Baten Kaitos - GC

[Adam Stone]

I received ?Baten Kaitos : Eternal Wings and The Lost Ocean? today (well, borrowing it from a very dear friend) I hope to write the review within the next couple of weeks but thought I would quickly share some brief impressions as I?ve noticed a few members interested in this title?

This isn?t my first encounter with the game. A couple of months back I bought the Japanese version to get a ?feel? but unlike, say Wind Waker, it is of course essential that you understand what is going on. Story driven RPGs such as this, final fantasy, Tales, etc reach out to the player?s heart rather then their thumbs imo. Of course it needs to play well but more importantly is how the game grips the player? I need to feel a relationship with the people on screen, I need to share their emotions ? to care. It simply isn?t possible to do that without understanding what is being said?

?so I quickly sold it and waited for the US release. (tho when the release came around I was far too engrossed in other games to find the time to get this, let alone not actually having the money? heh) And my interested slowly dwindled? nice to finally have it to play now though ^_^

The reason I mention the Japanese version now is because it came as quite a shock to see the US boxart. I apologize for making such a comment about a trivial thing but considering how incredible the Japanese version was? it really was lovely? (I was tempted to keep it just to look pretty on my shelf) it surprising how ugly the US is in comparison. Not that it matters though?

Before Kaitos actually starts there is a fairly nice CGI cutscene (it?s a bit too cheesy for my tastes and lacks spirit ? until the last couple of seconds?) Not that it was a surprise at all because its been featured in tones of trailers previously? but it?s great to see how crisp and clear it looks on the Gamecube. Unlike other companies Namco have proved that it is possible to have wonderfully sharp CGI cutscenes without it having to be horribly filtered and grainy.

The music is wonderful so far. It really is. Namco also seem to think so because they have included a list of every track in the menu for you to listen to as you wish. They aren?t initially all unlocked though. They only appear in the list once you?ve heard them in game. I really wish more games would do this?

I don?t know enough about the story or the characters yet? and am finding the main character a little too different from myself to form a connection (this may and most likely will change though. It did in Tales of Symphonia, that?s for sure. Even in Paper Mario? I suppose that?s due to being part of Mario?s history for so long its hard not to be connected to the little plumber, but despite that I loved his gentleness and the odd expression and gesture had tones of personality) Kalas? is well? hmm? I don?t really care much for him at the moment. There isnt really a fear or concern of dying? just, ?meh? -

There is definitely intrigue though. Right from the start there is mystery surrounding his kin and you can?t help to feel there is some important reason why he only has the one wing?

Graphically? hmmm?.

There is no doubting that the pre-rendered backgrounds look lovely. Bright, colourful, and like in, Onimusha 2 or Resident Evil Remake they are full of life. I?m sure they will only get more impressive as I progress too.

But? what Kaitos doesn?t do quite so well, not nearly as well as capcom?s titles, is combine the modeled characters seamlessly with the backgrounds. They really look as if they have been plonked there? there is very little interaction with the environments and there have been a few moments were it does distract. One example being during a conversion and a NPC not only walked through Kalas but also through some of the environment? and another time kept trying to walk forward even though there was a table in his way. Heh. The silly bugger?

Anyhoo? pfft. I don?t really care too much about things like that. Though I feel it should be mentioned because, as I said, it does distract a little. It may not happen again, and not every player may experience it.

The menu navigation and interface is impressive.

It looks very smooth and crisp? but more importantly is how easy it is to navigate. There are tones, well, literally thousands of items (called Magnus) to collect, sort and order ? and each item or weapon etc has a nice description which helps add an extra layer of depth.

I want to start taking about the gameplay mechanisms? like how the battle and leveling up works etc (I understand the card-based battle is putting some people off this?) but I need to spend some more time with it first to give a proper feedback.

Anyhoo! Back to it. Just some first-impressions really.

Oh, has anyone got this? How are you finding the battle system? How is the story progressing? Are there many side-quests?

Games like this take a while to ?get into? but I can certainly tell it isn?t a poor title. Average? Maybe?. Good? I hope so. Great? Hmm? we?ll see in a week or so I suppose

Kindest regards
Ad

[fearbat]

I've played this for a little under 20 hours now, so I'm feeling pretty settled with the game. Have to say I am enjoying the game a lot, but I'm at a point where the battle system flaws, and they are flaws, have become more evident and the battle system is only going to get tougher to handle the further along I go. I could go into the flaws but it's probably best left for later. I'll handle it though ...maybe.

[Adam Stone]

There seems to be a nice level of depth... which im slowly exploring. I haven?t the time to go into detail now about the battle but...

It definitely starts a bit... meh. But i'm finding that the more complex it becomes the more enjoyable it is too.

Are these flaws you mention due to over complexity? Or... are they the same sort of flaws present in the early hours of the game? Like how the cards are randomly selected which sometimes means, for example, you are given all defense items in an attack scenario - which means you are forced to take damage - or visa-versa?

Anyhoo? I really like how you are given a level of freedom concerning the items ? how you can create new items or how new items appear over time (like how if milk is left for a while it turns into cheese)

Overall, it?s a promising start and I look forward to playing more later ^_^

[fearbat]

Same flaws, but I have more to add. They don't spoil the game too much, but if a little more thought had gone into a few aspects this game would be SO much better. Example, you are given very usefull percentage bonuses on damage given when matching cards or creating a straight, thing is your not given any real control over your hand to create them. And even then it is picky about how it accepts them.

To go into more detail with control of your hand, lets say you have a hand of cards that isn't ideal, you have to ditch some useless cards, useless could mean as you've said Adam defensive items on an offensive move which are greyed out or health items you don't need to use at all. Thing is there is no actual option to take them out of your hand, you have to play them. When you play a greyed out card your turn ends, meaning you've just HAD to waste a turn because you just don't have a bit of control. During a battle your deck is reshuffled to be played again once you get through your cards anyway, so I don't see how they can leave out such a simple option to ditch unwanted cards.

The way it accepts pairs and straights doesn't make much sense either, for instance you can make '2 pairs' by playing a card of one value then a pair of matching valued cards and then finish the move with a matching valued card to the first, completing as a hand '2 pairs'. Right? So you would think as long as the final hand has a matching pair or the cards that consist of a straight you will recieve neccesary bonuses. Well you'd be wrong. If you play a pair with an additional card it doesn't count and if you play a hand that makes up a straight but isn't laid out in precise order that doesn't count either. Why do I have to play all the cards in order to make a straight but I don't have to for multiple pairs? Odd logic there.

I could say more about the timed go's and the harsh initial time of your defensive turn(both of which get harder the further you get into the game) but I think I've said enough for now. It is a well made game that I am enjoying playing through, but a handfull of silly design choices that I can't believe they made bring it down.

[Hail_Il_palazzo]

I was Told the Game works fine with Freeloader 1.06b If thatstrue i'll be importing it soon.

[lilman]

I must admit i've had none of those problems with the battle system, the one inparticluar where you mention having to 'waste' cards? Just dont play any, simple as. You'll take the same damage (or inflict) and you'll cards will remain in the pack.

The problem is there with having no defensive cards, but thats the luck of the draw, if you find youre left short, add more defensive cards to your pack. Its also nice to see the opponents having to reshuffle thier packs too, nice touch.

I'm completely in love with this game, the battle system seems flawless and I wasnt expecting something so smooth and rewarding fronm a card based system, but its there and its a joy yo play. I love the way all the moves link together on an attack combo and just the way all the characters move around the battle field makes it great to watch over and over. I love the town sections, I love the blank magnus quests, I loooove the cutscenes, I love it all.

If I were to have one minor complaint its that sometimes it can be tricky to see doors or pathways on the backdrops, especially the ones that stretch into the distance, but thats nothing really.

My game of the year now (sorry Paper Mario...)

[lilman]

I was Told the Game works fine with Freeloader 1.06b If thatstrue i'll be importing it soon.

It does yes, I have to do the region select method though.

[Sane]

Just got this in the mail yesterday (extremely fast shipping from VG+), played around with it for 15 minutes to test if it worked correct with the freeloader. I have to say I don't understand the battle system at all yet, then again that's probably because I skipped the tutorials .

All seems very nice, although the character designs don't really appeal to me. And I had to turn off the voices, not only is it horrible voice acting but they sound as if they were recorded through a tin can .

Btw, is this game from the same team as Tales?

[fearbat]

I must admit i've had none of those problems with the battle system, the one inparticluar where you mention having to 'waste' cards? Just dont play any, simple as. You'll take the same damage (or inflict) and you'll cards will remain in the pack.

It's not wasting cards, but whole turns. My point is that after a while your deck will become much bigger and the odds of a hand being completely made out of greyed out cards(defensive, chain and finishing move cards) will increase, as you can only play one greyed out card per turn a character can easily be rendered useless for a few turns. It isn't all the time you'll get that just the odd battle once in a while, but when it does happen it shows up the battle systems flaws.

