England Team Thread

[abigsmurf]

The problem with Gerrard is he actively makes the players around him worse.

He runs across teammates, forces them out of position, gives the ball away in ways that allows the other side to break quickly. With Terry and Ferdinand you've got a defence that's strong enough to deal with these breaks. When one of them is out, teams tear England apart.

Gerrard runs around trying to be superman. This occasionally results in him having great games and usually makes him look like he's the most pro-active player in the team and makes other players look bad.

It results in a situation similar to what you get with ball hogs (not saying he is one, just using it as an illustrative example); a ball hog can look stunning and play some amazing football, seemingly carrying the side, most people however would argue that having a ball hog on your team can be very detrimental.

It doesn't strike you as slightly odd going "It's not Gerrard that's the problem, it's everyone else's fault!!!"? Wether we get youth up front, experience up front, someone like Lampard who is recognised as a world class player? It's always them, not Gerrard?

[merf]

I agree completely with smurf, Gerrard is a grown up version of the kid at school who never passed.

Occasionally its easy to say 'he won us the game' as he will score the goal or set up the winner but successive managers have struggled to fit him into a team pattern that suits his tactical indiscipline and selfishness.

I'd argue that whilst not the sole cause in either case but both Liverpool a few years back, and England, may have been better teams and achieved more without him.

He's kind of the defualt answer to a who's the best question that never gets challenged (like Sgt Pepper being best album, Shawshank best film etc)

[rmoxon]

The problem with Gerrard is he actively makes the players around him worse.

He runs across teammates, forces them out of position, gives the ball away in ways that allows the other side to break quickly. With Terry and Ferdinand you've got a defence that's strong enough to deal with these breaks. When one of them is out, teams tear England apart.

Gerrard runs around trying to be superman. This occasionally results in him having great games and usually makes him look like he's the most pro-active player in the team and makes other players look bad.

It results in a situation similar to what you get with ball hogs (not saying he is one, just using it as an illustrative example); a ball hog can look stunning and play some amazing football, seemingly carrying the side, most people however would argue that having a ball hog on your team can be very detrimental.

It doesn't strike you as slightly odd going "It's not Gerrard that's the problem, it's everyone else's fault!!!"? Wether we get youth up front, experience up front, someone like Lampard who is recognised as a world class player? It's always them, not Gerrard?

Exactly.

Thats the kind of thing that made me state he is in a protective bubble, and obviously that protective bubble extends onto these very forums as some people even on here fail to see his faults.

Hes been hyped up as the saviour of liverpool many times, as the man who single handedly won them the champions league ect (which lets be honest is a load of rubbish).

The fact is football is a team game, and Gerrard isnt even really a team player so im not sure how he can single handedly help a team win a football game. You can go on about how he may Motivate players and be inspirational all day long, but Ive never seen him do that for england, they never look motivated at all to me, course that isnt his fault.

Having said all that he does, as I have said, have as many good games as he has bad ones, but hes in no way as good as some people like to paint him. His passing game is often poor and as stated already hes a very selfish player.

He does make good forward runs, but you have to think If england still had someone like Paul Scholes, who has always been the genuine all round package of an attacking midfielder, then Capello might not so readily pick Gerrard every game.

Its just a shame there seem to be very few players of that type about in england really, Im not expecting Kaka or Messi, but more forward thinking players who can actualy help keep the ball at the same time would be nice.

Personaly I would play Lampard over Gerrard just becuase hes more consistant, though hes never been that good in an England shirt either if Im honest.

[Adrock]

Rafa pointed out a long time ago the inadequacy of gerrards game and was arguably the best manager to deal with the problems he has. Everyone in the media bemoans his playing behind the main striker but it's his best position as it means he can essentially have a free role.

There is no doubting his quality but he needs to be utilised in the correct manner, that isn't playing in a team that constantly lumps it forward. Hence his poor performance this season and why his England career has never reached the heights it should.

Oh, and a great many Liverpool fans have been saying this for a long long time, way back when gerrards performance at right wing was so good. A few of us are on this board.

I don't agree he makes players look worse though, he is a square peg in a round hole. The entire England system is poor at the moment.

[SharkSkin-Man]

Pretty much spot on, Adrock.

Moving Gerrard out of centre-mid and playing him as either an advanced right sided attacking midfielder or number 10/second striker was one of Rafa's most important decisions.

He's quite unique really in the sense that he is both an all-rounder and a luxury player at the same time.

[abigsmurf]

So... England 2018

Reckon we'll get it? We've certainly got the best bid but the BBC and Murdoch could mean that too many voters dislike us now.

[Flabio]

I reckon they'll go for Russia to be honest for 2018, and the USA for 2022.

[Adrock]

Russia has major problems with the perceived racism, so I think they may well suffer as a result of that.

According to the guardian the Spanish presentation was poor, the Dutch and English were the two better presentations. Will be interesting to see in just over an hour.

[EJG1980]

I'd love it if we got it, especially living in London, could see a load of matches right on my doorstep.

After our presentation this morning the bookies now have us as favourite to win. Apparently a lot of on the fence voters / some who would have voted for Russia have been swayed towards us by the strength of our presentation. I hope the bookies are right.

[abigsmurf]

About to happen... The suspense!

[Team Andromeda]

We'll never get it, FIFA hate our guts

[abigsmurf]

Rumours say we went out first round, Russia won it.

[EJG1980]

Rumours say we went out first round, Russia won it.

To be fair, I read that their presentation video was full of scantily clad women, so on that basis they'd deserve the win.

[MarioMark]

FFS!

[yesteryeargames]

Fifa buch of corrupt scumbags, stick your world cup !! maybe by 2030 they will have some fair voters on the team. Thank you daily mail / other press and panorama for helping to ruin the bid too!

worst choice of the 4 by far,