NTSC-RePlay 016: Missing, Presumed

[Neon Ignition]

Welcome to the second home for the anniversary line of threads, continuing to delve into the topical history of the site and to re-explore conversations past. Moving out of the gaming discussion realm we come face to face with the second half of the duo, the flip side of the coin - other topics. Because...


This isn't NTSC-UK... this is NTSC-RePlay


A tiny bit over fifteen years ago, on 06 May 2007, iloveannie posted a thread that asked 'Someone has to ask... why did the parents of the little girl leave their children alone?'

The topic being in reference to the freshly reported absence of Madeleine McCann. Fifteen years later and the case remains open despite some recent movements that suggest a likely person responsible. It's all but a closed case in terms of what her fate was but the specifics remain unknown to this day. The topic launched over forty pages of debate over the case and circumstances as well as the coverage that spooled out at the time. In the following years coverage has never been far away and £11m has been spent searching for her.

Returning to the subject in 2022 finds many of us being parents to our own spawn of Bordersdown. A greater level of understanding of the situation as well as the practical realities of being a parent now exist. So, looking back at the case of the missing girl:

Has your original perspective on the circumstances of her disappearance changed since 2007?
Did anything change as a result of this case?

[Asura]

Has your original perspective on the circumstances of her disappearance changed since 2007?

I have a slightly weird perspective on this, as I was in Japan before, during, and after the major hubbub around this, and as a result, I totally missed it; like it was mentioned in the news that a British girl had gone missing in Portrugal but that was pretty much it.

So when I visited the UK, there was a point (I think around Christmas that year) when I was visiting family and it came on the (muted) TV, and I honestly asked who this girl was, who was always being shown on the news. My family were stunned until I explained, but the point, for the purpose of this thread, is my dad walked me through the publicly known story of what had happened...

... and I immediately said "So, are the parents in prison, or what?"

And again, everyone was stunned. I recall my mother got very bent-out-of-shape, "how could you say something so awful".

But I pointed out that people have been shopped in for leaving a toddler in a locked car on an off-license forecourt for 30 seconds while they jump in/out of the shop, and I was genuinely confused as to why the parents weren't seen in a negative light.

Well, as you can imagine, that started quite the family row, because my father admitted he thought exactly the same thing.

He related a story about how when I was that age, we stayed at a Butlins somewhere, and they had a service where the parents could leave their kids in the room, and a paid "minder" would keep an eye on the rooms per-floor, and would contact the restaurant if their kids seemed unsettled (the night-life was only a short stroll from the hotel room). My parents paid for this holiday knowing this was the system, and it would allow them (for the first time in years) to go for a few nice nights out. But they tried on the second night, and while sitting at the restaurant, both of them were at a loose end, and couldn't focus on having a good time. They had to get the food in a container and go back to the room, because they couldn't shake the idea that something might happen.

Due to that, he says "don't judge... mile in their shoes", but he's walked that mile so he feels he can judge them.

My thoughts on this persist. Maybe it's because I don't have all the background info everyone else was drip-fed by the tabloids, but I still don't know how they weren't pulled up on it.

[Cassius_Smoke]

I think, although they weren't pulled up on leaving the children in a legal way, most the the British public and tabloids pulled them apart over it.

My thinking is simply that, they went and had a meal with friends leaving the kids to sleep, and although periodically checking them, they were unfortunate victims of an opportunist. I don't believe they had any involvement in it either accidently or deliberately. And I dont believe any of the conspiracies circling it.

It was just bad luck, wrapped in a ****e police investigation that blundered the evidence and didn't act fast enough meaning the bad guys got away.

[wakka]

I have a slightly weird perspective on this, as I was in Japan before, during, and after the major hubbub around this, and as a result, I totally missed it; like it was mentioned in the news that a British girl had gone missing in Portrugal but that was pretty much it.

So when I visited the UK, there was a point (I think around Christmas that year) when I was visiting family and it came on the (muted) TV, and I honestly asked who this girl was, who was always being shown on the news. My family were stunned until I explained, but the point, for the purpose of this thread, is my dad walked me through the publicly known story of what had happened...

... and I immediately said "So, are the parents in prison, or what?"

And again, everyone was stunned. I recall my mother got very bent-out-of-shape, "how could you say something so awful".

But I pointed out that people have been shopped in for leaving a toddler in a locked car on an off-license forecourt for 30 seconds while they jump in/out of the shop, and I was genuinely confused as to why the parents weren't seen in a negative light.