The game is still highly playable and I am enjoying it a lot, for instance just the sheer amount of things to keep you occupied beyond advancing the main story is very impressive. Sub quests and SP Combos can easily distract you for hours upon hours.

[taus01]

It does yes, I have to do the region select method though.

What is the region select method?

[Adam Stone]

I?m a fair bit into this now. Really, really enjoying it. I?m writing the review so cant really go into too much depth here (it will all be in there! ^_^ ) but I agree with lilman that the problems which I initially had with the battle system have dissolved into nothingness?

It works so perfectly well. It does start of a little frustrating when you are forced to miss turns due the random selection, but as you progress and become more custom to the item organization the chances of that happening fade away. I?m really enjoying how the game seems to force you to develop and use your reflexes - builds a nice sense of tension and individuality to all the battles whilst keeping you on your toes.

The backgrounds have been visually amazing so far? and I find that I?m excited to see what the next area looks like ? full of life, diversity and colour. The character models aren?t as nice? and it can be a little distracting sometimes, but the presentation, art style and just generally the whole visual-side looks like some beautiful piece of artwork.

Also? I love speaking to the NPCs! They all have so many wonderfully interesting things to say and help to add a much greater sense of ?being there? ? same goes for the side quests as fearbat says. So much to do!

I haven?t had much luck on the SP combos though?

Anyone care to share the combos you?ve found so far?

Anyhoo? hopefully the review will be done within the next week or so. It?s a very big game so the first priority is completing it! Overall, so far I feel I enjoyed Paper Mario 2 and Tales of Symphonia more so, but they rate as two of my favourite games in recent times so that?s no bad thing ^_^

?still got a long way to go though, so things may change

edit: Oh? and yeh, I HAD to turn off the voice-acting too. And this is something I usually NEVER do. In fact I would really recommend they are turned off as the experience is far more gripping with just the text. I would say ?imo? but I feel it is probably more fact then my opinion, heh.

[fearbat]

I haven?t had much luck on the SP combos though?

Anyone care to share the combos you?ve found so far?

I thought I was doing quite well until I looked at how many different SP combos I'd found. A big, fat, ten. Ten! out of a hundred and forty-odd! It's going to take a while to get them all isn't it.

Ones I've found AND managed to do are...

->Open Spoiler<-

Pine Tree + Dual Sword = Branches
Honey + Cheese = Chestnuts
Power Helmet + Uncooked Rice + Mineral Water + Fire Spell = Rice
Curry + Rice + Pickled Eggplant = Curry with Rice
Dried Flower + Mineral Water = Pretty Flower
Dead Flower + Doll = Crying Doll (I know that using a pretty flower will produce a different card but haven't come across another doll card. Bloody typical.)
Blank Notebook + Red and Blue Pencil = Doodle Book
Blank Notebook + Magic Pen = Prophet's Notebook(tells you what Magnus have transformed due to time when entering your deck)
Blank Notebook + Monolith Pen = Monolith Brochure
Blank Notebook + Tri-Crescendo Pen = Tri-Crescendo Brochure

I know I've missed out on a lot of early blatently obvious ones like sculptures but hopefully the early cards make a reappearance later on. On a side note, how mad is Mira?! It's where I am now, and I'm finding it utterly bizarre, totally unexpected and brilliant for it.

[taus01]

There is a full list of all SP on gamefaqs.

I had some weird things happen and i wonder if any of you has the same (possible spoiler)

->Open Spoiler<-

1. Since i defeated the Tree Magnus (Che), my main character Kalas suddenly has a swirling thing in front of his head and all the cards in his hand have the numbers on the four sides rather than on the edges. Did i miss something? Is this because of the Che Magnus i got?

2. I noticed that only for Kalas while fighting using attack cards (swords etc.) a card in his hand does randomly change to a more powerfull finishing move. There is no rule how this happens, almost any card can turn into one of those spells. I could not find a way to re-produce the effect, it seems random. This happened right from the beginning of the game. Any of you figured it out?

Cheers,

Sascha

[fearbat]

I've not noticed your first point taus01 but I have had those random powerfull finishing moves crop up, my thought was that they opened up after using certain card types for a length of time but I could be wrong. They seem to appear within a short time of each other as well.

[Oh! My Car!]

glad to see a First Play thread for this as have been looking forward for ages and got little feedback after resurrecting the old thread a month ago...
will definitely be getting this