England Team Thread

[vanpeebles]

They should be picked to be best for the team, not best individually.

[toythatkills]

Well, obviously. What did you think he was going to do?

[vanpeebles]

Well it didn't look like it did it. He picked individuals and then shoe horned them into a system which just didn't work at all.

[toythatkills]

To me it looked like he chose a system and then picked the team he thought would best work in it, rather than your way round. There's no other explanation for Hargreaves and Barry starting together.

Clearly it didn't work so he tried something else, better to get this kind of thing out of the way now, really. It's nice to see that he's trying new things to make an effort to find the best way for us to play, rather than just picking the same players in a 4-4-2 like we've had for years.

[Big Seany]

Didn't think we were too bad. Beckham can't cut it any more for 90 mins, still don't like the look of Wes Brown and can't understand for the life of me why he didn't pick Defoe. That said, it was bad enough one Skate giving away a penalty, for christ sakes.

I agree with Ezee's post though, spot on really.

[Rubix78]

What a boring game that was. We really need to pick things up a little, at times we looked a strong passing side but then we would just give it away and there was not many good crosses into the box. Rooney kept going back to defend leaving no one up front.

[rmoxon]

England are lacking a world class striker. Rooney isn't up to scratch. He does well at Man U because he gets given quality balls that let him get past defenders and when he does have quiet games (when he's marked by a good defender who knows what he's doing), ronaldo picks up the slack. At international level you're up against defenders who he won't be able to slip past like he can do in the league.

NO.... He ran rings around william Gallas when Man U played Arsenal in the cup... he didnt manage it last night becuase the team wasnt playing well enough to get the ball to him and he was constantly having to track back to even be slightly involved in the game.. he never had a chance to run rings round Gallas or anyone else for that matter last night

Seriously... if youre gonna moan about how bad england are, at least attempt to seem like you know what youre on about....

I don't really have a problem with the formation that was played besides the fact that the wingers wernt getting forward in support of rooney anywhere near enough. Capello has never played with this formation before and has clearly gone with it becuase the likes of chealsea, Arsenal, and liverpool amongst most other bit english teams often play with a simular formation. The only difference being they get their winders to attack, Bentley and Beckham hardly ever got forward at all last night, they were sitting really deep the entire game.

[ezee ryder]

abigsmurf is correct, Rooney is not a world class striker but that is cos he is not a striker at all. He is what you would call a forward to be honest (still not world class but quality nonetheless). A striker would be someone like Torres, Drogba or Owen, a player who is great in the box and gurantees you 20+ goals a season. Rooney is a hand full for any defence, the example rmoxon gave was a terrific one. He made Gallas and Toure look like school boys when United played Arsenal in the Cup. He is more a creator of goals rather than a scorer but he does get you important goals when needed. His performance against Liverpool on Sunday was typical of what kind of player he is and proves he is not a full on striker. His work rate and creativity during that game was superb but his finishing was not there, the only area where he is lacking really. To say he is a sub par striker is one thing but then to say that he relies on quality balls is totally contradictary as any striker in the world relies on good service

[abigsmurf]

Not sure I agree on the Arsenal game front. The fact is Arsenal were incredibly poor that day. I don't care how good you are, if a player runs past the players marking him that many times you're doing something very very wrong. You either catch him in offside traps or bolster the defence so he doesn't have clear runs.

Rooney has had a couple of pretty lengthy goal droughts at Man U. Ultimately, as I was saying before, if he doesn't get quality balls that he can run on to, he dissapears from games aside from the odd shot outside the box.

A good striker doesn't just rely on quality balls, you look at drogba and other proliffic scorers and they don't only need balls that enable them to penetrate the defence (*cough*), they can muscle their through the defence, leave them dumbfounded through footwork or score under very tight conditions.

[neoboy259]

Rooney has more to his game than scoring goals, he's not even what you would call a "proper" striker, comparing him to Drogba is futile as they're different in style.

