Game of Thrones / House of Dragon

[prinnysquad]

What are we saying here? That they shouldn't have bothered to make a tv series of the book because a

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'main' character dies early on

? Maybe these folks are right and audiences will drop off because of it. Damn shame if so.

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It is indeed the catalyst to bigger things - it's part of a grander narrative; it's not meant to be centred on a hero.

Hopefully the series will be strong enough to survive this early loss in the minds of viewers. The flipside is that other tv progs become too dependent on a major character, and when the star throws a wobbler and leaves, it dies without them.

[rmoxon]

Yeah it will be a shame if people stop watching this becuase they dont even realise what the program is actualy about.

But then no one ever accused the general public of liking good TV anyway. What season is CSI on now? 150?

[MrMarbles]

As long as the "secondary" characters continue to be well cast, I don't think the show will have a problem maintaining an audience. The universe and overall storyline is compelling enough to do that, plus I think they're managing to handle the multiple story arcs very well so far.

However, it's undeniably true that there needs to be anchors of some kind established within each arc to get the viewer to grow attached to these characters.

Regardless, whether it turns out for better or worse, the ending of episode nine was pretty stunning for me (as I obviously have no knowledge of the books).

[rmoxon]

I dont even think a show actualy needs an anchor,did a show like lost ever have an anchor?.

Ok maybe Jack could have been considered the main character but then alot of lost fans didnt even like that character much, so he wasnt anchoring it for them. Plus lost had a different main character every week, somtimes main characters would vanish for a few weeks at a time.

I think its sad that general veiwers seem to want every show structured in the same manner, its like if writers dare to create an origoinal story it upsets the veiwers, yet in some cases they will still keep watching and eventualy forget what the silly complaint they had was in the first place.

Im actualy of the opinion that most people dont even know what they want to be honest.

[merf]

I think the mass crowd do know what they want, for the most part its unchallenging, easy to follow, lets them switch off and is a watered down opiate to remove them from their senses.

They don't realise explicitly what it is but the big numbers are usually gained by such fodder and the audience will stick with something like that for a very long time over a number of series.

[MrMarbles]

I think the mass crowd do know what they want, for the most part its unchallenging, easy to follow, lets them switch off and is a watered down opiate to remove them from their senses.

They don't realise explicitly what it is but the big numbers are usually gained by such fodder and the audience will stick with something like that for a very long time over a number of series.

Yeah, I should probably clarify my anchor point which, when I read it back after posting, I knew was pretty badly phrased but I was too lazy to edit it. I just meant an anchor so that viewers can gain some kind of empathy for the characters, otherwise we'll end up just with a cast of Red Shirts. A viewer needs that bit of empathy.

I'm still making my point badly, so I'll just end with this: Game of Thrones and its multiple story arcs is currently creating those anchor characters so I'm not worried about its future or longevity.

[Matt]

But You were only suppose to Follow Ned Stark so that

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you were pissed off when he died

. now other characters will come to the forefront. I dont know what happens from now in the books really, but I know that it basicaly turns into three on going stories and if there is a main character it will be

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John Snow becuase he basicaly has his own story

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I think the thing that you arent really realising is that in some ways, although each season of the show will carry on to the next, they are all based on a different book, they are self contained in ways as well. Ned Stark was the main character in this story, he wont be in the next one.

And the Jack buaer comparison doesnt work eithert becuase 24 was about his character, Game of thrones is actualy about

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The fallout from Ned Starks death and the story didnt even really begin until the end of this last episode

Fair enough, but there will be an element of the audience who are left perplexed. Doing it so late in the series makes it tough for them. Earlier, they'd have time to give the audience someone else to get behind (which is VERY important). Later, it would of been an interesting cliff hanger.

24 comparisons are actually more on the mark than you realise (not that I'd expect anything else from you mate ). If Jack hadn't of survived beyond say episode 12, the series wouldn't of been about him. The first series, there were other characters who could of come to the fore.

I'm simply saying that there are reasons in TV land you aren't so cavalier

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with the "lead" character. And for pretty much all the audience, he was the lead, regardless of all the other storylines and characters. The audience needs a moral compass, they need someone to get behind, someone to cheer on. Yes, you can break all the rules you like, but there are very good reasons why archetypes are traditionally followed. Thrones has many other interesting characters, and the producers need to establish one of them prominently. You have to understand TV and books are very, very different and can appeal to different audiences. I'm sure the show is picking up a large demographic who'd never read the books before, and who before the show appeared probably never would of either.

As it stands, Bean was a good choice for the role. Firstly, as was said previously, his casting added "gravitas". Great choice of words, very accurate. He also brought legitimacy to the show, after all it's the dude from Lord Of The Rings in another fantasy show. Third, he could be quoted as saying, "It's LOTR but with sex" to sell the show. All good things to get the show moving and bring in an audience. Never underestimate the man appeal of Bean, he's a legend. I believe I've said before that in my opinion he should be in every film ever made

Now the audience is there, the producers have to keep them. Which is why is happening so late may prove tricky. Be interesting to see if there's much drop-off before series 2.

As for all this 11 series and 2 films nonsense people are talking about, yeah right. Very very few shows last that long, regardless of what source material is available. There are reasons for this beyond the scope of my little post here

[rmoxon]

Fair enough, but there will be an element of the audience who are left perplexed. Doing it so late in the series makes it tough for them. Earlier, they'd have time to give the audience someone else to get behind (which is VERY important). Later, it would of been an interesting cliff hanger.

24 comparisons are actually more on the mark than you realise (not that I'd expect anything else from you mate ). If Jack hadn't of survived beyond say episode 12, the series wouldn't of been about him. The first series, there were other characters who could of come to the fore.

