HL2 Subscription plans

[Super Stu]

Nah, some of us have the retail CS disc. However, you bung it in and then patch yourself up for free to play on majority of the servers, else you search about using various tools to play a really old build.

Presumably, you'll have to subscribe to receive such updates this time around?

Mind, given the time keeping of these guys (CS 1.6/CZ anyone?), I can see a lot of people subbing for a month, grabbing their guff and cancelling until the next update is needed.

[Fire]

If people are prepared to part with money for what will be quite a smart (if expensive) service then why not run it? There will probably be a lot of content on it so you'll get your moneys worth if you really try. As we've said at least there is a choice.

CS may have started as a homemade mod that's definately not it's future. CS 1.0 has been available to buy for ages, CS:Condition Zero on Xbox and PC is a retail game. The original CS on PC should remain free in some form or another given the existing community so you'll always be able to play that. Team Fortress 2 has always been planned as a retail game (I think?) and they never gave any of the HL expansion packs and spinoffs away for free. No one's forcing you to play HL2, CS2 or any other source engine game.

I'm sure they'd of cut off absolutely free CS already if there wouldn't be a massive uproar from hundreds of thousands of cheapskate fans. What better time to move to a pure retail game than totally reinventing it on a new base?

CS 2 will hopefully be a bigger, better and truly impressive. It'll surely be better than all of the past versions. I don't see why it shouldn't be a retail game (whichever way you end up paying for it) let's face it, it'll probably give you far many more hours of fun and enjoyment than a lot of the current rubbish that retails on PC and some of those ?40 console games gathering dust on your shelf.

[Vaipon]

I wouldn't be surprised if this content delivery method has been in the pipeline for months at the various software-publisher meetings. They've probably been trying to introduce this retail/subscription model into PC games for a while, but the publishers realised that they needed a huge release like Half-Life 2 that they could tag it onto, because everyone will have to have this game regardless of how it's marketed/sold. It's just opening the flood gates. Once Half-Life 2 has shipped, and we've all begrudgingly accepted this stupid multi-tiered system and swallowed it, hoardes of future PC games will start using it, and it will be accepted as the norm. I personally don't see any reason to change the traditional model of purchasing a game at retail and then paying for "expansion packs" if they are worth the money. Multi-player isn't a value-added feature that should have to be purchased seperately, it's a ****ing given in all FPS games worth their salt. It's a standard feature, and if the "single-player only" version is the same price as previous PC games, they should be ashamed of themselves. HL2's cutting edge graphics and technology are no excuse to suddenly bump the price of gaming on the PC (especially as it is hardware functions doing a load of the fancy work, *not* just their new engine). They're just getting greedy, and there is no justification for this other than the fact that they can get away with it because it's HL2.

As previously mentioned.

MILK!!!!!

[Burai]

The mod scene for HL2 will, in all probability, be even larger than the huge HL1 scene, personally I suspect there's going to be more than enough to interest me there without clinging frantically to CS.

Unlikely. Most pundits reckon that the new Half Life 2 engine is so complex and difficult that most homebrew mod developers will stick with Half Life 1 and Quake III engined games for the forseeable future.

If you don't have a fully paid-up team of 20 staff working 9-5, 5 days a week, you ain't gonna get anything out the door in any sensible timeframe.

[Garibaldi Biscuit]

Interesting, I thought judging by such a rousing past success in the mod area that Valve would have made an effort to keep HL2's editor accessible to the community.

Still, no matter how complex it is there's bound to be some techie folk out there who dedicate their lives to mastering it 24/7 from the instant HL2 hits the shelves. 'Tis what I'm counting on, anyway, we shall have to wait and see.

[Fire]

I personally don't see any reason to change the traditional model of purchasing a game at retail and then paying for "expansion packs" if they are worth the money. Multi-player isn't a value-added feature that should have to be purchased seperately, it's a ****ing given in all FPS games worth their salt. It's a standard feature, and if the "single-player only" version is the same price as previous PC games, they should be ashamed of themselves. HL2's cutting edge graphics and technology are no excuse to suddenly bump the price of gaming on the PC (especially as it is hardware functions doing a load of the fancy work, *not* just their new engine). They're just getting greedy, and there is no justification for this other than the fact that they can get away with it because it's HL2.

True, except none of it really applies to HL2. You can still buy the game the traditional way and buy expansions packs and spin-off games in the usual manner too.

The regular priced version of HL2 does contain single player and multiplayer modes. CS2, Team Fortress2 and the like are not the multiplayer mode in HL2, why can't people accept that they are games in their own right now?

It's been officially stated that the single player only version will cost less than a normal PC game so rather than screwing over gamers they are actually giving more value and choice to the whole range of consumers who'll buy their product than ever.

Things may get messy in the future but with HL2 at least, all I see is more choice over how much you spend, how you play and what you play, surely not a bad thing?

Unlikely. Most pundits reckon that the new Half Life 2 engine is so complex and difficult that most homebrew mod developers will stick with Half Life 1 and Quake III engined games for the forseeable future.

If you don't have a fully paid-up team of 20 staff working 9-5, 5 days a week, you ain't gonna get anything out the door in any sensible timeframe.

From what I've read Valve are doing all they can to support mod developers from the start.

- Continually working on the user-friendly level editor which will ship with the game.

- Writing programs to convert existing HL1 maps, models and texures to HL2,

- Writing extensive documention on how to get to grips with the new AI, physics and all the other new technical elements

- AND hinting that they are working on bundling a free version of the professional modeling and animation software 'SoftImage XSI' which they used to create HL2 with the game. As well as the facial modelling and animation software.

Christ, what more could you want? Would Valve of all people not try to help the mod community as much as possible? Games are only going to get more complicated from here so if creative mod developers don't take up such a good opportunity we'll all be playing Q3 and HL1 mods forever.

[replicant]

I bet the same core of people moaning now were moaning when they realised that they had to pay id to play the remaining 2 episodes of Shareware Doom!

"What they expect us to pay for the last two episodes!"

It really pisses me off when people expect the world for free. I don't blame the CS guys for wanting to make some money out of their sequel. Who can blame them! They invest blood, sweat and tears into the mod to for no capital return? Hardly a sensible option.

[Super Stu]

Dude, I can't afford EVE, SWG and CS

[JibberX]

If Vivendi or whoever have had their eyes open over the last year they would've seen how barn stormingly successful the copy protection on Raven Shield is, for instance in my house we have 3 copies, just to play LAN.

If you don't know, what it does, as soon as you want a network game it buggers off to ubi and checks the code, like HL did for online play kinda, but this even shafts you for LANnage.

And as for increased revenue streams, I am a big big fan of ppl charging for a decent game, they've earnt it goddamn it. If you can't afford to play it, you can't afford to play it, tough cheddar.

I for one would love for ppl to have to pay for TF2, as the fact it was free and stupid muppet cheaters cheated without hinderance. However if you have to have a global username database ala "Live!" and you get punished for cheating and have to pay for the privilage I would applaud that. However the lack of dedicated servers for that cost would be a little sticky, but then usually the publisher do have a few servers to begin with to get the ball rolling.

[nips]

To be honest, I think it sounds fine.

As long as I get the standard version from my pre-order, I can see no problems. What will I have? I'll have Half-life 2, the SDK and Multi-player. That sounds great.

Then in the future, when TF2 and CS2 are released I cen either buy them or if I'm lucky, download them for free. I mean, Counter-Strike isn't Half-life and I fail to understand, as do most here, why it should instantly come free.

That sounds perfect to me, as long as all people with every version get support through patches and updates to their product, then I see no problem at all!

[Stuart Smith]

Nowhere in any of these announcements is it implied that you'll have to be paying a subscription to get access to patches and things. If CS2 (is there any proof that any of this applies to CS2??) is actually a retail release, then there'll be a boxed copy or Steam subscribers will get it free. From there, seems pretty bloody likely patches will be free.

Also, it seems pretty bloody likely that Counter-Strike 2 will be a far more ambitious project than CS1 has been, costing a damn sight more money, so why the hell shouldn't it be a retail product? Condition Zero is, and no-one seems to care about!

[Shimmyhill]

paying for a online game !

Id pay whatever to play CS2 online, its my most played game ever (over many years now)

Im amazed that CS has been free for so long, paying would also help get rid of some of the cheating element i belive.

[Burai]

From what I've read Valve are doing all they can to support mod developers from the start.

- Continually working on the user-friendly level editor which will ship with the game.

- Writing programs to convert existing HL1 maps, models and texures to HL2,

- Writing extensive documention on how to get to grips with the new AI, physics and all the other new technical elements

- AND hinting that they are working on bundling a free version of the professional modeling and animation software 'SoftImage XSI' which they used to create HL2 with the game. As well as the facial modelling and animation software.

Christ, what more could you want? Would Valve of all people not try to help the mod community as much as possible? Games are only going to get more complicated from here so if creative mod developers don't take up such a good opportunity we'll all be playing Q3 and HL1 mods forever.

Tools <> Talent

[choddo]

Talent + bad/no tools < talent with good tools

You were implying there would be difficulty developing for the HL2 engine, I think the tools are kind of important in deciding that.

And I don't see the problem with this publishing model. Looks like they're trying some interesting things. Let's face it, it's about time someone shook up the current publishing model, it's putting too many people out of jobs.

[Adam]

Latest Steam/HL news:

This is probably something we should have recognized last week, but it appears that Valve will soon be replacing the WonID system of user authentication that Half-Life has used since the very beginning with Steam. Here's some quotes from Valve's Erik Johnson yanked from this Steam forum thread:

There will no longer be a WonID system, it will be replaced by the SteamID system.
When we convert the userbase to Steam, a single WonID will be valid for all of the products.

If you're purchased a product from us at retail, you're going to have access to all of our products via Steam.

No, you do not have to pay for Steam.

So sometime in the near future, Valve will be releasing an update to Half-Life that will require you to convert your old WonID CD-Key into a SteamID. We asked Mr. Johnson if this meant Steam would be required to play Half-Life online:

That is correct, you'll have to have Steam installed to play the most current version of Half-Life.

This is a pretty significant change. While it probably makes sense to replace the aging WonID system, the transition over to Steam is bound to be a little bumpy.

Planet Half-Life