The Raid

[rmoxon]

Heh, well for me it's certainly one of the lesser Bruce lee films.

I know plot isn't vital in most martial arts films, but Bruce lees films were generally solid in the story department. Fist of Fury is a film that I feel has real emotional weight for instance. Enter the dragon has none of that though, it's has an extremely silly and somewhat boring plot. A guy is asked to play James bond and go undercover in a martial arts tournament... And well that's it really, its a very daft and almost non existant plot that is just there to set the stage for Bruce lee fighting people. Now that itself would be fine if the fights were any good, but I don't think they are, they short and boringly choreographed bouts that amount to little more than a series of idiotic looking people prancing about and posing alot.

Its actually quite a boring film, ive read numerous reviews praising it over the years, i know its well respected, but no one ever seems to do a good job of explaining why they like it, its like they Dont really know. I find that quite odd and all i know is that I much prefer almost all his other films.

[QualityChimp]

ive read numerous reviews praising it over the years, i know its well respected, but no one ever seems to do a good job of explaining why they like it, its like they Dont really know. I find that quite odd and all i know is that I much prefer almost all his other films.

But...but... I just said why!

OK, I'll expand a bit:
The Score - Lalo Schiffrin's brilliant score is exciting, funky, mellow and full-on. From the authentic strings of the banquet scene, to the subtle stealth sections, to the music in Williams' headphones and the classic opening theme which may be the first examples of samples used in a song, this is a great soundtrack.

The characters are simple, but interesting. As Williams says "You come right out of a comic book", but in the context of an ensemble film, it works fine here. Lee, Williams, Roper, Han, Bolo, Roper's assistant, the harem madame, Parsons and so on all have enough to say and do to play their part.

The dialogue - pretty much everybody has at least one good line (apart from Williams, who has all great lines). I'll resist quoting or I'll put up most the film!

Bruce Lee - his other films are good, but seem to lack the polish in this bigger-budget production. I prefer Jackie Chan, but this was a brilliant showcase of Lee's fighting skills. You're right that the fight scenes are nowhere near as polished as something that Sammo would choreograph, for example, but Lee's screen presence elevates them.

There's also the little stories and rumours around it.

• Sammo, Jackie and Yuen Biao all feature in this.
• Bruce Lee doesn't do the flip at the start, it's Yuen Wah.
• Whilst filming, a body washed up on shore and production stopped and Lee used the time to exercise. One of the extras (rumoured to be a Triad) told Bruce he wasn't very tough, so Bruce suggested they both had a punch each. Bruce deflected the blow at him and the Triad felt nothing. He went to laugh and all his teeth fell out...
• Bruce was bragging that he wrote the film, so the scriptwriters changed Mr. Smith's name to Mr. Braithwaite as it was harder for him to pronounce.

The thing is, for a lot of people, this is a film they see whilst growing up and it either clicks with them or it doesn't.

Me? I love it!

(But The Raid is more exciting!)

[prinnysquad]

I prefer Fist of Fury to Enter the Dragon. It's Lee at his most furious, and has more of a 'kung fu' plot - rivals schools, Chinese vs Japanese, masters and revenge, etc.

Lee going ape **** in the rival school, unleashing kick after kick, is his best moment imo.

[rmoxon]

But...but... I just said why!

OK, I'll expand a bit:
The Score - Lalo Schiffrin's brilliant score is exciting, funky, mellow and full-on. From the authentic strings of the banquet scene, to the subtle stealth sections, to the music in Williams' headphones and the classic opening theme which may be the first examples of samples used in a song, this is a great soundtrack.

The characters are simple, but interesting. As Williams says "You come right out of a comic book", but in the context of an ensemble film, it works fine here. Lee, Williams, Roper, Han, Bolo, Roper's assistant, the harem madame, Parsons and so on all have enough to say and do to play their part.

The dialogue - pretty much everybody has at least one good line (apart from Williams, who has all great lines). I'll resist quoting or I'll put up most the film!

Bruce Lee - his other films are good, but seem to lack the polish in this bigger-budget production. I prefer Jackie Chan, but this was a brilliant showcase of Lee's fighting skills. You're right that the fight scenes are nowhere near as polished as something that Sammo would choreograph, for example, but Lee's screen presence elevates them.

There's also the little stories and rumours around it.

• Sammo, Jackie and Yuen Biao all feature in this.
• Bruce Lee doesn't do the flip at the start, it's Yuen Wah.
• Whilst filming, a body washed up on shore and production stopped and Lee used the time to exercise. One of the extras (rumoured to be a Triad) told Bruce he wasn't very tough, so Bruce suggested they both had a punch each. Bruce deflected the blow at him and the Triad felt nothing. He went to laugh and all his teeth fell out...
• Bruce was bragging that he wrote the film, so the scriptwriters changed Mr. Smith's name to Mr. Braithwaite as it was harder for him to pronounce.

The thing is, for a lot of people, this is a film they see whilst growing up and it either clicks with them or it doesn't.

Me? I love it!

(But The Raid is more exciting!)

See all this here that you just wrote is exactly what I meant by the reviews praising enter the dragon don't make sense...

Ok... Well actually, I appariciate that you like the music, but everything else you mention is less saying why you think it's good and more just like you're going "look man, it's enter the dragon, it's awesome and cool and I love it... Deal with it!"

For instance cheesy and badly delivered dialogue like "you come Stright out of a comic book" is not good, in fact it's eye rollingly bad. In fact that is why it is such a memorable line, becuase it's so stupid and no one in the history of real life has ever even attempted to speak like that, becuase they would sound like a dick head.

You also go on to say you like the film becuase of all the little myths there are around about it. That just goes to prove my point.. No one knows why it's good so they resort to saying things like " it's enter the dragon, it's awesome and cool and it might have Jackie chan in it".

