Xbox - Series S/X: Thread 01

[nonny]

It’ll probably end like like some 1X and Pro games with a full on super shiny graphics mode at a lower frame rate and a less graphically splendid higher frame rate setting. There’s a lot of things in the new consoles designed to boost efficiency and throughput so hopefully 60Hz does become the new baseline. With refined temporal reconstruction techniques and DLSS style up sampling the actual rendering resolution will be less important.
Seems kind of daft Microsoft going to all the effort to reduce latency with the controllers and how the system responds to that for 30Hz games.

I've said this before. I want to see this become a standard now... Maybe not PC levels of toggle options but I want to see every game have a mode that prioritises frame rate and another for graphics resolution.

The developers can pick and choose how they apply either but those modes are basically mandatory from here on out.

As for 60fps as a standard. Well it's an old debate isn't it. Some games/genres definitely excel with a higher frame rate... Others can get away with 30fps.

At least if developers are pursuing better frame rates this gen and consumers who generally don't understand the benefits start to see them more and more we will reach a point where removing the option will cause an uproar.

[Brad]

Hellblade, uncharted, last of us etc. All fine at 30. In fact they feel a bit weird to me at 60. I think it’s down to the controller; with a mouse and keyboard on pc I wanted 60 for everything but with a controller in my hand, barring driving and fighting games 30 was fine.

[CMcK]

Games running at 60hz have far better temporal resolution than 30hz games so will look clearer and sharper. What’s the point sacrificing frame rate for better visuals when people won’t really notice especially on the typical blur fest LCD TV.

[nonny]

Because those people don't even know the difference. They just know they own a 4K TV and want 4K.

I mean I play Forza Horizon 4 now in performance mode and it's a different game. It's so fast you don't even notice the reduced resolution and it's all the better for it.

Other games though I don't think it's required but I would still want to see developers giving us both options and letting us choose what is important to us.

[fishbowlhead]

Every game that has it I’ll choose performance mode every time. Switching it to resolution mode in a moment of curiosity always ends up the same, it goes straight back to performance mode for better frame rate.

Frame rate frame rate frame rate.

[Neon Ignition]

Outside of MS's target of 60fps for their first party titles we're already seeing 30fps re-establish itself as the standard for next-gen. Horizon, AC Valhalla are already set for that speed and if a current gen game AC game runs at 30fps on Series X it can be taken as a definitive confirmation that it will be the very small minority that run at 60fps.

[Brad]

Games where you aren’t constantly moving benefit from the higher res. E.g. hellblade. I’ll quite often just look around admiring the environment and in high frame rate mode it looks noticeably worse. Contrast with forza horizon where there’s zero point in having higher res at 30 because the whole point it so be constantly moving.

[Team Andromeda]

Because those people don't even know the difference. They just know they own a 4K TV and want 4K.

I mean I play Forza Horizon 4 now in performance mode and it's a different game. It's so fast you don't even notice the reduced resolution and it's all the better for it.

Other games though I don't think it's required but I would still want to see developers giving us both options and letting us choose what is important to us.

The way I look at it is when you play Halo V (leave aside if the game is good or not ) on the One S and then on the One X the difference is massive and the same goes for Forza Horizon 3 . So I think both screen res and frame rates can be important.

I was disappointed we never got a One X patch for Ryse or a Pro Patch for Drive Club

[nonny]

Games where you aren’t constantly moving benefit from the higher res. E.g. hellblade. I’ll quite often just look around admiring the environment and in high frame rate mode it looks noticeably worse. Contrast with forza horizon where there’s zero point in having higher res at 30 because the whole point it so be constantly moving.

For the most part but then Tomb Raider on the One X looks and plays better in performance mode and that isn't exactly a fast paced title.

I'll be like fishbowlhead and always go for performance personally but I can see some people preferring the resolution in some games... And the truth is that is perfectly fine and developers need to offer options.

As for 60fps being in the minority in Series X, I don't think so. We will see 30fps games for sure but I think a lot of games will come in at 60fps or offer it (or 120fps) albeit by sacrificing some things to get there.

