BPX074: Turning Red

[Neon Ignition]

The Neverending Wait

We now stand an estimated 18 months away from the next General Election. Tories have until late January 2025 to hold one but holding the election post October 2024 would mean taking a huge gamble on allowing winter cost of living stories to dominate their campaign, a Christmas trail and cold weather putting off the older voters that they depend on so heavily.

Each passing month narrows the gap that the party can make any real headway toward remotely rehabilitating their image. It started with a glass of Prosecco, then it was multiple instances, then a pinched bottom in a corridor embrace and faster and faster the frequency and scale of scandal built up like a locomotive and even now, as people consider Sunak's premiership to be calmer than what came before, heads are continuously being lined up for the chopping block as corruption and scandal continues to be revealed.

Red Versus Blue

Voters have an array of party options to choose from but the hard practical reality is that we largely have a two party system with Labour filling that other space. Outside of specific conditions a vote for a non-Labour/Tory party is more beneficial to the Tories than a vote for Labour as it lessens the weight of pressure against them and potentially pushes the party more toward a coalition scenario involving the Lib Dems, who regardless of party sided with is often a go to for exiting Tories.

But as things stand the Tories face a nightmare scenario in 2024, a complete annihilation at the hands of Labour who themselves have undergone a complete u-turn in fortunes following the Corybn/Brexit era General Election that saw the part decimated. With a new more centre politics stance, the party is headed into the next General Election in an incredibly strong position - but not everyone is happy about this.

They're All The Same

For some, a vote for Labour remains a nose held too strongly. Unhappy with the present form they have taken their vote will go elsewhere or for some they will still be willing to vote Tory despite the legacy they now leave behind.

If things remain as they are, does the modern Labour represent a party you could vote for in 2024 and if not, what are the core reasons they still can't win you over despite the current situation the nation faces of rampant mass systemic corruption, incompetence and purposeful economic and social harm to the public?


The Poll Result is set to Private

[Cassius_Smoke]

You can never discount the Tories. They own most of the news outlets, they get the most donations, have the most money and their corruption runs deep. Before the voting even happens they are on the way to victory.
I think Labour are only attractive because they aren't the Tories.

[Golgo]

You can never discount the Tories. They own most of the news outlets, they get the most donations, have the most money and their corruption runs deep. Before the voting even happens they are on the way to victory.
I think Labour are only attractive because they aren't the Tories.

All true. Plus they are now working to actively disenfranchise those demographics who might vote against them.

[Asura]

I think Labour are only attractive because they aren't the Tories.

Yeah but to use a vulgar analogy, that makes them "attractive" in the manner of being a heterosexual 18 year-old on prom night when his prom queen girlfriend says MOUNT ME

[QualityChimp]

This is what the country is up against.
Most of the comments are criticising Purkiss and the way she reacted, not what the caller said.
Purkiss suggested she could guess what newspaper the caller reads and her clever reply to that was "I don't read anything!"

Embedded Tweet

[CMcK]

Despite the Tories being economy destroying corrupt scum I still couldn’t bring myself to vote for Labour. And I am a former Labour voter. The Labour Party in Scotland burnt a lot of bridges with its stance on independence and being Tory shills. Even now they’re just ignoring the harm caused by leaving the EU too afraid to upset the gammon voter.
The “UK” media has taken us into the same default two party election as AmericaLand and has totally disregard the Lib Dems, Greens etc. How are people meant to be made aware of alternatives if apparently impartial broadcasters just show what they want?

[Cepp]

Tories won here by a slim majority last time. I don't think Labour are very good right now but there's no other choice.

Ultimately I'll vote for whoever gets the Tories out.

[Neon Ignition]

I have no qualms about voting Labour on several fronts but admittedly the picture varies depending on the location of the voter.

In Scotland you're voting based on an entirely different playbook so there's an entirely different rationale involved. I think for the next GE the biggest danger there is that Sturgeon is happy to openly lie that a vote for SNP equates to a vote for Independence putting Scotland at risk of something much worse than Brexit simply because she's so opportunistic.

I live in a town that is historically 99% Labour voting, it's a simple seat flipping town so there's a very binary approach to voting that needs to see it land Red not Blue next time.

The biggest issue is more broadly, whilst I can completely run with the concerns of voters who have been affected by the Corbyn era issues when it comes to the more long standing broader views I struggle to square the reputation that Labour has on several fronts with the reality. In many cases the reputation Labour has is purely born of the lies the Tories have spread about them. When you look at the Tories as well, it's like being asked to choose between spending a month living with a tax dodger or serial killer.

I'm not sure I can think of a single argument against Labour that the Tories don't fail at ten times more

[Asura]

it's like being asked to choose between spending a month living with a tax dodger or serial killer.

My analogy was sexier

[Neon Ignition]

Just listened to the clip above, it sums up the typical experience perfectly.

It's also amazing how the Tories have washed away the fact they they were the devoutly pro-EU party, they pushed to stay, they campaigned to stay and then spent three years internally fighting in a manner that stalled its progress until the exact same party won a majority on the basis of 'getting their jobs done'.

Since Stamar has been in charge Brexit is one issue Labour has been absolutely on point on in their approach

[QualityChimp]

It's a shame the Lib Dems have trashed their cred since the coalition because it would be nice to have more than two options the Conservatives and the party most likely to unseat the Conservatives.

Green are probably the most forward-thinking party, but I fear most people see them as a one-priority party and wouldn't be good at anything else which is a shame because the current lot aren't good at anything. Full stop!

Mod note: The person who said they'd vote Conservative has been permabanned.

This is obviously a joke and an opportunity to say this site doesn't try to be an echo chamber, it's just the majority of us seem to think alike. It's good to see other sides of the argument.

I was looking at https://ground.news/, which looks at news articles and tells you of the bias that site might have.
Helps look at those blindspots.
For example:
The Independent, Lean Left, High Factuality, owner - Other: Evgeny Lebedev
Evening Standard, Lean Right, Mixed Factuality, Owner - Other: Evgeny Lebedev, Other: Alfred Harmsworth (Barrister)
Sky News, Center, High Factuality, Wealthy Private Owner: Roberts Family

Looking at the article on the NHS leaders wanting to speak to Sunak to avoid further strikes, The Independent goes with:
NHS faces biggest strike yet as thousands of nurses and ambulance crews walk out
‘We’re facing a crunch point’

The Evening Standard says:
NHS faces biggest strike yet as nurses and ambulance crews walk out
Health service leaders urge the public to use emergency services ‘wisely’ as patients warned of more disruption.

Sky News says:
Nursing union leader calls on Sunak to intervene as biggest NHS walkout in history begins
Tens of thousands of NHS workers including nurses in England, and GMB union ambulance workers in England and Wales, are taking industrial action today in what is expected to be the biggest strike in the history of the NHS.

[Lebowski]

It's a shame the Lib Dems have trashed their cred since the coalition because it would be nice to have more than two options the Conservatives and the party most likely to unseat the Conservatives.

Green are probably the most forward-thinking party, but I fear most people see them as a one-priority party and wouldn't be good at anything else which is a shame because the current lot aren't good at anything. Full stop!

Mod note: The person who said they'd vote Conservative has been permabanned.

This is obviously a joke and an opportunity to say this site doesn't try to be an echo chamber, it's just the majority of us seem to think alike. It's good to see other sides of the argument.

I was looking at https://ground.news/, which looks at news articles and tells you of the bias that site might have.
Helps look at those blindspots.
For example:
The Independent, Lean Left, High Factuality, owner - Other: Evgeny Lebedev
Evening Standard, Lean Right, Mixed Factuality, Owner - Other: Evgeny Lebedev, Other: Alfred Harmsworth (Barrister)
Sky News, Center, High Factuality, Wealthy Private Owner: Roberts Family

Looking at the article on the NHS leaders wanting to speak to Sunak to avoid further strikes, The Independent goes with:
NHS faces biggest strike yet as thousands of nurses and ambulance crews walk out
‘We’re facing a crunch point’

The Evening Standard says:
NHS faces biggest strike yet as nurses and ambulance crews walk out
Health service leaders urge the public to use emergency services ‘wisely’ as patients warned of more disruption.

Sky News says:
Nursing union leader calls on Sunak to intervene as biggest NHS walkout in history begins
Tens of thousands of NHS workers including nurses in England, and GMB union ambulance workers in England and Wales, are taking industrial action today in what is expected to be the biggest strike in the history of the NHS.

Its really interesting that left and right leaning papers are pointing the finger at Sunak, and not union bosses, everyone can see what Sunak and his party are trying to do and are not onboard with it, its been pretty hard to turn the public against nursing staff when a year ago the goverment where praising them, and its nice to see that the mainstream press is not even trying to do that anymore.

Who would you trust overworked and understaffed Nurses or a oligarch PM trying to roll back workers rights 100 years.

[Asura]

The Evening Standard says:
NHS faces biggest strike yet as nurses and ambulance crews walk out
Health service leaders urge the public to use emergency services ‘wisely’ as patients warned of more disruption.

Related to how we don't teach proper critical thinking to kids, and people grow up accepting what they read. I had a discussion at work recently and someone said they didn't think a headline like this was biased, that it was a statement of fact. It kinda blew his mind when I said

NHS faces biggest strike yet as government believes staff must accept real-terms pay cut

and made the point that you could go with this headline.

[Neon Ignition]

That's why the red mist effect can be frustrating, it takes a genuine monumental wave to get the Tories out. To think that the party is at all considered electable at this point is a damning reflection of UK politics

[Asura]

That's why the red mist effect can be frustrating, it takes a genuine monumental wave to get the Tories out. To think that the party is at all considered electable at this point is a damning reflection of UK politics

More UK culture. We have a very strong, foundational belief in power structures and hierarchies. That's why "class" is such a big thing here. We have no formalised caste structure like some societies, but we made our own informal one based on a mixture of money and family lineage, and, critically, we have lots of things which reinforce those differences.