Official F1/Motorsport thread

[Richard.John]

I wondered why the FIA didn't call the result at half distance, but no doubt it was to do with legal issues like if they ran the race, they fulfilled their obligations to the circuit owners or TV, blah,blah,blah Terrible for the fans of course, particulalrly the way they led them on by forming up on the grid just to retire. I read on another site that Adrian Newey was asked why theydid it(took to the grid) and his reply was that they were putting on a show for the fans. Hmmm.


And that is a stroke of genius by the IRL. Who wouldn't take them up on their offer.

[Darwock]

Terrible for the fans of course, particulalrly the way they led them on by forming up on the gird just to retire.

These theatrics are one of the reasons why I'm beginning to suspect this whole incident has roots in the GPWCs tussle for power. They withdrew in the most public and embarrassing way imaginable.

If the Michelin teams were prepared to forfeit points (doesn't happen- null and void race) in exchange for a chicane then why were they not prepared to take penalties for a switch to safer, less effective tyres?

Because they knew the race would never be allowed to proceed as a non-championship event?

hmmm, reeks of politics to me.

[Richard.John]

Absolutely. The way they sat in the garages, just suggests that they were waiting for the stewards to restart, and cave in to the pressure and build a temporary chicane.

You also have to question the safety brigade as these were the same people that let KR run with a flatspotted tyre which could've killed him and Button if things had turned out differently.

[Darwock]

Correspondence between FIA and Michelin:

Michelin letter to FIA June 18th:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/2121404485__19_06_2005_Indy_michelin_letter.pdf

FIA response to Michelin June 19th:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/477694380__19_06_2005_FIA_letter_reply.pdf

Michelin response June 19th:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/1948071003__19_06_2005_Michelin_indy_letter_2.pdf

FIA response June 19th:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/1491856112__19_06_2005_FIA_letter_reply_2.pdf

[gtskater]

So, who do you think led the decision not to run?

Was it Michelin simply not accepting any solution the FIA proposed?

Or was it the teams telling Micheling not to accept any FIA proposed solution?

[Richard.John]

It was probably Michelin's legal team as they had declared the tyres to be unsafe, so it would have been open season on the French company if somebody was seriously injured or killed as a result of a failure.

[Morcerf]

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_news_item.php?fes_art_id=24901

Interview with Jean Todt, Ferrari, about the US GP. At one point, when asked about whether its more important to run the sport under the regulations in force than to put on a show, he says :

"I don't think people think about the show"

Is he insane!? Not sure what people he is referring to, assuming the public, but why else would we watch it if not for the show, i.e. a race???

He seems to be very out of touch, and Ferrari seem extremely selfish. Fair enough, it wasn't their problem, but they have a responsibility as much as the rest of the teams to preserve the image of Formula 1. They could have helped come up with a solution and didn't - I think that is unforgivable to be honest.

[VR46]

It was probably Michelin's legal team as they had declared the tyres to be unsafe, so it would have been open season on the French company if somebody was seriously injured or killed as a result of a failure.

Spot on, that was first thing that came to my mind on Sunday.

About time in F1 they changed their way of doing things ie. to make a ruling change etc, they only need something like 80% of teams to agree, Ferrari seem to dispute/disagree with everything proposed - and that's coming from a Ferrari fan.

[Richard.John]

Interview with Jean Todt, Ferrari, about the US GP. At one point, when asked about whether its more important to run the sport under the regulations in force than to put on a show, he says :

"I don't think people think about the show"

Is he insane!? Not sure what people he is referring to, assuming the public, but why else would we watch it if not for the show, i.e. a race???

He seems to be very out of touch, and Ferrari seem extremely selfish. Fair enough, it wasn't their problem, but they have a responsibility as much as the rest of the teams to preserve the image of Formula 1. They could have helped come up with a solution and didn't - I think that is unforgivable to be honest.

To be fair, the onus wasn't on them to come up with a solution it was on Michelin. They brought an inferior product to the race and then complained and wanted the rules changed when they realised that they couldn't win with it. What's next, Honda discovering a fault in their engines which means they blow too easily at high revs so they appeal to the FIA that on safety grounds all engines must run at max rpm of 16,000 otherwise they wont race?

[Darwock]

Yep, exactly... there's a soundfile of an unedited interview with Paul Stoddart doing the rounds which I recommend you check out - he's asked whether this had anything to do with Jean Todt and he replies (in as many words) 'nope, Jean had nothing to do with it, he just very nicely stayed out of all discussions'. If Ferrari's vote had been called for on the matter I'm sure it would have been given, but the FIA rejected Michelin's proposal of changing the track outright.

[Alastair]

The inevitable court hearing

The FIA has summoned the seven Michelin teams to a hearing of the World Motor Sport Council next Wednesday (June 29).

The meeting is being held ?further to events at the 2005 United States Grand Prix?, according to an FIA statement.

It is anticipated that possible penalties for the teams who boycotted the Indianapolis race will be discussed at the hearing.

[mid]

Of course, they didn't technically boycott - they all retired from the race after the parade lap because their cars weren't safe. They can prove they weren't safe because they've got a letter from Michelin saying so.

The only people at fault here really are Michelin for not making tyres that work and possibly the Indy people for changing the track at short notice - carving those chevrons - which caused a big enough tyrewear change for Michelins to catastrophically fail.

Remember, the only reason Bridgestone didn't hit the same issue is that their subsidiary Firestone got to test in Indycar and fixed the problem.

[Darwock]

I see it as a boycott because they did have options to race within the limits of the tyres. But they chose not to.

[Alastair]

I think it was Michelin that boycotted. I doubt the teams will get any trouble from this but it's def the end for Michelin, maybe not immediately but their contract wont be renewed for sure.

[Darwock]

I was thinking about that, I mean the way it was described to us by Brundle & co, Michelin could choose to withhold their tyres from the teams and that's how they wouldn't have been able to race. But this obviously didn't happen!! Because the cars were all there, going round the track with their tyres on. So that means it must have been the individual team's decision.

And when you think about it, the suggestions made by the FIA for how to deal with it were not measures that could be implemented by Michelin - it had to be the teams choice to change tyre/back off in T13/come in to the pits when required.