Star Wars Episode 7

[Asura]

All that's left of that guy is/was his arm

Not sure about that. Do you see him "vanish"? Or does the film just skip over the aftermath?

Still, you called it a plot hole, when it isn't. You can't just get the wrong impression and call that a plot hole - even if Star Wars is full of them, and The Force Awakens is no exception.

->Open Spoiler<-

If you look too closely, there are really basic things - like how easy is it to steal the Falcon? Doesn't it have KEYS? Wasn't it a bit daft how they got through the shields in hyperspace? Why didn't the entire Rebel fleet do that?

It all depends on how easily this trips you up. It's like the bit in Pacific Rim. THAT bit.

[Team Andromeda]

Not sure about that. Do you see him "vanish"? Or does the film just skip over the aftermath?

He does actually in a very crude manner , so does Obi obi one kenobi too

->Open Spoiler<-

Still, you called it a plot hole, when it isn't. You can't just get the wrong impression and call that a plot hole - even if Star Wars is full of them, and The Force Awakens is no exception

I agree and even the script is silly in places and I can bet you , this was a Lucas film people would be calling Lucas all sorts for such mistakes . Still Star wars is a film for kids at the end of the day

[Dogg Thang]

Just back from this. Going to spoiler everything for good measure but bottom line is I liked it.

So the gripes first...

->Open Spoiler<-

The pacing was all over the shop and only glued together by conveniences of everyone just being at the right place at the right time. Remember in JJ's Trek when Kirk just happens to be thrown out on to a planet at the exact place where old Spock is? Yeah, that. These pacing issues will likely be the ones that grow over time and bug me.

The nods and rips from the early movies were clumsy and unnecessary.

I thought every alien except Chewie looked awful.

Those aside, I loved it. The big thing this movie managed to do which was no easy feat was that I loved the main characters of Finn, Rey and Kylo Ren as much as any classic character. I thought they were great. Kylo Ren was like no other Star Wars character and I loved how human and sloppy he was. I thought that was fantastic. Actually generally how human the characters were was excellent. More so than even the classic movies, to the point where even stormtroopers felt like the actual people inside them rather than just randoms.

Chewie was wonderful. BB-8 was great. Out of the characters, it was really just the Dreamworks animated movie style aliens I didn't like. That was no big deal - they didn't have a large role.

Some of the story really worked for me. As I said, I think the pacing was messy so I think it was poorly constructed but where the story went, particularly with Rey, really worked for me. There were tears in my eyes at that lightsaber part. And the lightsaber battle was fantastic - messy in the best possible way. I far prefer this to the dance sequences of the soulless prequels.

This movie had heart. Not sure I expected that, to be honest. Especially from the director of Star Trek Into Darkness.

So yeah, really liked it. I didn't need a new Star Wars film in my life at all. I think we were at Star Wars saturation even before this. I wasn't hyped for it. But I really liked it.

[PaTaito]

Just back from this. Going to spoiler everything for good measure but bottom line is I liked it.

So the gripes first...

->Open Spoiler<-

The pacing was all over the shop and only glued together by conveniences of everyone just being at the right place at the right time. Remember in JJ's Trek when Kirk just happens to be thrown out on to a planet at the exact place where old Spock is? Yeah, that. These pacing issues will likely be the ones that grow over time and bug me.

The nods and rips from the early movies were clumsy and unnecessary.

I thought every alien except Chewie looked awful.

Those aside, I loved it. The big thing this movie managed to do which was no easy feat was that I loved the main characters of Finn, Rey and Kylo Ren as much as any classic character. I thought they were great. Kylo Ren was like no other Star Wars character and I loved how human and sloppy he was. I thought that was fantastic. Actually generally how human the characters were was excellent. More so than even the classic movies, to the point where even stormtroopers felt like the actual people inside them rather than just randoms.

Chewie was wonderful. BB-8 was great. Out of the characters, it was really just the Dreamworks animated movie style aliens I didn't like. That was no big deal - they didn't have a large role.

Some of the story really worked for me. As I said, I think the pacing was messy so I think it was poorly constructed but where the story went, particularly with Rey, really worked for me. There were tears in my eyes at that lightsaber part. And the lightsaber battle was fantastic - messy in the best possible way. I far prefer this to the dance sequences of the soulless prequels.

This movie had heart. Not sure I expected that, to be honest. Especially from the director of Star Trek Into Darkness.

So yeah, really liked it. I didn't need a new Star Wars film in my life at all. I think we were at Star Wars saturation even before this. I wasn't hyped for it. But I really liked it.

Agree about kylo ren. Vader wasn't anything like as menacing, or as you say sloppy and emotionally messed up.

