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Virtua Tennis 3 - XBL Demo

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    #61
    It'll be news to me

    Us working on VF5 that is :P

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    S0L
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      #62
      but also the worst with Virtua , F355, and Crazy Taxi.
      Sorry as a Big Sammy Hagar and Van Halen fan the music in F335 was perfect . And Crazy Taxi music went well the game

      How many people on here can actually display 1080p anyway
      I can , and maybe its just me but I really can't see much diff to running this or the likes of Lost Planet in 1080i/720P . Well apart from the jaggies in Lost Planet to be that bit more noticeable


      Anway as for the game , Its ACE :P . A nice clean simply update of the DC classics .

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        #63
        Originally posted by S0L View Post
        It'll be news to me

        Us working on VF5 that is :P

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        S0L
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        Shame, I worry there will be no online play if SEGA handle the conversion themselves. Also a worry that there will be no anti-aliasing, as with the PS3 versions of VF5 and VT3.

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          #64
          I have just played the demo

          Noticed the computer perfect lobs are still there.

          Sharapova character model is not that great compared to the others.

          I also found that I had to use the D-pad because I could not get the angles with the analogue stick Hope my pad isn't breaking.

          Beat Williams and Sharapova with net play and Federer was suprisingly easy playing against himself. How the hell they generate so much power compared to when we strike the ball is a little annoying too.

          Think I won't purchase this on full price though stick to my dreamcast versions or top spin. Wait for the price to drop a bit.
          Last edited by qupe; 17-03-2007, 06:34.

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            #65
            I liked the kickstart myself, you have no choice but to learn the mechanics of the game.

            This is being picked up on day one.

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              #66
              Originally posted by Combination View Post
              I liked the kickstart myself, you have no choice but to learn the mechanics of the game.

              This is being picked up on day one.
              Agreed. I found it difficult for the first few games, but when I composed myself and stopped making stupid play decisions, I was winning games relatively easy.

              I hope some places get this early, really looking forward to getting some LIVE action with it!

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                #67
                Originally posted by Kotatsu Neko View Post
                I have a 'full HD' 1920x1080 panel.
                I thought your panel was 1080i?

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                  #68
                  Originally posted by Brats View Post
                  I thought your panel was 1080i?
                  There's no such thing as an interlaced panel, as all LCD screens are progressive. The input is 1080i, which in the case of 30fps or less material becomes a flawless 1080p image on screen. With 60fps material there will be some interlace artefacts due to the conversion, but the resolution is so high (and the lines so thin) I honestly haven't noticed them.

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                    #69
                    Originally posted by Kotatsu Neko View Post
                    There's no such thing as an interlaced panel, as all LCD screens are progressive. The input is 1080i, which in the case of 30fps or less material becomes a flawless 1080p image on screen. With 60fps material there will be some interlace artefacts due to the conversion, but the resolution is so high (and the lines so thin) I honestly haven't noticed them.
                    Yeah I know that their is no such thing as an interlaced LCD panel, but your panel is not what is usually described as a 'full HD' panel which can display a native 1080p image direct from source.

                    But a 1920 x 1080 game will benefit you, whether interlaced or progressive.

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                      #70
                      Originally posted by Brats View Post
                      You must have been playing retards. In real life tennis, the top spin shot is the all conquering passing shot (watch Federer and see how many back court winners do not use top spin).

                      The whole point of Top Sin 1 & 2 is the risk reward gamble using more difficult shots, just like real tennis. The top spin shot is pretty easy to counteract with good slice returns (again just like real tennis) which is why you need the risk shots as a further increased risk reward shot.

                      I'm looking forward to this, but none of the VT games really play like real tennis and it's very easy to exploit the game.
                      That's only true about VT1 not VT2 which has a lot of realistic elements and is really well balanced. It's more realistic than Top Spin 1. Going back to your comments in the other thread about depth and positioning , you don't understand how important these elements are and how badly Top Spin gets them wrong.

                      The impact of depth on an opponent isn't just about the pace of the ball but how much bounce they have to work with and how far back your pushing them to get behind the ball. The deeper it is the more their forced to lift the ball and the less power their likely hit with. A yorker in cricket for instance can't be lifted whether it's slow or fast. This is translated really well in VT2 but not in Top Spin. In Top Spin It's easy to smash the ball powerfully even when it's right up at your feet. Risk shots aren't difficult to pull off most of the time.

                      The point of positioning yourself around the ball is to get extra power and angle on your shots and thats also possible in VT2. In Top Spin as you admitted you have to sacrifice power and angle if you want to get round the other side or further to one side of the ball making it pointless.

