Lionel Messi

[ezee ryder]

Just want to say I watched the Barcelona match last night and felt privileged to watch Messi in action. His second goal was just superb and his footwork that resulted in the penalty, well, was just out of this world. It's like the ball is stuck to his foot or something. The best football player on the planet, without a shadow of a doubt.

[EJG1980]

It's actually great to be living in an age when you are able to watch live matches from almost any European league you want, and regularly see players who in the past you might have only seen once every couple of years at a major international championship.

[nakamura]

I think the people are taking the "Messi can't be the best until he's played in the Premier League" type comments to be arrogant.
.

I don't think so at the moment. The PL is producing a top level of consistant teams at the moment. Personally before 3 years ago I have never said its the best but right now I think it's the toughest place in the world. Also the way spanish teams defend is laughable at times. So much space on the ball.

Messi is amazing no doubt, perhaps the best but I think Rooney edges it.

[yesteryeargames]

Just want to say I watched the Barcelona match last night and felt privileged to watch Messi in action. His second goal was just superb and his footwork that resulted in the penalty, well, was just out of this world. It's like the ball is stuck to his foot or something. The best football player on the planet, without a shadow of a doubt.

apart from rooney

they both have different skills and no doubt messi is a true talent, but for me rooney offers more for a team than messi does.

[samanosuke]

Any non-Man Utd fans think Rooney is better than Messi? What was it Wenger said in reply to Fergie's claim that Man Utd were the better team during the invincibles season? It was something along the lines of "Everybody thinks that their wife is the most beautiful."

[NemesiS]

Utterly pointless argument, and almost as silly as console v PC debates but he’s my two bobs worth.

They are both completely different players. Messi is a close footwork dribbler who has astonishing control, vision and passing and can finish as well. I have absolutely no doubt that Messi would be a success in the English League as good players are usually good wherever they go barring exceptions. But I do feel his slightly diminutive frame would cost him over a season due to him being battered from pillar to post as he wouldn't be afforded the time on the ball that he currently enjoys in the relatively pedestrian La Liga. Look at Torres !!

Rooney is a finisher of the highest order with quite possibly the best team work rate in the world who has now scored 20 odd goals in the fastest and hardest league in the world. Again Rooney also has amazing vision and passing ability allied to his tigerish tackling and workrate. I’m also certain that if he went to Spain he would proliferate due to having more time on the ball to weave his magic and I actually think he would score more than he does now as he wouldn’t be rushed as much anticipating two footed tackles coming in a second after he got the ball. How many has Ronny scored for Madrid already and he was injured for 3-4 months. He’s filling his boots. I also think that outside Barca and Madrid, the quality gap is just too big and the rest of the teams are just makeweights in 2 team league, a la Scotland (but not that bad). In the PL we have 3 top teams, usually 4 and another 5 or 6 who can challenge for Europe, and that’s not mentioning the lesser lights who can beat anyone on their day as we have seen this season. That really doesn’t happen so much in Spain due to the gulf in class of the top two and the rest.

I can honestly say I wouldn’t swap Rooney for Messi simply because I know Rooney is guaranteed in the PL. He played second fiddle to Ronaldo for four years because of Ronny’s astonishing return, but to say he has had one good season because he’s scoring more this season is tardish to say the least. He just doing what he’s always been capable of doing now he is up front on his own and not supporting someone else form the left wing or wherever.

Both fantastic players though in their respective leagues and I would love to see them play in the same team. For United of course

[NemesiS]

Here's a good (non-English) article on the two players:

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns...league&cc=5739

LOL. I hope Tom Adams cleaned up the insides of his trousers after writing that love letter to Lionel

[SharkSkin-Man]

[FONT=Arial]
I also think that outside Barca and Madrid, the quality gap is just too big and the rest of the teams are just makeweights in 2 team league, a la Scotland (but not that bad). In the PL we have 3 top teams, usually 4 and another 5 or 6 who can challenge for Europe, and that?s not mentioning the lesser lights who can beat anyone on their day as we have seen this season. That really doesn?t happen so much in Spain due to the gulf in class of the top two and the rest.

Number of teams who have won Premier League - 4 (Blackburn, United, Chelsea, Arsenal)
Numer of teams to win La Liga in same period - 5 (Deportivo, Atletico, Valencia, Barca, Real)

Distribution of points is largely the same in both leagues, slightly more even in Spain if anything. I think more teams have been relegated in Spain on 40+ points than England, which points to a more competitive league.

[NemesiS]

But we are talking about the era of Messi and Rooney. In the 5 years he has played for Barca (2 or 3 more for Rooney), barring 07-08, only Villareal have got into the top 2. It's the same in the Prem, i'm not disputing that, Man United are top dogs with Chelsea and Arsenal while Pool on occasion will threaten like last season.

But it's our second tier of clubs that makes the difference. Man City, AV, Spurs, Everton are all well capable of getting into the top 4 and beating any of the top sides and i would wager they are better equipped than teams in the "second" tier in Spain whcih makes the PL tough. You could argue that the second tier in Spain is 6 clubs as I simply can't look past Barca and Madrid unless they catastrophically implode in a season like the scousers this season. How often do you read that Barca or Madrid have lost a game to a team in 8th. Hardly ever, but it happens here. You only have to look at Citys result at the bridge.

