Want to stab a burglar? Go on, then.

[toythatkills]

Ken Clarke says that nobody should be prosecuted for using "reasonable force" to protect themselves and their homes, which is a reaction to that case the other day of a burglar being stabbed to death.

This basically means that if you stab a burglar to death, you're in the clear. I wouldn't call stabbing someone to death "reasonable force" necessarily, but it's all it can mean considering the case that he's referring to.

While on the face of it this law is desirable because the burglars shouldn't f**king be there in the first place, I'm sure there's a reason why this isn't specifically the law right now. Want to invite someone to your house and then stab them to death and claim that they were robbing you?

Go for it!

[Neon Ignition]

It's way too white wash a stance. People should completely be able to defend themselves and their homes from intruders and be protected by the law up till a point as for too long the victim has been at greater risk of prosecution than the criminal is but there's a limit, lol. I can understand someone panickly grabbing a nearby knife to fend off a burglar and in the heat of it stabbing them but if the body turns up with the multiple stab wounds it suggests something of greater concern. The law needs a strong dose of common sense and less binary approaches to situations.

[dataDave]

Yeah, I have to agree. If I caught an intruder in my place I wouldn't think twice about cracking him around the face with a cricket bat. If I fracture his skull then so be it, because I really don't know how hard I'd have to hit someone to KO them, but I doubt I'd go all out and machete him up into little pieces, then make a pile out of him for masturbation purposes afterwards - I'd expect to be rightly reprimanded for such an act.

Three times my old work place got broken into and three times the police couldn't find the kids who did it, despite CCTV and footprints everywhere. Useless.

[davek22]

It's a very emotive subject this. The old saying "an englishmans home is his castle" still holds a lot of sway, especially with older conservative MPs. I personally think clarification of this law is long overdue. The case a few years back of the farmer shooting the burglar in the back and being sent to jail was a very dodgy case.
In his interview earlier Ken Clarke specifically mentioned exceptions like shooting someone in the back, most likely as reference to the farmer case. Personaly in my view anyone who breaks into someones house surrenders all their normal rights as soon as they enter the house.

[Plough Boy]

The case a few years back of the farmer shooting the burglar in the back and being sent to jail was a very dodgy case.

Tony Martin.
Poor bloke had been harrassed for months by a load of gypos and then when 2 tried to break into his farm he shot one.
Whilst I don't disagree with the action he took there were 2 major factors the police had to take into account.
The first was that he sat waiting for them with his shotgun so his actions were totally pre meditated and not 'in the heat of the moment'.
Secondly instead of phoning the police after the incident he went down to the pub and boasted about what he'd done whilst the gypo lay bleeding out in the grass.
In my eyes they got what they deserved but he had to do time really.

[abigsmurf]

Worth noting that Tony Martin shot the kid in back as he was trying to get away, it was an execution, not defence. Also, he'd lost his gun licence before because of irresponsible use of it (he'd fired it at a car) and the gun he owned was illegal.

Since then he's been involved in the BNP and National Front. Don't have much sympathy for the kid who was killed (he'd been arrested something like 20 times before this incident, quite an acheivement at 16) but Tony Martin wasn't exactly the saint he was made out to be.

[Anpanman]

I know we don't have all the facts to this case but didn't the guy who did the stabbing have not one, not two but four of them to deal with.

[randombs]

People often get annoyed when ministers say this stuff in case it gives burglars more incentive to get even more tooled up as they'll expect to be greeted by baseball bats, golf clubs and kitchen knives.

I'd have thought reasonable force is regarding stopping a crime taking place. I'm not sure exactly how it works but I think if a burglar breaks in and is already making away with your ltd edition pink Gamecube, you can't throw a knife at them, even if you think it would be the best(read: coolest) thing to do at the time. But then, you're allowed to defend yourself and your stuff, but I think it's to do with the perceived threat as well.

I don't know how many times you'd need to stab someone before they'll stop, but if it's more than once then I wouldn't be surprised if the term 'stabbed to death' sneaks in. Couldn't one stab be enough to stab someone to death if they then die from the wound?

I'd just do whatever it took at the time and then let the law deal with it afterwards. Rather that than let someone do whatever to me and/or my stuff because I'm scared of the legal consequences of hitting them with a golf club.

Also, I think the type of weapon is vitally important when dealing with these cases - army knife will get you much less sympathy than a kitchen knife, etc

[^Katsu]

it was an execution

Not unless he had got him downed and then smooshed his head off golf style with the Shotty butt? Sounds like a n00b tbh

[vanpeebles]

Tony Martin should have got a medal the size of a dustbin lid. It's about time we had some proper laws instead of faggot **** ones.

[Matt]

You find four masked men in your house, you tell me the definition of "reasonable force". Your heart is pumping, Fight or Flight kicks in, the adrenaline goes round your sytem, you try to control your fear. You've no idea of their intentions, you've got a family to protect, you start hitting and don't stop until they're down on the floor. And then you make sure they stay down. Whatever it takes.

Someone steps into your house uninvited, they immediately lose all their bull**** human rights.

[Baseley09]

Completely agree, you should assume that if they are there to rape your house, they are also willing to rape you of your life.

[merf]

Good, i hope we see a deluge of thief stabbings and lose this wet twatish view that somehow the rights of the criminal are equal to that of the victim.

I know the arguments about it leading to tooled up crims etc but its time something was done to redress the balance a bit, scum should be treated as scum.

[Robster]

I keep my house insurance under my bed and always will. Its not a knife but if I hit someone with it I dare say it could seriously injure someone.

I dont keep knives under my bed but to put things into context and perspective if I am cornered by 2 burgalars in my kitchen while investigating a noise and have no house insurance I will go for the knive in cutlery draw and use it.

My take on it is the force you use is allowable to your circumstances within reason.

Flip side to this is now junkies et al who burgle peoples house's will be armed to the teeth now to protect themselves and ensure they make a successful robbery.

Food for thought .....

[Robster]

Not unless he had got him downed and then smooshed his head off golf style with the Shotty butt? Sounds like a n00b tbh

Katsu I salute you !!