I actually think you hit the nail on the head when you talked about people growing up with the film, if it was a persons introduction to Kung fu movies (as I imagine it was for many) then I can see why it may hold value for certain people, however as for being a film that's actually good, I really don't feel like it is.

[QualityChimp]

Well, you said nobody explains why they like it, so I thought I'd list some of the reasons why I do.

At the end of the day, it'd be a dull world if we all had the same tastes, so it's OK we differ in opinion on things

I'm just pleased you went to see The Raid at the cinema and enjoyed it.

[rmoxon]

Yes. The raid we deffinitley can agree on. Fantastic film.

[monel]

If I had to randomly watch a Bruce Lee film, it would be Fist of Fury 99% of the time. His character, the plot, the fights, it all works in that film. I haven't seen The Raid .

[monel]

I saw this film over a week ago. I hadn't had much sleep the day I watched it and was extra stressed but it was really enjoyable viewing. The best thing I did was to not read any reviews except for a couple of forum posts and maybe a rough preview / first impressions thing online. The screening I went to was around half full (maybe a bit more) but the audience were brain dead, with no reaction at all to the fights (real shame). A couple walked in 5 minutes into the film, and then walked out a minute after that- I think they were put off by the subs.


I thought the film was very good, but I really need to watch it again as I didn't watch it in the best condition, and I missed a bit of a fight, too. The fights were great and the storyline was good enough for me, really did remind me of a MA version of Die Hard. I also regret not having gone to see Ong Bak or TYG / Warrior King at the cinema (had seen them ages before they were released here) as I can see now how much I would have enjoyed them on the big screen. Although part of the fun is having never seen the film before, so it holds surprises for you. It was brilliant to see a film like this at the cinema, in the year 2012, something I would never really have expected. That's why any criticisms of the film I do hold seem a bit unwarranted, as a film like this is quite rare these days. Like the bit in the drug room, some of the fighting didn't seem to hold that vicious spontaneous feel, kind of seemed choreographed / dance like at moments, which isn't what modern action films with the brutal element usually go for. Then again, I would still need to see it again.

I left the screening in a good mood, had forgotten about life's problems for 90 minutes, and would watch it again if I get the chance.

I wonder what their next project will be like, and the best thing that can happen is that I hope it pushes Tony Jaa and the Thailand guys further, as they need the competition to perhaps inspire and motivate them.

[Guts]

Just saw this in the cinema a few hours ago.

Quite enjoyed it, good fight choreography and the action was nice and brutal. I kinda wanted/expected more cool shooting scenes though. Some of the fights carried on a bit too long also, but all and all a good, solid action flick.

[QualityChimp]

Pleased you finally got to see The Raid, Shinobi, but it's a shame you weren't 100% when you saw it.

It's really odd that the audience in your screening was so quiet. Mine was great, full of cheers and oofs of empathy, but nobody ruining it. Perfect.

I had a couple of friends refuse to see it because it's subtitled. Can't understand that attitude. Thankfully, the people I went with were a real mix (not kung-fu fans like me) and they all enjoyed it.

I don't think it's showing anywhere any more, but it's had a good run. If memory serves, don't you live in Europe somewhere, Guts? Maybe Latveria? Was it subbed in your country's language?

I'm curious if they'll do a dub for the home video market to appeal to the people who avoided it because of the subtitles, or just accept that they wouldn't see it.

[Guts]

I don't think it's showing anywhere any more, but it's had a good run. If memory serves, don't you live in Europe somewhere, Guts? Maybe Latveria? Was it subbed in your country's language?

Hahah!

Actually I live in the frozen wastes of Hyperborea (or in other words, Finland), but close enough.

Yes, it was in the original Indonesian with Finnish subtitles. Everything is subbed here, there's no dubbing culture of films or TV in Finland as we're such a small nation that it wouldn't be financially profitable I guess, and for that I'm really glad, I can't stand dubbing in films. Only animated films/TV shows for smaller children are dubbed in Finnish, but even then there's usually the original version available too in cinemas for adults and bigger kids.

[QualityChimp]

The Raid is due out on DVD and Blu-Ray on 24th September.

Play.com have an exclusive steelbook, if that's your thing.

Plenty of extras including director commentary, fan films and so on.

Interestingly, there IS going to be a dub on this! I know that most people on here won't listen to it but if it gets more viewers then huzzah.

Limited Edition Steelbook Artwork: Based on designs by award winning comic book artist Mark Simpson AKA Jock. First appearing in EMPIRE magazine and now exclusive to this Steelbook.
Directors commentary *Exclusive to UK Disc*
The Raid feature - original language with English subs
The Raid feature with English dub
Featuring U.S. and original UNCUT version.
Trailers
Video Blogs
'Claycats: The Raid'
The Raid Fan Films
Featurettes
Behind the Music with Mike Shinoda and Joe Trapanese
An Evening with Gareth Evans and Iko Uwais

[BaronSqwelch]

If I was a director I would do an english dub but would use small children, old people and drunks who might not even be talking about the actual film, talking about cake or france maybe.

Just to piss off the 50% of the audience who sometimes walk out of screenings I am in (Brum Cineworld) when they find a film is subtitled. Something that upsets me for more than one reason...

Anyway...have this pre-ordered and am looking forward to it immensely!

[QualityChimp]

I saw it at Brum Cineworld!

Great crowd, responded appropriately at each scene and I didn't see anybody walk out, but I was pretty gripped to the screen!

I'm pretty sure I've seen some films dubbed how you described...

[BaronSqwelch]

I have been reliably informed that they now warn you at the till "You DO know this has subtitles don't you?"
Been a while since Ive been as I now pretty much only go to The Electric...but it used to happen all the time. Watching Switchblade Romance I was the only person left after it started