Regarding your stats, its all relative. Teams that are top 8 but not up to challenging will always come off with roughly the same points and that trend will continue down the table no matter what league it is.

Tbf, there isn't a lot between the Spanish and Prem. They are probably the two best leagues in the world with the Italian league on the slide imo.

[samanosuke]

Utterly pointless argument, and almost as silly as console v PC debates but he’s my two bobs worth.

They are both completely different players. Messi is a close footwork dribbler who has astonishing control, vision and passing and can finish as well. I have absolutely no doubt that Messi would be a success in the English League as good players are usually good wherever they go barring exceptions. But I do feel his slightly diminutive frame would cost him over a season due to him being battered from pillar to post as he wouldn't be afforded the time on the ball that he currently enjoys in the relatively pedestrian La Liga. Look at Torres !!

Rooney is a finisher of the highest order with quite possibly the best team work rate in the world who has now scored 20 odd goals in the fastest and hardest league in the world. Again Rooney also has amazing vision and passing ability allied to his tigerish tackling and workrate. I’m also certain that if he went to Spain he would proliferate due to having more time on the ball to weave his magic and I actually think he would score more than he does now as he wouldn’t be rushed as much anticipating two footed tackles coming in a second after he got the ball. How many has Ronny scored for Madrid already and he was injured for 3-4 months. He’s filling his boots. I also think that outside Barca and Madrid, the quality gap is just too big and the rest of the teams are just makeweights in 2 team league, a la Scotland (but not that bad). In the PL we have 3 top teams, usually 4 and another 5 or 6 who can challenge for Europe, and that’s not mentioning the lesser lights who can beat anyone on their day as we have seen this season. That really doesn’t happen so much in Spain due to the gulf in class of the top two and the rest.

I can honestly say I wouldn’t swap Rooney for Messi simply because I know Rooney is guaranteed in the PL. He played second fiddle to Ronaldo for four years because of Ronny’s astonishing return, but to say he has had one good season because he’s scoring more this season is tardish to say the least. He just doing what he’s always been capable of doing now he is up front on his own and not supporting someone else form the left wing or wherever.

Both fantastic players though in their respective leagues and I would love to see them play in the same team. For United of course

Firstly, you're right it's a pointless debate but aren't most debates? Why debate about football, or indeed any sport? Maybe Andy Gray should just tell us how it is and we should just accept his word as gospel?

You have a point though -- Rooney is a finisher of the highest order -- but looking at some of Messi's goals I feel that he is an echelon above the highest order. You say that Rooney has possibly the best workrate in the world. I must ask, what scale are you using to determine this? I've heard many pundits say the same thing about Carlos Tevez's workrate and he has scored almost as many league goals as Rooney has this season, and in the same league. Is he also the best player in the world? I wonder whether, after scoring eight goals in three games, the Barcelona dressing room told Messi he should be pulling his weight a bit more, just like Rooney does for Man Utd. Best workrate in the world -- what an arbitrary pile of bollocks if ever I heard it. Last season Messi scored almost twice as many goals as Rooney did in all competitions (38 vs 20) and even this season -- Rooney's best by far -- he has scored one more goal having played a game less. Pretty impressive for a player with an apparently lower workrate.

But for me, the only way to measure the two players is by asking yourself which player leaves you stunned after watching them perform, which player does things you've seen no other player in the world do, which player does these things on a consistent basis. I'm sorry Man Utd fans but as good as Rooney is, I don't see him as being any more special than, say, Drogba, although admittedly he's having an outstanding season. You can use a load of excuses about La Liga being easier to score in (didn't somebody already address this when they gave stats on Torres's scoring record?) or bullsh!t about Rooney doing more for the team (poor old Messi must be wondering what more he could possibly give), but the bottom line is Rooney is one of the best players of his generation and Messi is one of the best players to ever grace the game. And he's only 22.

[SharkSkin-Man]

Messi's workrate is pretty exceptional too, one of this current Barcelona teams strengths is instant pressure on the ball from all players when they lose possession, they've even managed to get Henry running about a bit when he doesn't have the ball.

[Kongster]

I'm a United fan and as much as I love Rooney, I have to say that Messi is just in a class of his own.

He has got fantastic technical qualities combined with a wonderful footballing brain. His close control and his ability to beat his opponents at speed, particularly in seemingly tight areas, is second to none - no other player in the world can dribble like he does.

He is also pretty dangerous with his passing in the final third - he has the ability to play cunning, incisive passes that can unlock defences.

He has also improved his upper body strength (anyone remember him bouncing off John Terry last season?), and is tougher than his little frame would suggest.

[endo]

LOL. I hope Tom Adams cleaned up the insides of his trousers after writing that love letter to Lionel

Small world- I used to work with him a few years back. The author of that article that is. Not Lionel Messi. Obviously.

[nakamura]

Any non-Man Utd fans think Rooney is better than Messi?

Yes me, I don't know how you figured out I was a man u fan as I don't support any team.

As for another post you made, well when I watch Rooney play I do feel wowed. He is magic, positions he pops up in, 60 yard pinpoint passes he hits, spectacular goals he scores.

Prefer Messi or not, Rooney is simply the most complete footballer I have seen im many years.

[samanosuke]

Right, now the Rooney vs Messi debate has been well and truly put to bed, my love-in with Lionel Messi shall continue. Here's another hat-trick for the archive: