Resident Evil 5 - racist or not?

[Kotatsu Neko]

True, but I feel even if some did know the story the game could still be viewed as having some form of racial bias. Specially if the story line blurs the line between zombie disease infection and AIDS. This is what I think will be the touchy area between the Real Africa and a computer based Africa with disease infected mobs.

Let me ask you something - have you ever played a Resident Evil game before? Confusing zombies with AIDS victims.. Of course, I remember seeing on the news only the other day of an AIDS patient splitting in two and turning into an enormous monster.

[Leon Retro]

They'll probably be too busy uncovering new 'evidence' that polish immigrants are eating english children while claiming benefits and having free brain surgery on the NHS.

Replace the word 'children' with 'swans' ... and you'd be spot-on.


With regards to RE5 being any way racist. Capcom have chosen to set the game in Africa. The race of the people/zombies is therefore predominantly 'black' .

They could have set the game anywhere in the world. I don't think people complained about 'white' people/zombies being killed in RE4 etc....

Obviously, in today's political climate, we have very aggressive anti-racism groups, who basically jump on anything involving black&asian people.

I can imagine that some anti-racism people will take the opportunity to stir-up some sensationalist rubbish when RE5 is released. If so, it won't be fair, it won't be justified, but it will give them something to do.

[Brats]

Let me ask you something - have you ever played a Resident Evil game before? Confusing zombies with AIDS victims.. Of course, I remember seeing on the news only the other day of an AIDS patient splitting in two and turning into an enormous monster.

It's a more complex argument than that. If everything in the world was as 100% literal as that there would be no issue, but they're not. Many zombie films are very subversive and have multiple meanings beyond just simple entertainment. Capcom may not intend there to be any subversity to RE5, but that doesn't mean they have to be aware of how the imagery could be taken. As I said earlier, I hope the game is really subversive, but that it's well handled. It would raise it to a whole new level.

Brats, even if Zulu didn't depict the Zulus as savages, even if Caine wasn't rebuffed, that wouldn't make it racist.

It could be. Every step the film takes in a certain direction eventually makes it as bad as Birth of a Nation. Ever seen it? It's incredibly racist by today's standards but was considered to b extremely accurate in it day.

Of course, one huge difference between Zulu and RE5 is that RE5 isn't (yet) depicting actual events. Even just going by the trailer, it's not saying 'this is how African villagers are'. It's saying 'this is how African zombies are'. Slightly fictional. Until the zombie apocalypse comes, I don't think there are lobby groups for the zombie communty, never mind the black zombie community.

Again you're looking at it from a literal perspective, not a symbolic one. Capcom shouldn't ignore the symbolic inference of the content. Again, it's the impact they should be aware of, not the intent.

I do agree this is now going round in circles and you have people like Leon Ahoy making the same old point with no reference to the points put forward by me and others. We're not saying the game is racist. But we believe simply saying 'the game is in Africa. There are blacks in Africa. There is no issue' is just simply sticking your head in the sand against a much more complex issue.

In my experience, things are rarely as simple as a one line soundbite. It doesn't matter what you talk about - is this racist? Why are the England football team crap? Why is inflation going up? People love to say 'the answer is....' and then give a simple answer. But it's rarely that simple. And if you think it is, then you've probably missed or chosen to ignore a much more complex argument.

[Dogg Thang]

Again you're looking at it from a literal perspective, not a symbolic one. Capcom shouldn't ignore the symbolic inference of the content. Again, it's the impact they should be aware of, not the intent.

And ultimately all that they can completely control is the literal content. People read what they want to read into things. Yes, there are sensitivities to be taken into account. We don't know that they haven't. But, right now, I don't think they have a thing to worry about.

If they do the entire game with every white person being good and every black person being evil and killable, then I could see a problem. Then we're into 'black murder simulator territory'. Of course, we already know that the people responsible for the entire 'evil' of the game are white so I can't see that happening. Every other RE game has had encounters with other survivors. This one is likely to as well. They'll likely be black. Why? Location.

Nice how you dismiss the basic fact that 'some countries are predominantly black' as simplistic. Then we live in a simplistic world because that is how it is. The rules of RE are well established over 6 or so games. All that's new here is the location. That is important, simplistic or not. If all that's changed is the background and skin colour and, suddenly, there's a problem, that's racism. But not from the developers. From those who see nothing in that trailer but 'black people' and it makes them uncomfortable. That's not the kind of racism I think Capcom need worry about. And not the kind of racism I really think is going to cause them any major problem whatsoever.

It will be funny if the game turns out to be set somewhere other than Africa.

[Brats]

And ultimately all that they can completely control is the literal content. People read what they want to read into things. Yes, there are sensitivities to be taken into account. We don't know that they haven't. But, right now, I don't think they have a thing to worry about.

I disagree. Ultimately they can (and should) control the symbolism.

If they do the entire game with every white person being good and every black person being evil and killable, then I could see a problem. Then we're into 'black murder simulator territory'. Of course, we already know that the people responsible for the entire 'evil' of the game are white so I can't see that happening. Every other RE game has had encounters with other survivors. This one is likely to as well. They'll likely be black. Why? Location.

You're probably right. I just hope the survivors are not white photo journalists or something.

