Looking for decent HDTV for 360

[sputnick]

Any chance of some pics of the bravia in action running some 360 goodness?

will post some tomorrow mate!!!

[hudson]

great

[Salsa Party Animal]

So what did happens in last 6 months as I didn't even consider Sony as an option 6 months ago, nowdays everyone rave about it.

[andrewfee]

So what did happens in last 6 months as I didn't even consider Sony as an option 6 months ago, nowdays everyone rave about it.

They switched from WEGA to BRAVIA processing, and finally released an LCD in Europe that wasn't significantly cut down from the US equivalent model.

It's still not perfect, or as good as the US ones due in a couple of months, but it's probably the best on the UK market right now. (although VGA support on the V is quite poor)

[Sane]

I went to the shop today, and I hope someone can explain the difference between the S2000 and the V2000. The difference in price is about 450 euro. The guy in the store said the only difference is the Bravia technology used and he said quite honestly that while the V is better it's not really that noticable. It's a pretty big price difference but if it makes a significant difference I would likely chose the V2000.

Also andrewfee, could you say what's poor about the VGA support on the V2000? And is the S2000 better at VGA? It's important to me because I will use VGA to connect my 360 to the panel and will most likely use it for the PC as well.

[Sane]

Could some possibly help me with the above? Tomorrow I have to make my decision and I can't seem to find the info that I need. Thanks.

[andrewfee]

I went to the shop today, and I hope someone can explain the difference between the S2000 and the V2000. The difference in price is about 450 euro. The guy in the store said the only difference is the Bravia technology used and he said quite honestly that while the V is better it's not really that noticable. It's a pretty big price difference but if it makes a significant difference I would likely chose the V2000.

Also andrewfee, could you say what's poor about the VGA support on the V2000? And is the S2000 better at VGA? It's important to me because I will use VGA to connect my 360 to the panel and will most likely use it for the PC as well.

The only difference between the S and V series is the wide colour-gamut backlight. This allows it to reproduce more than the NTSC gamut, whereas the S cannot reproduce the full gamut. However, while this looked good for the most part, some things looked totally unnatural, it enhanced macroblocking (particularly in reds) and things just at the edge of full saturation looked wrong. Overall, it probably looked better though. With Top Gear a couple of weeks back, for example, there was a red car being shown (I forget what now) but any slightly over-exposed areas (quite common with reds) turned a luminous pink on the V! When watching "have I got news for you" the red background had huge amounts of macroblocking on the red background, as something about the V causes it to happen. (I reckon that's also related to the backlight)

You can't use the 360 with the V over VGA - it doesn't have the "colour space" option for it, and as such, completely screws up the colours. I tried to capture this with my camera, but it wasn't really showing. Basically, the realm of Oblivion, for example, turned pink!

This was pre-update, but the image was seriously lacking in contrast compared to component, and wasn't nearly as sharp as I would have expected from VGA. (much softer than my other Sony LCD)


The S series will handle VGA the same as the V, but you'll get the proper colours as it doesn't have the WCG-CCFL backlight. As for PC use, I'd say it was average at best, compared to the other LCDs I've had.

EDIT: Oh, and it won't accept 1280x720 over VGA, which is essential for the 360. (anything else and you get performance issues)

[Sane]

Ok thanks for the reply. Basically you recommend I get the S then? Will the S accept 1280x720 or was your comment about both sets? And with update I assume you mean the 360 dashboard update?

[andrewfee]

I don't think any of the current BRAVIAs support 1280x720, and yeah, I meant the dash update.

[Lyris]

wasn't nearly as sharp as I would have expected from VGA. (much softer than my other Sony LCD)

I don't have any other LCD TVs to compare this against (although I'm getting a JVC one in for review next week), but I'm not too sure about this one - are you talking about the scaling for non-native resolutions being disappointing?



When the image is 1:1 mapped, the image literally is pixel-perfect - if any blurring was going on then surely you'd see, for example, a solid black pixel becoming grey around the edges. Or are you saying finer details are somehow getting suppressed?

Without meaning to be rude - are you absolutely sure you're not finding You've been through a lot of LCD TVs and you've found problems with them all - and I can relate to that feeling and am not blaming you for it, after all your eyes see what you see. But are you sure that after a while, you don't eventually become so tired of the whole process of buying, unboxing, setting up, returning, reboxing etc., that you find a fault with 'em all?

I'm just asking that because while you owned the TV, you didn't say anything about that - just curious. Do also remember when comparing against your other Sony LCD, that is designed as a monitor. On the BRAVIA TVs, that's a secondary function.

Like Andrew says though, I'd definitely recommend either the V or the S BRAVIAs. Both are great and if you can't see any difference between 'em, then by all means save the cash. Some of the deep greens and reds are really, really nice though (on the right source material of course).

If you want a second opinion, you can read my review of the new 32" Sony V-Series over at DVD Times: http://www.dvdtimes.co.uk/content.php?contentid=61818

The S is, like Andrew said, incredibly similar.

[Salsa Party Animal]

I would thought component input is better for XBOX 360 gaming, and VGA input can be used for Dreamcast. But again every display is different.

[Sane]

Ok thanks for all the help guys. I went for the V2000 in the end, the store guy gave me an offer I couldn't refuse . I've tested the 360 through component so far and I'm very impressed. I still have to tweak teh settings a bit further but I can already say it's very much worth the price.
Tomorrow I'm going to see how the 360 looks through VGA and I'm gonna see how it does with the PS2 and Xbox through RGB. I'm going to order a component cable for the Xbox soon and probably a switch box so I'll be able to hook up the Wii when it's released and I also want to hook up the PC.
Thanks again .

[sputnick]

I went to the shop today, and I hope someone can explain the difference between the S2000 and the V2000. The difference in price is about 450 euro. The guy in the store said the only difference is the Bravia technology used and he said quite honestly that while the V is better it's not really that noticable. It's a pretty big price difference but if it makes a significant difference I would likely chose the V2000.

Also andrewfee, could you say what's poor about the VGA support on the V2000? And is the S2000 better at VGA? It's important to me because I will use VGA to connect my 360 to the panel and will most likely use it for the PC as well.

my supposedly inferior 26 inch s series bravia is stunning through vga.

you just need to adjust settings.

[Sane]

I'm actually messing with the VGA right now. Thing is, I can't seem to find a way to get the nvidia drivers to let me use a different resolution on the TV. It says it's set to 1360x768 but it clones my PC screen (it is in clone mode) so it's not widescreen and it can't display everything. I did a search on it and I found that setting it to Dual View would help, but strangly the option has dissapeared. It was there 10 minutes ago but now it only shows single, clone, horizontal and vertical pan .

[andrewfee]

I don't have any other LCD TVs to compare this against (although I'm getting a JVC one in for review next week), but I'm not too sure about this one - are you talking about the scaling for non-native resolutions being disappointing?

Yeah, I'm talking about the output from the 360 which is 1280x720 scaled. You have to set it to either 1280x768 or 1360x768, both of which looked quite soft compared to 1280x720 scaled to 1280x768 by my other Sony LCD.

The softness is likely caused by the rather poor internal scaler on the 360, but it's the BRAVIA that means you can't use 1280x720, so I'd say it's the TV's fault.

When the image is 1:1 mapped, the image literally is pixel-perfect - if any blurring was going on then surely you'd see, for example, a solid black pixel becoming grey around the edges. Or are you saying finer details are somehow getting suppressed?

1:1 mapped it's great, although it's noisier a bit than most LCDs I've used - I can get a completely perfect image on my MFM-HT75W over VGA (can't tell the difference between it and DVI for sharpness/noise) but with the V, the edges of some things have a little interference.

Without meaning to be rude - are you absolutely sure you're not finding You've been through a lot of LCD TVs and you've found problems with them all - and I can relate to that feeling and am not blaming you for it, after all your eyes see what you see. But are you sure that after a while, you don't eventually become so tired of the whole process of buying, unboxing, setting up, returning, reboxing etc., that you find a fault with 'em all?

I'm completely exhausted with trying to find a TV, but if anything that's making me be more tolerant of most things, rather than being more picky, but there are some things I just can't tolerate.

I'm just asking that because while you owned the TV, you didn't say anything about that - just curious. Do also remember when comparing against your other Sony LCD, that is designed as a monitor. On the BRAVIA TVs, that's a secondary function.

That's true, but the other LCDs have handled VGA as well as a monitor, whereas the BRAVIA isn't as good as a ?300 LCD. For the price, you would expect it to be at least as good.


I'm not saying it's a bad TV, it's not perfect, and a couple of the things really bothered me, but I'd still recommend it to anyone, as 99% of the people out there aren't as anal as I am.