Truly a character that elevated every scene. I also teared up at least twice during this film...so something must have been done right.

[Neon Ignition]

Watched it today. First thing is the missus review, who only saw Episodes I-VI for the first time ever earlier this year. Her verdict? Easily the best film so far.

Mine? Somewhat mixed with an undercurrent of positivity. It probably fits between the original trilogy and prequels in terms of placement but closer to the originals, however take out nostalgia and it would be the best one. How much regard you hold the existing entries will sway hard with this one but whilst I enjoy the films I recognise the originals as a product of their time with some awful acting, simple plotting and long dull stretches so a modern incarnation has plenty room to win the day. Force Awakens semi-does.

->Open Spoiler<-

Main trouble was about halfway through when it sunk in just what Abrams had done. One choice wrung all the tension out of the film.

However, beforehand, the new actors and characters work great, all very likeable and easily to warm too. The humour in the film works well and I liked the pacing, it never slowed down for too long. Tone wise it nailed it too, bridging the modern film making style with the originals designs.

Biggest failing for me though was that this was a sequel in the same way that Jurassic World was. Only here, I don't think it worked as well.

This is a good, fun, action and humour filled sequel but also a staggeringly lazy one. It literally is A New Hope. Almost beat for beat. Once that dawned on me the film was signposted all the way to the very end. Abrams has brought it back but in the safest and most cautionate way possible. With Star Wars it doesn't really work great though as the franchise revisits itself too much as it is.

I'm fine with riding it out for this one, after the prequels the franchise had enough good will to generate but Episode VIII would be risking a lot to revisit anything related to Empire Strikes Back.

Loved watching Captain Phantasma. It was like Monica Belluci in Spectre, so much pre-release talk and fuss and in the actual film she's barely present and arguably the least effective Stormtrooper in the franchise.

So yeah... I feel that that once the hype dies away many peoples high opinions of the film will too. It will likely win many Film of the year accolades but it doesn't deserve them. It is however a great watch, it resets the interest levels in Star Wars but little else. There's so much potential with the franchise, hopefully with Rogue One and Episode VIII they will start to show that there are some new story ideas knocking around in the studio rather than reusing character types and scenarios.

Definitely recommended, I imagine most will thoroughly enjoy it. But tempered expectations and a healthy dose of objectivity are key I feel.

[charlesr]

That light sabre battle in the snow was the best bit of the entire series

[danholo]

So yeah... I feel that that once the hype dies away many peoples high opinions of the film will too.

I hope you're wrong. It's a good, if not great, movie. It has great action, fun characters, a good story starting the journey of Rey and Kylo, and it's funny too. All in all it's a fun and entertaining film. Those are all signs of a good film without hype. No denial that having Star Wars in the title helps...

I've seen it three times and am planning to see it again. Go see it again, maybe you will like it more. I did.

[PaTaito]

I hope you're wrong. It's a good, if not great, movie. It has great action, fun characters, a good story starting the journey of Rey and Kylo, and it's funny too. All in all it's a fun and entertaining film. Those are all signs of a good film without hype. No denial that having Star Wars in the title helps...

I've seen it three times and am planning to see it again. Go see it again, maybe you will like it more. I did.

My brother said the same when he saw it the second time.

I'm not buying into this talk of it being a rehash of ANH either, i mean aside from the

->Open Spoiler<-

deathstar/trenchrun/force gifted siblings

its substantially different. To be fair at least two of those things, and more besides, make perfect sense given that this is a sequel to the original trilogy storyline too.

This film is fantastic.

[danholo]

it's not a complete rehash but I will understand if that is a main point of contention for some.

[prinnysquad]

It's not just those things. It's stuff like

->Open Spoiler<-

the hiding of plans inside a cute droid, escaping against the odds from an enemy stronghold, the Mos Eisley-esque scene. It skimmed the boundary of homage to the point where I felt uncomfortable about how similar to A New Hope it was. The dialogue is different, but the scenarios similar.

I don't see anyone saying that these situations didn't make sense - it's rather that there's a sense of repetition. The film was at its strongest, for me, when it did something different.

->Open Spoiler<-

Kylo Ren acting like an unhinged lunatic. The messy duel in the snow.

[PaTaito]

It's not just those things. It's stuff like

->Open Spoiler<-

the hiding of plans inside a cute droid, escaping against the odds from an enemy stronghold, the Mos Eisley-esque scene. It skimmed the boundary of homage to the point where I felt uncomfortable about how similar to A New Hope it was. The dialogue is different, but the scenarios similar.