Nice how you dismiss the basic fact that 'some countries are predominantly black' as simplistic. Then we live in a simplistic world because that is how it is. The rules of RE are well established over 6 or so games. All that's new here is the location. That is important, simplistic or not. If all that's changed is the background and skin colour and, suddenly, there's a problem, that's racism. But not from the developers. From those who see nothing in that trailer but 'black people' and it makes them uncomfortable. That's not the kind of racism I think Capcom need worry about. And not the kind of racism I really think is going to cause them any major problem whatsoever.

Firstly you've misunderstood. I didn't dismiss the basic fact that 'some countries are predominantly black' as simplistic at all. I dismissed the point that that is simply the entire crux of the argument with no other relevant points as some are saying. That's definately too simplistic. As you yourself say: 'If they do the entire game with every white person being good and every black person being evil and killable, then I could see a problem.' Simply saying 'It's in Africa - there can be no racist overtones' is too simplistic.

Secondly, a simple change in location on its own with no overtly racist symbolism is fine. No-one has ever argued anything different. Kotatsu Neko may say 'The argument seems to be 'you can't show a white man shooting Africans' but no-one has ever said that and he's just trying to back up his weak position arguing against points that no-one has made.

It will be funny if the game turns out to be set somewhere other than Africa.

Some people are saying it's Haiti. Regardless, it's clearly a third world location where black people are the predominant race. The exact location is academic.

[Dogg Thang]

Academic only if you want to ignore the instant assumption that black run-down town = Africa. That's not all that far from the AotC latinos fiasco.

And I think that really nails the main thing here - there simply isn't enough information here. I don't think racism shoud be ignored because it's 'only a game'. I certainly don't think forms of entertainment should be exempt from responsibility, especially one as immersive as gaming. But right now, all we have is a trailer that shows the same old RE thing in a new location. That's all we know right now.

If it does turn out to be just plain ol' RE in a new location, the symbolism will be a stretch, just like it was with The Lion King. It may get people a few paragraphs in a newspaper and the word 'sex' will be removed on dvd (if it appears in RE5) and that will be the end of it.

[ItsThere]

You're probably right. I just hope the survivors are not white photo journalists or something.

The exact location is academic.

Firstly - Frank could be in this game, thank you Dead Rising.

Secondly the exact location is not academic, a predominantly black location is Peckham, S.London. It looks nothing like the location shown (true it is not thirs world) and I'm sure the people there are not Zombies, nor would they be anything like the pre-infected persons, black or not.

[ItsThere]

I actually don't really know what point i was making there...

This is getting beyond beggars belief, I just can't see how this would have caused a fuss if it was 10 years ago, better graphics or not. I think that is my main problem with this debate.

[Dogg Thang]

Well I don't want to make your point for you, Blair, but it seemed you were pointing out the difference location can make, which can also involve culture, social standing and much more rather than taking the "well, they're all black folk, aren't they?" approach.

[ItsThere]

Well I don't want to make your point for you, Blair, but it seemed you were pointing out the difference location can make, which can also involve culture, social standing and much more rather than taking the "well, they're all black folk, aren't they?" approach.

. Awesome, thanks Dogg Thang, much more articulate than I could manage at this time in the morning.

['Press Start']

Let me ask you something - have you ever played a Resident Evil game before? Confusing zombies with AIDS victims.. Of course, I remember seeing on the news only the other day of an AIDS patient splitting in two and turning into an enormous monster.

Ha-ha. For you and me it is that simple I agree. For someone else all they will see is: Poor infected diseased villagers who past infection onto each other + White hero saving the day by killing them. Sounds crazy yes but understand ' this is what some people will see!'


As Brats said it is the symbolism of what it might been seen to represent. For example you would not put 2 dead or alive girls fighting it out in a Mecca stage with their legs out & breasts bouncing around! That is religiously sensitive and white soldiers/conquerors in Africa is historically sensitive. Both are just games doing nothing wrong to the gamer but sometimes there are more people to think about then ourselves.

The Symbolic meaning of something is often the strongest for most people

[Gerry Helmet]

Its like seeing a picture depicting a group of white men beating a black man to near death, without an explanation most would assume racist motive's, However if it was explained its becasue the guy had raped/killed each of those mens wife's then there's nothing racist about it atall, its sheer bloodlust revenge.

You could swap that and have any race as the Minority I only used a Black man given the current debate,,,,

[dataDave]

OK then, why don't Capcom take Res6 to the next level... They could go back in time to some little german chemical weapons lab in 1944, the Nazis are working on a super virus that will exterminate jews faster and cheaper than the gas they used... Obligatory outbreak in a concentration camp, player takes control of the only surviving Nazi foot soldier, run around shooting loads of zombie jews and then later on unlock a survival mode where you have to kill as many as you can in the alloted time.

Of course, that can't be considered racist as it is set in Nazi Germany, where exterminating jews was never considered racist.

Where do you draw the line between Nazi Germany and strifing Africa?

The...

Remember, it's just a game

comments really make me laugh, try telling that to the people that banned Manhunt2.

[Dogg Thang]

Where do you draw the line between Nazi Germany and strifing Africa?

Somewhere around the middle of Italy?

[dataDave]

Also, if we're making such an issue about it then what are the general do-gooder public going to make of it?