I think, in fairness, the quality at England level is of a lower standard than at Utd's. Rooney has less of an impact because the support, running, creativity, imagination and desire just isnt there in England's game. But I guess Rooney's not the only player hampered by this.

[toythatkills]

Rooney has more to his game than scoring goals, he's not even what you would call a "proper" striker, comparing him to Drogba is futile as they're different in style.

Asking him to play the lone striker role though is effectively asking him to be Drogba though, whether he's like him or not. Saying he's not that kind of player doesn't cut it. If he's asked to play there, he needs to do it, or at the very least try.

[ezee ryder]

Not sure I agree on the Arsenal game front. The fact is Arsenal were incredibly poor that day. I don't care how good you are, if a player runs past the players marking him that many times you're doing something very very wrong. You either catch him in offside traps or bolster the defence so he doesn't have clear runs.

Fact is he made 2 quality defenders look pretty silly in that game on his own. Poor game or not. I could say Lampard or Joe Cole only have "good" games cos the other team played poorly but that would be an incredibly silly comment. Rooney also had a superb game against Liverpool this past Sunday, he didn't score but created 2 and worked hard for the team all game.

Rooney has had a couple of pretty lengthy goal droughts at Man U. Ultimately, as I was saying before, if he doesn't get quality balls that he can run on to, he dissapears from games aside from the odd shot outside the box.

Yes he does, but goals do not define his whole game. As neoboy also pointed out he brings so much more to the team than goals. You say if he doesn't get quality balls then he disappears from the game, that would apply to 99% of the strikers out there! As I said before though Rooney is not an out an out striker, he is more of a forward.

A good striker doesn't just rely on quality balls, you look at drogba and other proliffic scorers and they don't only need balls that enable them to penetrate the defence (*cough*), they can muscle their through the defence, leave them dumbfounded through footwork or score under very tight conditions.

A striker does rely on service, that is just a fact. You don't provide a striker with a good pass or cross and it will be very difficult for him to score. You use the example that a good striker can muscle their way through the defence, he must have had something supplied to him to muscle his way through?! Unless he is taking on the whole defense himself! Drogba's 2 goals on Sunday weren't created for him all by himself. The first one was passed through and just fell oh so kindly to him to hit and the second one was after an Anelka flick on.

Asking him to play the lone striker role though is effectively asking him to be Drogba though, whether he's like him or not. Saying he's not that kind of player doesn't cut it. If he's asked to play there, he needs to do it, or at the very least try.

He can only try if the players around him support him and supply him. When he plays for England, the likes of Gerrard, Joe Cole and Beckham don't support like his team-mates at Man Utd do. When this happens he starts to come into the midfield to get involved, which is exactly what happened in the France game and many England games before that.

[Matt]

LOL at anyone doubting Rooney's ability. His work off the ball is second to none in the country. He pulls players very well. I think he does need either a dedicated frontman or two supporting wingers to get the most out of him, but he's still far and away the best striker in the country - great technique, very hungry every game.

Like every other England player though, he wanders in to the middle of the pitch looking for the ball. As others have said, with proper support like at Man Utd he's amazing. If only we had a player like Ronaldo.

[Big Seany]

I see Michael Owen has allegedly been bleating and moaning about being left out of the team, beefing out Capello by saying that the players on the pitch "didn't know what they were meant to be doing".

What they are meant to be doing? Well, last time I checked, Michael, you were a ****ing footballer. Your job is to go out on the pitch and, as part of a team of eleven players, score more goals than your opponent whilst defending your own goal.

[neoboy259]

Asking him to play the lone striker role though is effectively asking him to be Drogba though, whether he's like him or not. Saying he's not that kind of player doesn't cut it. If he's asked to play there, he needs to do it, or at the very least try.

If you'd stuck Drogba, or any other striker up front, on his own for England, they'd struggle. This is a shortcoming of the national squad. Rooney is a quality player, but he aint no one man band.