Well, as you can imagine, that started quite the family row, because my father admitted he thought exactly the same thing.

He related a story about how when I was that age, we stayed at a Butlins somewhere, and they had a service where the parents could leave their kids in the room, and a paid "minder" would keep an eye on the rooms per-floor, and would contact the restaurant if their kids seemed unsettled (the night-life was only a short stroll from the hotel room). My parents paid for this holiday knowing this was the system, and it would allow them (for the first time in years) to go for a few nice nights out. But they tried on the second night, and while sitting at the restaurant, both of them were at a loose end, and couldn't focus on having a good time. They had to get the food in a container and go back to the room, because they couldn't shake the idea that something might happen.

Due to that, he says "don't judge... mile in their shoes", but he's walked that mile so he feels he can judge them.

My thoughts on this persist. Maybe it's because I don't have all the background info everyone else was drip-fed by the tabloids, but I still don't know how they weren't pulled up on it.

They were massively pulled up on it. They were castigated in the press and were the chief suspects of the Portuguese police.

[Asura]

They were massively pulled up on it. They were castigated in the press and were the chief suspects of the Portuguese police.

I see. Yeah, I missed all of that.

[Neon Ignition]

There might be a report or something that supports them somewhere but the 'we checked on them regularly through the meal' always sounded like BS bolted on to try and lessen the position that they left their kids unattended. For the usual length of a meal someone would be up and down like a yo-yo if you were regularly checking and it would have been picked up on a lot faster. It doesn't make a material difference to what happened but it's those kinds of things that I feel made it easy for the doubt to set it at the time.


That aside though, I recall staying at Blackpool on the front in the very early 90's. I'd have probably been around 10 or 11 and my sister would have been about 5, it was the illuminations and we were on the front. My parents went downstairs at night to the bar they had down there and we were left on our own for most of the evening. We watched the trams pass outside along the sea front, bounced on the beds etc. It always reminded me of how it wasn't long before there was a more relaxed attitude to keeping an eye on your kids. I think I was 14 the first time they went on holiday for a week without me too.

I think part of the issue as well is this happened in the years after the Bulger case, it smacked twice as hard as a wtf moment. At face value it's obvious - but it's still incredibly common place.

Every single day I drive home and there's an area I pass through of homes and kids are out and about in the streets without a single adult in sight ever. We're talking ages 3 and up unattended by busy roads, yards away from a busy main road. I headed to Manchester one morning at around 6am and saw a 3 and a 5 year old wandering alone. These kids are dragged up rather than raised up so it's like survival in spite of their parents rather than thanks to them.

My stance is the same now as a parent as it was then. I wouldn't have gone for the meal, or if I had it would have meant planning it around the kids being there as well. As much as parents should have a healthy break from their kids, a holiday isn't the place to grab that. I wouldn't even entrust my kids to a daycare style function on holiday, not to a babysitter either. Me, the wife, my parents, their teacher, someone has tabs on each of them every minute of the day. You can't watch them 24/7 and you need to be wary of smothering them too, we've always encouraged them to mix with other kids and be socially confident etc but leaving them completely unattended is simply an abandonment of responsibility.

You get too much peer group pressure in parents too. Things come up like "Well, when their friends are going out together when they're 9 or 12 you can't stop yours" ---- Yes ---- Yes I can. Stop being so weak, it's your child and your responsibility as their parent who knows full well the social and practical dangers of the world to safeguard your child. Too often that argument is a front for a parent who actually feels that once their kids starts going off doing their own thing it frees them up to do what they want to do also. Until they're at the appropriate age and stage of development to navigate solo it's all on the parent.

That said, they definitely unfairly bore more blame at the time in the public and media's eyes than the person who broke in and took her.

[MartyG]

Lots of people have been conned into giving them A LOT of money,

[QualityChimp]

This is one of those stories where, despite having no inside knowledge of the case or the family, everybody feels entitled to an opinion.

They definitely made a mistake that they'll regret for the rest of their lives.
It's definitely something parents have done for generations before them.
It's definitely changed the attitudes of parents since, who have reassessed how safe it is to leave your children unattended.

It makes me wonder how many children have been better safeguarded because their parents didn't want them to be "the next Madeline"?

[fuse]

As someone that's never really read too much about the circumstances of the event, I think "it's a tragic thing that happened" is about as far as I'm capable and prepared to comment. The moral panic surrounding it, along with its continued presence in our media landscape and the utterly disproportionate volume of police resources spent on it though, are a national embarrassment.