[fishbowlhead]

Like i said before its time for console owners to have options now too. Even if its just Performance or Resolution modes, we want the choice, no need for pc levels, but at least something as standard.

[cutmymilk]

I kind of disagree. I think whatever the developer thinks is best should be how a game is judged.

[Cassius_Smoke]

I kind of disagree. I think whatever the developer thinks is best should be how a game is judged.

Yeah I agree. The new consoles will probably easily run all the games at 60, and it's the developers choice. Racing games and fighters would arguably be better at 60, and something like Tomb Raider runs fine at 30.

[Neon Ignition]

Thing is, the new consoles won't run many games at 60fps and that includes previous gen games. It doesn't take much of a gander at PC's to get a clear view of what experiences to expect on the new consoles.

There's a big difference on Gears 5 on Xbox One X compared to Xbox One for example with the XBX easily the better machine to play it on. Whilst better though it's in no way mistakable for looking like a next-gen title and the XBX is only able to deliver that level of quality because MS took the time and the machine is running a game intended for a much weaker machine. Most older games won't run at 60fps on the new machines because in most instances developers won't go back and optimise the old titles for it so you'll end with with a mixed bag of improvements. Titles actually developed tailored for the new machines will be more demanding, therefore in most cases 30fps will be the standard because it has to be. These are powerful new consoles but they're not going to spend the next seven years delivering results that high end PC's can't.

[dataDave]

Like i said before its time for console owners to have options now too. Even if its just Performance or Resolution modes, we want the choice, no need for pc levels, but at least something as standard.

This point came up when DF covered the latest Cyberpunk footage. CDPR have gone with all of the bells and whistles post-processing effects like chromatic aberration, where the colors around the edges of the screen become offset, in an effort to force your focus on the center of the screen. This effect can be heavy on performance. It comes with a lot of Skyrim ENBs and I turn it off every time.

Why would I want to lose 10-15fps on my expensive GPU in order to make my expensive monitor look like crap?

What's funny is that the game has some very noticeable level of detail pop in. Shrubs and grass will magically appear within 8-10ft of the viewpoint. Again, with Skyrim you can boost that to ridiculous levels by changing the number 120 to 40 in a text file, until the 3D grass blends seamlessly into the distant 2D landscape - all for the cost of an extra 2fps:

https://i.ibb.co/7S8N82p/The-Truth-ENB-Rustic-Weathers.png

Sometimes I wonder where developers' priorities are at. As amazing as Cyberpunk is shaping up I'm probably going to have to spend the first couple of days back-and-forth twiddling with the .ini files. Besides the above, all of that dumb Bladerunner 2047 heavy fogging can do one as well. I don't want to feel like I'm playing on a PSone Pro.

Another bit of Skyrim pimping: https://i.ibb.co/gSQzSvY/Screen-Shot30.png

That armour is all cubemapped up, which gives off a faux ray-tracing effect for little-to-no performance cost. It looks absolutely glorious in motion, especially when it's covered in rain and blood. Disclaimer: My weathers are looking bland/stark on purpose as I'm going for realism this time. A recent play of 1080 (Snowboarding) inspired that.

tl;dr: I really hope more devs focus on optimisation in order to attain the silky performance instead of just recklessly dumping stupidly expensive techniques around for the sake of it. At least PC players can tweak.

[Leon Retro]

I mean I play Forza Horizon 4 now in performance mode and it's a different game. It's so fast you don't even notice the reduced resolution and it's all the better for it.

When I went from 60fps to 30fps in FH4, there was a drastic reduction in how realistic the graphics looked. The game world didn't feel so solid and convincing. So 60fps also helps will visual clarity and makes game worlds feel more solid.

If the next gen is all about making a big step towards even greater realism in all sorts of genres, then 30fps can't be an option. It has too much of a negative impact on visual clarity and the overall sense of realism.

Games being an interactive, immersive medium, means that 60fps or more is a clear benefit to make things feel realistic and therefore more convincing. 30fps really needs to be consigned to the gaming history books.