'Collecting' - The Great Debate

[Duddyroar]

Huzzah!!

[usman]

Life is way too short to be that bothered about something so trivial - bottom line is that whatever an individual spends their own money on is their own business & need not be justified to anyone. I personally can't see why people get so sour-grapey about it.

Precisely the point.




I have serious issues with people who whine, moan and bitch and most of all JUDGE about what other people are collecting and their preferences in collecting.

No one has any right to bitch at someone for paying up the money to buy something and to keep ti as part of their collection. You may see it in your mindset as idiotic , you may have your own take on it as some sort of dementia - but to actually be so ridiculous so as to claim they are DEPRIVING someone else of the chance to play said game? To actually judge them as lazy bastards with no soul who hoard for money? Hoarding is what all the idiots who bought twenty copies of Ikaruga on launch to sell later at RSG prices did. Collecting sealed games as a prized part of a collection that is part and parcel of one of your fave pasttimes is not. No one has the right to claim someone is somehow doing others wrong by paying up the requisite cash for items they like to collect, to admire, for nostalgia, whatever.

This automatic judging of collectors as people who only want to sell later on - my ass. I have hundreds of valuable games, most sealed among hundreds of other promo items and many consoles/iterations sealed that colelctively are worth no samll amount. Who is someone to judge me as someone who is only hoarding to sell later on? Hell no. The only thing that would part me fom my collection would be something as drastic as the reutne of wwII -era internment camps, somethign that will likely be a reality soon anyway.

These comments of ' I don't have a problem with it is osmeone's buying a second copy sealed' yadaa yadda. What tosh. Why on earth do you have a bllody problem with someone's passion/pasttime/hobby/even obsession when it in no bleeding way affects you? Who is one to say they have an issue with that?

And like was said before. Soem games become so uncommon in different states of condition they inevitably fetch high prices - high prices no one but the colelctor is willing to pay. I bought my sealed RSg last year for $185 USD -a bargain in my book, but to who else? Am I somehow depriving Johnny Common/Poor Gamer of a sublime shooting experience by actually KEEPING what I OWN/PAID for and treasuring it in sealed conditon as one of the jewels of my collection? As if. Anyone who whines otherwise reeks of jealousy.

[the_dude]

In terms of collecting CD/DVD-Rom based games, i read an article in the Scotsman saying the data on these discs only last 20/5 years and an Edinburgh University are working on a fix to take the life expectancy into infinity.

Seems like all that collecting was/is a waste of time!

[Wools]

I just don't see the point in Keeping factory sealed games, or buying games just to add to collection, but never play them. Nobody would buy a music CD or DVD film and never play or watch them .
Oh Look Blade Runner my fav film of all time must buy another Factory sealed copy to never watch it again, in a word pointless .
You can?t interact with a stamp's (well about from licking it) with games you can , and that the whole point of video games inthe 1st place.

I understand what your saying but it's flawed for a reason.

I take care of my games and like to have one that is not chewed up. Old games are hard to find espically in good condition and buying a cheap copy is my way to just know I have a replacment if the one I have is knackered later on.

In 20 years time I'll be able to find a brand new or second hand copy of Blade Runner. Zelda the Wind Waker with Ocarina of Time on Gamecube? I very much doubt it.

[Wools]

In terms of collecting CD/DVD-Rom based games, i read an article in the Scotsman saying the data on these discs only last 20/5 years and an Edinburgh University are working on a fix to take the life expectancy into infinity.

Seems like all that collecting was/is a waste of time!

Dosen't all cartridges, CD, DVD, etc return to it's sand state within 100 years or so? In other words most circuit boards will be fragile or unworkable by the time your old anyway

[moonwhistle]

It pisses me off how 'rare' Slug 1 is on the AES. Total bull**** - there's around 20 copies on Ebay each week. I find it to be the most common AES cart of all time, even more common than a loose cart Samurai Spirits. I wouldn't pay more than ?40 for a Slug 1 me, god only knows how it can still command a price tag of ?1,200.

I'd value a mint Euro/Jap Baseball Stars 2 higher than Slug 1.

Metal Slug 1 AES simply isn't that common, 99% of the ones on ebay are conversions and are clearly labelled as such. Since I've been into Neo Geo I've seen a grand total of one genuine Metal Slug 1 (English Version) for sale. It's not super rare but it's desireable enough that nobody really wants to sell it. It's definately not in the same category as Radiant Silvergun which can be bought an any given time on Ebay or various forums. They are alot of well healed collectors (I'm not one of these ) dying to buy an English Metal Slug 1, they've got the money but nobody's seems willing to sell.

The Japanese version is more readily available, but again I don't think it's as common as you suggest.

[the_dude]

In 20 years time I'll be able to find a brand new or second hand copy of Blade Runner. Zelda the Wind Waker with Ocarina of Time on Gamecube? I very much doubt it.

I think in 20 years time you won't be given a **** about Zelda the Wind Waker with Ocarina of Time on Gamecube as games will have made that much progress in terms of Gameplay, Sound, Graphics, Gui's and AI (i hope) you won't want to play such games.

For example, i recently played The Adventures of Link through emulation on the PC and it scared the life out of me. Good game back then, but not now!

[muse hunter]

Precisely the point.




I have serious issues with people who whine, moan and bitch and most of all JUDGE about what other people are collecting and their preferences in collecting.

No one has any right to bitch at someone for paying up the money to buy something and to keep ti as part of their collection. You may see it in your mindset as idiotic , you may have your own take on it as some sort of dementia - but to actually be so ridiculous so as to claim they are DEPRIVING someone else of the chance to play said game? To actually judge them as lazy bastards with no soul who hoard for money? Hoarding is what all the idiots who bought twenty copies of Ikaruga on launch to sell later at RSG prices did. Collecting sealed games as a prized part of a collection that is part and parcel of one of your fave pasttimes is not. No one has the right to claim someone is somehow doing others wrong by paying up the requisite cash for items they like to collect, to admire, for nostalgia, whatever.

This automatic judging of collectors as people who only want to sell later on - my ass. I have hundreds of valuable games, most sealed among hundreds of other promo items and many consoles/iterations sealed that colelctively are worth no samll amount. Who is someone to judge me as someone who is only hoarding to sell later on? Hell no. The only thing that would part me fom my collection would be something as drastic as the reutne of wwII -era internment camps, somethign that will likely be a reality soon anyway.

These comments of ' I don't have a problem with it is osmeone's buying a second copy sealed' yadaa yadda. What tosh. Why on earth do you have a bllody problem with someone's passion/pasttime/hobby/even obsession when it in no bleeding way affects you? Who is one to say they have an issue with that?

And like was said before. Soem games become so uncommon in different states of condition they inevitably fetch high prices - high prices no one but the colelctor is willing to pay. I bought my sealed RSg last year for $185 USD -a bargain in my book, but to who else? Am I somehow depriving Johnny Common/Poor Gamer of a sublime shooting experience by actually KEEPING what I OWN/PAID for and treasuring it in sealed conditon as one of the jewels of my collection? As if. Anyone who whines otherwise reeks of jealousy.

a bit harsh, but exactly what i think, nobody has the right to moan about other peoples hobbies and what they spend their own money on. If someone wants four copies of metal slug AES then so be it.

[Tirian]

I just don't see the point in Keeping factory sealed games, or buying games just to add to collection, but never play them. Nobody would buy a music CD or DVD film and never play or watch them .
Oh Look Blade Runner my fav film of all time must buy another Factory sealed copy to never watch it again, in a word pointless .
You can?t interact with a stamp's (well about from licking it) with games you can , and that the whole point of video games inthe 1st place.

Again, you pick the examples which best support your argument, whilst ignoring others which contradict it. What about book collectors? This is a readily comparable example - books are made to be read, and that is the whole point of books to start with. Yet do you really think that someone who pays ?5000 or so for a first edition Colour of Magic is actually going to let their greasy fingers touch the pages? I think not!

Does that mean that they are not at all interested in what is in the book either? Again, if they are a collector rather than a dealer, then they probably do care a great deal about the contents of the book - that is probably part of the reason that they have bought it. And they probably have a mangy paperback of their own somewhere that they keep to read.

And far from preventing the rest of the world from enjoying aspects of culture as senor Stuart would have us believe, collectors actually serve a purpose by preserving items which otherwise would almost undoubtedly have been lost forever, precisely because they are so anal about having everything in their stash pristine and kept safely stored away.

What are museums if not the ultimate collector's wet dream?? And when some crazed hoarder finally dies, and there is discovered in the sixteenth drawer of the twelth cabinet in their basement complex, a minty copy of a prototype of some unreleased David Braben game, or (as happened recently) a completely unknown score from a world renowned composer - things which had they not stashed away would almost undoubtedly have gone into a bin somewhere and been lost forever - are we not grateful?

Tirian

[Team Andromeda]

I understand what your saying but it's flawed for a reason.

I take care of my games and like to have one that is not chewed up. Old games are hard to find espically in good condition and buying a cheap copy is my way to just know I have a replacment if the one I have is knackered later on.

In 20 years time I'll be able to find a brand new or second hand copy of Blade Runner. Zelda the Wind Waker with Ocarina of Time on Gamecube? I very much doubt it.

Same here I take great care to look after and keep my games in good nick, but at the end of the day I use them .
In 20 years time people should be able to back up just about anything , or download them for the web ect

[Team Andromeda]

Again, you pick the examples which best support your argument, whilst ignoring others which contradict it. What about book collectors? This is a readily comparable example - books are made to be read, and that is the whole point of books to start with. Yet do you really think that someone who pays ?5000 or so for a first edition Colour of Magic is actually going to let their greasy fingers touch the pages? I think not!

Does that mean that they are not at all interested in what is in the book either? Again, if they are a collector rather than a dealer, then they probably do care a great deal about the contents of the book - that is probably part of the reason that they have bought it. And they probably have a mangy paperback of their own somewhere that they keep to read.

And far from preventing the rest of the world from enjoying aspects of culture as senor Stuart would have us believe, collectors actually serve a purpose by preserving items which otherwise would almost undoubtedly have been lost forever, precisely because they are so anal about having everything in their stash pristine and kept safely stored away.

What are museums if not the ultimate collector's wet dream?? And when some crazed hoarder finally dies, and there is discovered in the sixteenth drawer of the twelth cabinet in their basement complex, a minty copy of a prototype of some unreleased David Braben game, or (as happened recently) a completely unknown score from a world renowned composer - things which had they not stashed away would almost undoubtedly have gone into a bin somewhere and been lost forever - are we not grateful?

Tirian

You can still read that prised book if its kept behind a protective screen, with game that is not the case. They need to be opened to play. And most of the rare books have at one point been used , not kept in a RSG like Factory sealed like trophy condition. Even stamp collectors can look at the stamps, to get the full joy of REZ you need to play it, not look at its bloody cover

Some of these collectors don?t have the good of the game industry in mind when collection games. They?re just getting them with money in mind , or as some boosting skills To say they have the only copy ect.

Games are still a young industry you cann't compare them to some classical stuff. That?s thousands/hundreds of years old , and made before any sort of proper recorded keeping was around.
The likes of Morzart have been dead for years , people like the Great David Braben are very much alive and kicking .
That?s the diff the people that helped shaped the games world are still in the most part alive today as it?s still a relativity a young industry.

[Wools]

I think in 20 years time you won't be given a **** about Zelda the Wind Waker with Ocarina of Time on Gamecube as games will have made that much progress in terms of Gameplay, Sound, Graphics, Gui's and AI (i hope) you won't want to play such games.

For example, i recently played The Adventures of Link through emulation on the PC and it scared the life out of me. Good game back then, but not now!

Games back in the 70's and 80's had a simple charm about them and were the beginings of the industry. I can't play the original Zelda, Metroid and C64 game as they are not enjoyable for me. But as soon as the technical side was sorted with high quality hardware the SNES, MD and this generation perfected 2D and 3D graphics and gameplay.

Are you really saying you can't envisange playing Zelda OOT or any other of your favourites down the line? I know it's a diffrent discussion but I love the simplicity of SNES and Mega Drive games and know I wont want to not play them.

And the theory about being to be able to download everything. It's another discussion but it kinda relates to if you're happy not having a somthing physical. I'm not

[the_dude]

Are you really saying you can't envisange playing Zelda OOT or any other of your favourites down the line? I know it's a diffrent discussion but I love the simplicity of SNES and Mega Drive games and know I wont want to not play them.

I'm saying that in 20 years time the game mechanics of titles like Zelda OOT will no longer appeal to some gamers. I loved Zelda OOT, but don't want to be playing it 20 years from now as i'll be playing superior titles.

[Wools]

Horse's for course's and all that

[Tirian]

You can still read that prised book if its kept behind a protective screen, with game that is not the case. They need to be opened to play. And most of the rare books have at one point been used , not kept in a RSG like Factory sealed like trophy condition. Even stamp collectors can look at the stamps, to get the full joy of REZ you need to play it, not look at its bloody cover

You could read the book. But only inasmuch as you could play the sealed game if the owner let you open it up. Someone who has paid a few grand for a mint first edition novel is about as likely to let someone risk creasing the spine by opening it up to read as a game collector is to let someone crack open their sealed Panzer Dragoon Saga.

And I don't think there are many people that could honestly claim that they wouldn't let that state of affairs affect them. Say you found a sealed Radiant Silvergun for a fiver in a boot sale somewhere - would you

a) Congratulate yourself on your lucky find, open it up, toss the useless spine and registration card in the bin, and play the hell out of it
b) keep it on your shelf forever and show it off to your guests
c) sell it for a fat ton of money (and perhaps use a fraction of the proceeds to buy yourself a decent condition used copy)

If you specify the latter then you really have no place to complain ...

Some of these collectors don?t have the good of the game industry in mind when collection games.

Um, yeah ... cause that is what is at the foremost of everyone else's mind when they buy a game.

Games are still a young industry you cann't compare them to some classical stuff. That?s thousands/hundreds of years old , and made before any sort of proper recorded keeping was around.
The likes of Morzart have been dead for years , people like the Great David Braben are very much alive and kicking .

People like J.K. Rowling and Terry Pratchett are alive today, as are most of the most prominent writers in the fantasy genre - and their first editions command thousands of pounds. It's not really so far removed from the game collecting scene as you seem to want to suggest. LPs / CDs and the like provide even more pertinent comparisons. The games industry now is probably about where the 'music industry' was forty or fifty years ago (or perhaps a little bit more)

There are some records where only perhaps 10 or less copies are known to exist. And without collectors, there would probably be none. The same is already true of the game collecting scene in a few instances (Megadrive Tetris anyone? Ultima: Escape From Mount Drash?)

Tirian