Yep. All of that.
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Film 06 - Rocky Balboa
Sixth entries in long running franchises ain't all sunshine and rainbows. They can be a very mean and critical place, and writer/director's don't care how tough your expectations are, the responses generated can beat these entries to their knees and keep the franchise there permanently if they let it. Reviewers, online fansites or nobody is gonna hit as hard as box office reception, it's about how well a long overdue film can deliver and keep moving forward. How much money it can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done.
Returning to tell the tale of a later years Rocky who is close to having lost nearly everyone close to him and feeling like society has decided for him that he's physically finished.
Where does Rocky Balboa sit in the worthy canon arc for the franchise and did it deliver on its attempts to take another pass at a fitting closing chapter for the franchise?Comment
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For me Balboa was an unexpected shot in the dark. I read once that Stallone wrote the film during his career lull as like the original the idea paralleled his feelings in his own life at the time and that even then he had his wife read it and she told him it was good but he had to go back and rewrite it again without his ego, giving us the version we have now.
Going back to the idea of taking all the films and forming the purest distilled trilogy. Along with Rocky and Rocky II the third entry for me would be this one. I could live without some of the over editing in the final fight and the boxer he's up against could be stronger but outside of those wrinkles this is the first sequel to properly bring the character back to the way he should be. He's evolved from the opening entries but not so much as to not make sense, the positioning in his life makes sense, there are some lovely call backs that make sense and even without being of an older age it's a return to an underdog story but from a really relatable place. It has so much heart and as a second attempt at closing out the franchise it's perfect. Love it.Comment
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Yep, I felt Rocky Balboa was incredibly strong. Like the first, it's very simple and just tells a human story and, as you say, it's full of heart. And it works. It feels genuine, sincere. It's a good film.Comment
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Film 07 - Creed
Apollo has a secret son and he's following in his fathers footsteps, the road to success being one attained by turning to the man who knew his father in his final days; Rocky Balboa. The film scored rave reviews and nine years after the prior entry began another chapter in the franchise's continuation
Did the long running magic of the franchise continue for you?Comment
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Everyone really likes Creed, but I got half way through and switched it off. I found it fantastically boring.Comment
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For me it's probably the second weakest entry in the franchise.
It's a very clearly well made film and it skates by on the principal that it's a spin-off rather than a sequel but the crux of the issue is that the world has a ton of sports based films that follow the similar structure of Rocky films. It's likewise a mountain of films that pale in comparison also and by moving away from Rocky you immediately gravitate in that direction. One of the issues with Creed is that it doesn't really have its own tale to tell so you're still following the same beats as a Rocky film where the underdog then has to prove to himself that he has what it takes, montage, final fight etc and therefore the film alligns itself up with being a spin-off little more than Rocky V was. The second key issue is that Jordan is an absolute personality vacuum in the film. One of the main reasons Rocky works is that you're sympathetic to him, he's an endearing character to an extent that Creed can afford to have added layers and it not stop you rooting for Balboa. I literally couldn't tell you who Creed fights in this seventh entry, just that he's singularly the most boring character in the entire saga. That kind of leaves you with the one remaining hook which is getting a seventh arc continuation of Rocky but it even stumbles on that count. He's retired, telling old stories, running his restaurant - all retreads of the sixth film. Then he's not talking to his son etc so now we're even trying to roll back the point of the sixth films ending. Paulie's dead too and now Rocky has cancer so we have a massive shot of backpedaling depression making for something that threatens to suck the air out of the room. It might be dramatic but it's the opposite of the appeal of a Rocky film and what makes them and the character endearing. I didn't need to potentially have Rocky's last on screen appearance be his gaunt, cancer ridden face anymore than I need to see Harry Potter get dementia in his 70's.
So yep, it's a much better made film than Rocky V but it still feels like a dull remake more than anything else.Comment
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And the end comes around so quickly:
Film 08 - Creed II
This time Stallone took a heavier level of involvement making this entry as much a sequel to Creed as it also is to Rocky IV. Lundgren returns with Drago helping his son to fight, Creed wanting revenge for his father death.
Where does this second Creed focused entry sit with you and how do you feel about the upcoming entry moving beyond Rocky?Comment
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I enjoyed Creed II more than the original but it's for the clear reason that Stallone couldn't help but to allign it more closely with the rest of the franchise. It plays more like a Rocky film and once again it's the parts of the film that specifically focus on Creed himself that are the least interesting.
With Rocky not in the third film I feel like the 8 film strong evidence trail is that we're set for the weakest entry yetComment
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I really enjoyed Creed. Maybe zero expectations helped make it a pleasant surprise but I loved seeing Stallone as the character at that stage of his life. Just felt it had a lot of heart ... the whole fam loved it. Creed II didn't quite hit the same highs for me ... less of the subtleties that made the first hit the mark... more a straight up Rocky film.Comment
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Yeah, I really enjoyed Creed too. It's kind of Rocky with a bit of Rocky Balboa in one movie. The balance was a bit tricky at times in terms of whether the focus should be on Rocky or the Creed character but I felt it mostly leaned in the right direction and kept focus through most of it.
But Creed 2 totally got that wrong for me. It desperately wanted to be a Rocky movie. But also a Creed movie. And I don't think they found the balance. And maybe tying it into the most ridiculous of the Rocky movies didn't help. I felt it was a movie with an identity crisis and it didn't quite deliver on anything for me.Comment
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Loads of great takes in this thread so I actually don't feel like I have that much to add.
I will just say this regarding Creed 2, that marrying what was intended to be a heartfelt story about grieving over your newborn's disability with a direct narrative follow-on to a film where Rocky owns a talking robot and resolves the Cold War while quite literally wrapped in a flag was an insane decision.
Not a good film that one.Comment
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Rocky is an absolute classic with a great soundtrack to boot. Agree with the sentiments here... it's very raw and pure in a sense.
2 and 3 are instantly forgettable for me despite some great casting.
4 is one of those movies that's so silly and of the era it's awesome for all the wrong reasons. It's like a Hollywood parody of the key things that made the original great. It's saved again by great casting and a fabulous soundtrack... I mean, I still get goosebumps when that training montage track kicks in.
The Tommy Gunn one... meh.
The Creed movies... meh.Comment
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The one entry I haven't watched yet is the director's cut of Rocky IV that came out not long ago. I've heard good things about it, especially how it cuts some of the more eye rolling elements of the original so that version may possibly sit better alongside Creed IIComment
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