Perfect Dark.

This is the ultimate way to play N64 games, and best of all is, that apart from the PAL games from Rare, you can also play US/Jap versions of unoptimised PAL games in fullscreen/fullspeed 60Hz with the Passport Plus 3 (which is rather cheap nowadays).

[SG]

Out of interest, what is the best pic that an unmodded N64 can output? S-video perhaps or is it just crappy composite?

Ryo - exactly.

I only have Banjo Kazooie & Tooie, Conker's BFD, Jet Force Gemini and Perfect Dark.

The rest of my N64 titles I am selling as I plan to get them on the Wii's Virtual Console as they are all graphically enhanced to some extent. In fact, if anyone is interested please do drop me a line. They are immaculate like the day I got them - literally. I'm obsessive with these things. They were always held with freshly cleaned and dried hands and everything.

They are:

Legend of Zelda OoT
Legend of Zelda MM
Paper Mario
Super Mario 64
Super Smash Bros