I'm simply saying that there are reasons in TV land you aren't so cavalier

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with the "lead" character. And for pretty much all the audience, he was the lead, regardless of all the other storylines and characters. The audience needs a moral compass, they need someone to get behind, someone to cheer on. Yes, you can break all the rules you like, but there are very good reasons why archetypes are traditionally followed. Thrones has many other interesting characters, and the producers need to establish one of them prominently. You have to understand TV and books are very, very different and can appeal to different audiences. I'm sure the show is picking up a large demographic who'd never read the books before, and who before the show appeared probably never would of either.

As it stands, Bean was a good choice for the role. Firstly, as was said previously, his casting added "gravitas". Great choice of words, very accurate. He also brought legitimacy to the show, after all it's the dude from Lord Of The Rings in another fantasy show. Third, he could be quoted as saying, "It's LOTR but with sex" to sell the show. All good things to get the show moving and bring in an audience. Never underestimate the man appeal of Bean, he's a legend. I believe I've said before that in my opinion he should be in every film ever made

Now the audience is there, the producers have to keep them. Which is why is happening so late may prove tricky. Be interesting to see if there's much drop-off before series 2.

As for all this 11 series and 2 films nonsense people are talking about, yeah right. Very very few shows last that long, regardless of what source material is available. There are reasons for this beyond the scope of my little post here

But you see, as I already said 24 is about jack bauer as he takes the fight to the terrorism He opens People eyes to conspiracies and he's basicaly a one man terrorist killing army. Game of thrones hasn't based it's entire plot around one character at all, most of them have actualy been given equal time we know as much about many of the characters as we did about nee stark.

Like I said it's a very different show, structured in a very different way. Game of thrones is a show driven by MANY characters, 24 was only ever really driven by one.

I agree that the show might not last as long as people think though, I have actualy said similar myself on here before, not many shows last 12 seasons.

[Sane]

Just watched the season finale, absolutely awesome. In my mind the last 2 episodes have managed to raise this show from really good to truly amazing!

[rmoxon]

Yeah, the Finale just proved what I have been saying in this thread, the writers are not hindered by what happened at the end of the 9th episode, They now have a major platform to build on, and the end of this finale was just brilliant and made me excited for it to return.

[Harry]

Well said, but I'm still pissed they

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killed my nigga' ned

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I actually shed a tear when Rob was cutting away at the tree and spoke with his mother.

[Atticus]

What an amazing season of TV. In a world of Sky+ and watching shows at will, here's one that gave me an appointment to view, every Monday night without fail. Best thing to come along in a while. Hope it gets the audience it needs to sustain it

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the casting of Sean Bean was a clever move, possibly drawing a wider audience for a niche genre, hooking people into the many layers by the time his character copped it

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[Matt]

OK, so....

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budget implosion next season, lol.

I'm still not entirely sold on this. Eps 3 to 7 were magnificient, but since then it's all been setup. I appreciate things never pan out as expected, but it will ultimately leave the audience cold as there's little pay off. Killing off main characters makes it hard for me to care about anyone now, as they may all start dropping like flies next season.

Discussed with a mate today who has read the books, and he was saying they dropped two huge battles from the show, presumably due to budget reasons. So dropping in three dragons at the end, well, lol

Look, I think all shows should have Sean Bean and Dragons in them. They're both awesome. A shame they will not share any screen time. TBH I may give the books a go, get a better understanding of the richness of the world.

I'm also not overly impressed with the handling of the fantastical elements. Yes, the series started with some white walker creatures, but then everything else was myth. I didn't believe the "dragon's blood" thing, but turns out it's true. There are now witches casting strange spells, dragons, and creatures that go bump in the night. I'm all for those things, just think they could of been introduced earlier, or at least more strongly. There were hints, but I didn't see the show going that direction.

All very interesting and a pain in the arse having to wait a year for the next season. Too much setup the last 3 episodes without any resolution. Kind of left hanging now.

Loads of potential. In 5 series times, this may be talked about very highly.

[prinnysquad]

MAJOR SPOILERS OF THEME AND CONTEXT (but not specific content spoilers) -

One of the major points of the first book is

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that the world thinks it has a degree of Enlightenment, where in the richer, affluent areas, the likes of spectral walkers, dragons, etc, are frowned upon, or not spoken off - ignorance is bliss. But after the crisis of the balance of power being smashed by the murder of Stark, it kick-starts a reaction of disagreements, and these ancient 'myths' come more to the forefront as the scramble for the upper hand takes hold, and enemies outside of the Kingdom try to take advantage of the upheaval. Introducing fantasy elements too strongly early on spoils the sense of war creating a vacuum of reason, destroying the status quo, and the idea of these elements becoming more prominent in this context. It's an epic set-up for what comes next - the forces of discord and darkness are poised to strike while the nation tears itself apart.

In the following books, there's an emphasis on some new characters, and old characters take on more responsibility. There seems to be such a big deal about killing off a main character early on, peeps really need to read the books to get a grasp on why, and what happens

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[PeteJ]

My response!

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Episode nine missed out on two battle scenes. One they covered pretty much correctly, when Jamie is captured, as in the book it was written from Mummy Stark's perspective. They could have done a better job setting it up though. The second battle with Little Charles Dance was unfortunately missed, but the producers have said they'd rather spend the time on character development than on a battle scene which "looked like a PS2 game".

Also remember that although the 'lead' is gone (though he was never actually the lead - he had less screen time than other characters afaik), secondary characters in the first book become much more fleshed out later on. You'll have characters to cheer and boo at

I'm with you on the fantasy elements. I wasn't expecting them either and if I'm honest the last page of the book, with the dragon reveal, was the biggest WTF moment for me, followed by Ned and the Zombie attack (two separate events, sadly). For me though, I like that this story can shock me. So long as it continues to be well written I don't care where it takes me.