United Kingdom VI: Summer Lovin'

[kryss]

For a gaming forum, we are generally open to views on gaming. Could that be because people's actual lives do not hang in the balance if I don't believe that a certain game is in fact the GOTY?

An actual pandemic with an actual virus that yes, generally only kills the elderly, but can leave lasting physical symptoms (potentially life-altering) in all age ranges. Actual lives that actually matter. So when those of us with elderly parents (basically all of us) or young children (basically all of us) react with disdain to someone who spouts second hand opinions from experts they know, going against both published studies AND COMMON SENSE (i.e. something in front of your virus-carrying breath is better than nothing), where exactly is the surprise coming from?

Oh, and we realise you won't change your mind until someone you know dies. You're just that kind of person.

[Cassius_Smoke]

Of course not but get those deaths into perspective, historical perspective in particular.

Ah so it's numbers that matter. Because we aren't talking about millions (yet) it's not that big a deal. How big a number are we talking about?
I guess the Spanish flu wasn't a problem until a few million died then. Only at that point should we take action.
I guess with that thinking we shouldn't have stopped the holocaust until a sufficient amount of people died.

[Neon Ignition]

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

3,497 today as the new higher rate of infections holds

[Brad]

I’m 50 and Covid considers that elderly, I.e. it’ll have a ****ing good go at killing me so please wear a mask when you’re out in close proximity with others, just in case the experts and numbers are right. Cheers.

[Neon Ignition]

Guy on the radio nailed it today as to where this country has gone wrong with things. Can't get people to follow measures? Government's fault because they were the first not to follow them themselves. Don't agree with masks? Government's fault for spending 4 months telling people they were useless. Put the economy over lives? Government's fault for spending three months banging on about it because they want Pret reopened regardless of the much worse long term economic damage. Young people blamed for spreading the virus? Government's fault for spending 6 months telling everyone it was safe for young people and completely smothering out any discussion of them being perfectly viable spreaders of the virus just because you want schools reopened without having to carry out due diligence on it.

Same answer every time, completely and utterly failed in every capacity by a corrupt and incapable government.

[fallenangle]

I’m 50 and Covid considers that elderly, I.e. it’ll have a ****ing good go at killing me so please wear a mask when you’re out in close proximity with others, just in case the experts and numbers are right. Cheers.

I'm older than you and, just, in the supposed second most vulnerable age category and as I keep on saying but the selectively blind here seem not have noticed I've made it clear I've stuck rigidly to the rules throughout BUT hated it because so much has been and still is BS.

Far from that self-serving accusation casually expressed here earlier I'm actually being unselfish thinking more about the well being of other people. The 75+% of the population below the age of 60 who have, statistically, less chance of dying or suffering seriously as a result of contracting C-19. They have lives to get on with, jobs to do and mortgages to pay. Kids, teenagers and students have educational needs which the response to the pandemic has completely messed up.

I also have older relatives who are prime candidates for being C-19 victims because of both their age and other health issues. It would be nice if they didn't die too.

But there comes a time when you have to recognise that the treatment is actually worse for more people than the disease itself. Face up to that and take responsibility for your own health, self-isolate, wear a mask or whatever, just don't expect others to make any more sacrifices for you than they already have and at huge cost in every respect.

[Protocol Penguin]

I’m not completely sure what the individual who posted that word salad post above is saying, but it’s something like “it’s just the flu, bro” crossed with “let Covid run it’s course and genocide the weak, brutal survival of the fittest is better than compassion”, I think. I don’t think anyone with a “let them die” mindset is a decent, humane person, FWIW.

[Cassius_Smoke]

Words fail me. I could write a big rant but frankly, for a person over 50, they clearly haven't learned a days lesson in their life, no point trying now.

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/sep/13/blair-and-major-hit-out-at-boris-johnsons-plans-to-override-brexit-deal

Boris Johnson - Uniting Tories and Labour

[fallenangle]

I’m not completely sure what the individual who posted that word salad post above is saying, but it’s something like “it’s just the flu, bro” crossed with “let Covid run it’s course and genocide the weak, brutal survival of the fittest is better than compassion”, I think. I don’t think anyone with a “let them die” mindset is a decent, humane person, FWIW.

That is just the sort of insulting and ignorant response I've been getting here for any my off-message posts that have questioned if what we're doing and been told to do is wrong and actually costing more lives.

You're insulting somebody who has been there and bought the T-shirt as an official carer of a parent with COPD for 4 years and unofficially for at least a decade prior to that. People die of 'flu and if you knew what you were talking about and not just mouthing off you'd know that more people are dying of 'flu and pneumonia now than C-19 and that has been have been true for weeks.

'Flu is a bigger killer, it kills, now, about 60,000 people in England and Wales every year, year in year out and has being doing that for the whole of your lifetime. Think about that before using term ".......just the flu'' so flippantly.

[fallenangle]

Sorry for double post but I couldn't let this go unchallenged:-

Words fail me. I could write a big rant but frankly, for a person over 50, they clearly haven't learned a days lesson in their life, no point trying now.

More prejudiced insults, portraying a picture you've invented entirely in your own mind because it easier to condemn someone who you disagree with rather than accept they might hold some valid views.

Never admitting there's the possibility you might be wrong is a sign of immaturity; I've said all along my views are speculative but they've been expressed with entirely good intentions in mind.

Clearly that has been misunderstood by some here.

[Neon Ignition]

Flu deaths are typically varying between 10,000 and 30,000 per year which Covid is well past in half the time. It's not a useful comparison in any case either because it's not two inter changeable figures as people don't get one or the other. Covids figures are deaths beyond the normal flu death rate and the near 60,000 dead so far is a figure only as low as it is because of extensive social measures in place since March. Flu is also vaccinated against so a solid base of herd immunity keeps it in check, no such thing exists for Covid so the risk is unquestionably much more severe with it.

[kryss]

Are you getting your flu shot [MENTION=5818]fallenangle[/MENTION]?

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/13/fears-grow-for-care-homes-as-coronavirus-cases-rise-across-uk

Leaked documents from the Department of Health and Social Care have riled care home leaders as it reveals that first signs have merged of cases rising in homes with data also suggesting the real r number in some locations could now be up to an average of 1.7.

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2020/sep/13/uk-government-plans-to-remove-key-human-rights-protections

The Tories plan to opt out of parts of the European convention of human rights.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/13/is-this-the-start-of-a-second-wave-and-is-the-uk-prepared

This estimates we are 5 weeks away from matching the First Wave peak

[MartyG]

Flu deaths are typically varying between 10,000 and 30,000 per year which Covid is well past in half the time. It's not a useful comparison in any case either because it's not two inter changeable figures as people don't get one or the other. Covids figures are deaths beyond the normal flu death rate and the near 60,000 dead so far is a figure only as low as it is because of extensive social measures in place since March. Flu is also vaccinated against so a solid base of herd immunity keeps it in check, no such thing exists for Covid so the risk is unquestionably much more severe with it.

More than this, currently it's not known how the two viruses will interact with one another - virus interactions are not well studied. Their interaction could mean one weakens the other, but the other side is that one could cause the other to go into overdrive leading to worse infections and so more deaths.

Anyone who dismisses the situation we're currently in is not keeping up with current events.

Meanwhile, I did like Marr on the Marr show this morning. When Buckland was talking about the new C-19 restrictions on gatherings of more than six people being enforced, Marr said, 'so what if the marshall comes to my door and I say, well I am breaking the law, but only in a limited and specific way'? Hoist with his own petard.