United Kingdom V: Son of a beach

[Team Andromeda]

So the TB example isn't relevant because there is no vaccine and everything else is an unknown. There is no herd immunity right now.

There's no vaccine for the cold, no one has complete immunity and can catch it again and again. But with enough exposure over the years, most peoples immune system is able to handle it.

[Dogg Thang]

Again, that requires it going through the entire population, killing everyone it can, overwhelming health services and total mayhem. That’s not a plan. It’s a survival hope.

And we know a lot about it. It’s a total myth to say nobody knows about it. We know a lot about covid19 itself and have a huge bank of learning from outbreaks of other diseases. The World Health Organisation has plenty of info and daily updates here: https://www.who.int/emergencies/dise...ronavirus-2019 The UK is currently actively ignoring their recommendations.

[Asura]

Again, that requires it going through the entire population, killing everyone it can, overwhelming health services and total mayhem. That’s not a plan. It’s a survival hope.

DT, this is not what is going on, and using such inflammatory language is not helpful. Some people are panicking and it's this which is fuelling it.

Businesses up and down the country are being advised to make it possible for people to work from home, based on advice from the Home Office. People in general are clearly buying stuff so they can voluntarily either self-isolate or generally isolate themselves more.

If there's no immunity built up from people catching the disease, we can't just quarantine everyone in hazmat suits for 2 years until they find a vaccine. That's simply not feasible. We have to assume that people will build up an immunity because the only alternative is unthinkable, and this is generally how diseases work.

What do you suggest they do that they're not doing? Because if your solution is uncompromising to the point where there are zero deaths, it's simply not going to work. People are going to die purely because so much of society is focused on COVID-19, leaving people with other diseases potentially without the care they need.

[fishbowlhead]

They get the virus and don't die.

This

[Dogg Thang]

DT, this is not what is going on, and using such inflammatory language is not helpful. Some people are panicking and it's this which is fuelling it.

When there is no immunity currently existing, explain how a 'herd immunity' plan letting it run through the population does anything other than what I've described. Without the actual immunity part, how does it work?

As for what do I suggest they do that they're not doing, I've already said it - follow the advice of the WHO. And that requires social distancing. It requires closing schools, colleges, limiting gatherings, getting people to work from home wherever possible in any form, when they can't it means preparing for that and making sure distances and safeguards are put in place and generally protecting as much of the population as possible. As you say, people are going to get it. But if you can keep it slowed, then you don't end up with an explosion of cases like Italy saw so that at least your health services don't get overwhelmed and you increase the chance of people making it through to a point where a vaccine is developed. What I suggest is simply listening to the experts. Not just shrugging your shoulders and saying "well people are going to die."

Edit: The article Charles posted a few pages back has a serious amount of hard info and stats and history and is worth a read - https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coron...e-f4d3d9cd99ca

Yet another edit: Just on the subject of panic because you brought it up, one really good way to prevent panic is to take control of a situation and take active steps to tackle a crisis. That is exactly what is not happening right now. More than inflammatory language, the seeming lack of actual plan or leadership here on a national level is going to contribute to panic. A "just take it" approach is not going to reduce panic.

[fishbowlhead]

Again, that requires it going through the entire population, killing everyone it can, overwhelming health services and total mayhem. That’s not a plan. It’s a survival hope.

And we know a lot about it. It’s a total myth to say nobody knows about it. We know a lot about covid19 itself and have a huge bank of learning from outbreaks of other diseases. The World Health Organisation has plenty of info and daily updates here: https://www.who.int/emergencies/dise...ronavirus-2019 The UK is currently actively ignoring their recommendations.

That's not how this is going to work or pan out DT, at some stage it will end up going through or in contact with most the population, it will kill off some weak older people (that had health issues anyway most likely) most people that get sick from it will end up with a natural immunity, thats just how viruses work.

67 million people in the UK, so far 10? have died.
7 billion on the planet, 5000? have died so far.

This is business as usual people, a few are going to die, majority wont.

Can everyone now stop loosing their minds over this now?

[MartyG]

If 7 billion people get infected, about 140 million people will die.

[Dogg Thang]

it will kill off some weak older people (that had health issues anyway most likely)

That's... that's what killing everyone it can means.

[Neon Ignition]

The UK Government only has one plan for the virus and that's to hold off action until Easter so it minimises NHS staffing as much as possible. Thye're definitely in with the point of view that significant numbers are going to die which is why they're already prepping the public consciousness for it, otherwise you wouldn't have the PM stand in front of cameras before the outbreak rises saying 'many families are going to lose loved ones early'. It's an insane statement to make unless your nation is actively at war.

That being said there is an air of acceptance too because it's coming, it's long term and there isn't much that can be done about it either. Schools... I won't be surprised if they never close. The government might advise staying at home over Easter and class it as achieving the same but these places need to reopen and then it'll kick into high gear regardless. Only nation wide quarantine to isolate infected individuals with a slow reopening would be effective which the UK will never do.

Watch it, another few weeks and even the worst hit nations will start to loosen their health actions and the virus will begin to really take hold. They'll change tact quick to try and fend off global recession and put finance before people very soon.

[Team Andromeda]

The UK Government only has one plan for the virus and that's to hold off action until Easter so it minimises NHS staffing as much as possible

Yeah when loads of staff look to take annual leave, more so the one with kids.

Most prob they're hoping for Easter and Spring because that's when the number of people needing Hospital treatment with bad colds, chest infections, Flu Ect tends to drop and so the NHS is better able to handle an outbreak of this

Sepsis is a far bigger killer

[Cassius_Smoke]

You have to remember that this has a much higher kill percentage than the flu, its just that at the moment its not as wide spread as the flu. The flu has like 0.6% death rate and Covid19 has 1.6%. Once its widespread its going to kill a lot of people. I don't think closing schools or stocking toilet paper is going to make any difference, we are going to get it and people you know could die from it.

[Neon Ignition]

That was the speculation on the radio, that the government knows NHS staff will aim to be off for 2 weeks over Easter but if they shut schools down now all those NHS'ers suddenly have childcare issues etc from now instead and a 2 week issue becomes a 4-5 week one. I can easily believe it as well because nothing about that theory considers the welfare of either staff or patient.



Realistically this guy making the decisions so no-one should expect morals to be involved in decision making

[Team Andromeda]

You have to remember that this has a much higher kill percentage than the flu, its just that at the moment its not as wide spread as the flu. .

Sepsis is ever more and that's horrible and so frightening as it's so hard to spot. I've seen it 1st hand and it doesn't just affect people with underlying health issues

[Neon Ignition]

The other thing is the virus doesn't give you the trots and you self isolate for 7-14 days... so how much toilet paper do people think they'll need?!

Well, unless your Italy of course. That free Hub Premium Sub will be doing wonders for Andrex shares

[Dogg Thang]

Unless I've missed a news story, sepsis cases are not growing at an exponential rate.