I don't see anyone saying that these situations didn't make sense - it's rather that there's a sense of repetition. The film was at its strongest, for me, when it did something different.

->Open Spoiler<-

Kylo Ren acting like an unhinged lunatic. The messy duel in the snow.

Escape against all odds? The two instances are both rather different really. As for the droid storing info, droids are everywhere in the stars wars universe and are almost like mobile phones, they are hardly going to write complex info into anything else when they have abundant access to something which can do pretty much everything.

Ok, so they probably could have come up with a more original idea to bring

->Open Spoiler<-

luke into the story from a hidden location

, but droids are something that almost MAKE star wars so why use anything else? Without that similarity bb8 wouldn't need to exist, and because bb8 is awesome, and because star wars needs droids...it makes sense.

I concede similarity, but rehash? no.

[Mayhem]

All that's left of that guy is/was his arm

Incorrect, Obi-Wan merely lopped off Ponda Baba's arm in the cantina. The focus shot was on the arm to indicate to the audience (who obviously had no idea what "the force" could do, or what a "lightsaber" could achieve) that it could go through people. I somewhat know this because I met Peter Diamond, the film's main stunt co-ordinator (who was inside the Ponda Baba suit), in around 1999 and he demonstrated/talked about a few things from the film (including said cantina "stunt"), and went into a bit of detail about the duel at the end between Obi-Wan and Darth.

[prinnysquad]

Escape against all odds? The two instances are both rather different really. As for the droid storing info, droids are everywhere in the stars wars universe and are almost like mobile phones, they are hardly going to write complex info into anything else when they have abundant access to something which can do pretty much everything.

Ok, so they probably could have come up with a more original idea to bring

->Open Spoiler<-

luke into the story from a hidden location

, but droids are something that almost MAKE star wars so why use anything else? Without that similarity bb8 wouldn't need to exist, and because bb8 is awesome, and because star wars needs droids...it makes sense.

I concede similarity, but rehash? no.

That's an issue of semantics. Retread/rehash/similarities. A massive number of people have said that it bears significant similarities to IV - are they all wrong and have no case? Of course VII isn't a direct remake in the sense of, say, Psycho. There is, however, enough plot points and scenarios where there's a pervading sense of familiarity through it.

->Open Spoiler<-

I'm not sure what the point about droids is supposed to prove? Nobody has claimed that it doesn't fit in with the logistics of the SW universe. In both IV and VII, however, the central conceit of the opening half hour is that important information is stored in a lovable droid, who serves to drag a no-mark Jedi-in-waiting into a bigger affair. That's where the familiarity lies, and my initial reaction on seeing this opening was that of d?j? vu. The entire set up of bringing the lass into the story could have been wholly different. BB8 could, with some creativity, have still been a central player, so there's no need to lose him.

I'm not going over every similarity bit by bit because it sucks all the joy out of remembering the film, and turns it into a tedious memory test. I think different people are accepting of different levels of similarity, which is fair enough. I enjoyed the film and don't want to piss on anyone's parade. The internal logic of the SW Galaxy is not an issue with these similarities, I personally just wish they'd done something different to the Death Star threat, which felt weak.

[Dogg Thang]

One other thought as I came out of this yesterday: I should probably burn my prequel DVDs and never show them to my kids now. What's the point?

[dvdx2]

That's an issue of semantics. Retread/rehash/similarities. A massive number of people have said that it bears significant similarities to IV - are they all wrong and have no case? Of course VII isn't a direct remake in the sense of, say, Psycho. There is, however, enough plot points and scenarios where there's a pervading sense of familiarity through it.

->Open Spoiler<-

I'm not sure what the point about droids is supposed to prove? Nobody has claimed that it doesn't fit in with the logistics of the SW universe. In both IV and VII, however, the central conceit of the opening half hour is that important information is stored in a lovable droid, who serves to drag a no-mark Jedi-in-waiting into a bigger affair. That's where the familiarity lies, and my initial reaction on seeing this opening was that of d?j? vu. The entire set up of bringing the lass into the story could have been wholly different. BB8 could, with some creativity, have still been a central player, so there's no need to lose him.

I'm not going over every similarity bit by bit because it sucks all the joy out of remembering the film, and turns it into a tedious memory test. I think different people are accepting of different levels of similarity, which is fair enough. I enjoyed the film and don't want to piss on anyone's parade. The internal logic of the SW Galaxy is not an issue with these similarities, I personally just wish they'd done something different to the Death Star threat, which felt weak.

Nail on head - its not just ep4 that there is loads ripped from; A full section of ROTJ is in there too, with wayyyyy too similar family shenanigans of empire.