                      As for VT3 I've played it a few times in the arcade against good players and it's hard to say how much of an improvement it is yet. It was on;y after playing VT2 for a few months that I could be sure that it was a huge improvement on VT1. Still it's a shame they didn't add more new things. They've replaced the slice button with a top spin shot instead of adding a 3rd button. I suppose thats due to them being stubborn about keeping the game to 2 buttons.

                      You can't judge the game properly from playing the AI though.

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                        #71
                        Originally posted by Oh_Mutants View Post
                        Coming into this fresh having never played the arcade version, and i have to be honest and say this (like VT2 did to some degree, after the magnificent original) has left me feeling a little cold. Graphically it's ace (sorry) as expected, but it all just feels a little shallow after a half hour bash at the demo
                        It doesn't do anything particularly wrong admittedly, but with only three types of shot (with no modifier ala Top Spin on the Xbox) there doesn't really seem enough depth to the play, and most of the points are won by reliance on the speed of the shot and the cpu 'guessing' the wrong side.
                        Aside from the expected graphical overhaul, it doesn't seem to be any better a game than Virtua Tennis 2 to me, and considering that was ported to a machine that's now referred to as 'retro' i would have expected so much more of a next gen VT.
                        Of course it remains to be seen if the career mode is deep enough to make up for this, and i'm sure multiplayer Live will be a blast, but i was really hoping for a bit more
                        And my god the music...
                        Correct. I've always found VT to be a very shallow game tactically. You can't even hit flat shots. You have topspin, slice, and lob. Where's the flat? The game even handles swing timing for you, and you have a huge margin for error as far as positioning goes. The only real way to win a point is to wrong foot your opponent.

                        That's why VT is such an overrated series, and I cringe when reviewers compare other games (unfavourably) to VT. VT isn't very realistic at all. It's good for a quick 5 minutes arcade style, but if you're looking for a game that requires depth or skill, you won't find it here.

                        My favorites are between Top Spin 1 and Smash Court Tennis Pro Tournament 2 (and Roland Garros 2005) by Namco. Namco's game is actually semi realistic. You have to get the timing right on the swing. Not 100% accurate like a real player would, but you can't just swing it 3 seconds early. How 'sweet' your shot is, depends on your timing, not on how early you get to the ball like in VT. It's a good compromise between realism and fun. You obviously wouldn't want to play a simulation of Tennis, as it would be too difficult for a non tennis player. But you don't want it to be ez mode hitting like VT either.

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                          #72
                          Originally posted by S0L View Post
                          Difficulty - I suspect we maybe should have put the demo out set to easy. But then we'd have been told 'Too easy, no reason to buy it'. Instead we set it to hard, to give you some replay value. Full game has a difficulty slider, set it how you like. Again, you have the choice.
                          Why didn't you put the difficulty slider in the demo? Played it this morning, and I thought it looked great, but trying to actually win a match was massively off putting - now I know this is set to hard I'll take another look ( yes I suck at tennis games ).

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                            #73
                            Played a few more matches and am winning the cpu most of the time now. The key to winning is definatly at the net rather than the base line. What I tend to do is surf out wide on half to 3/4 power (surf on max and they hit it back at you just as hard) play 1 or 2 slice shots to get yourself right into the net and finish the point of. Also try and play it to the cpus backhand rather than forehand as the cpu punishes you far more on the forehand.

                            Whens this out then 23 or 30th?

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                              #74
                              Originally posted by Brats View Post
                              Yeah I know that their is no such thing as an interlaced LCD panel, but your panel is not what is usually described as a 'full HD' panel which can display a native 1080p image direct from source.

                              But a 1920 x 1080 game will benefit you, whether interlaced or progressive.
                              Toshiba promote it as full HD, as for most content (HD DVD, HD cable etc) it will be a full 1080 progressive. Even for most video games due them running 30fps it will be fully progressive.

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                                #75
                                Originally posted by Shoju View Post
                                That's only true about VT1 not VT2 which has a lot of realistic elements and is really well balanced. It's more realistic than Top Spin 1. Going back to your comments in the other thread about depth and positioning , you don't understand how important these elements are and how badly Top Spin gets them wrong.

                                The impact of depth on an opponent isn't just about the pace of the ball but how much bounce they have to work with and how far back your pushing them to get behind the ball. The deeper it is the more their forced to lift the ball and the less power their likely hit with. A yorker in cricket for instance can't be lifted whether it's slow or fast. This is translated really well in VT2 but not in Top Spin. In Top Spin It's easy to smash the ball powerfully even when it's right up at your feet. Risk shots aren't difficult to pull off most of the time.

                                The point of positioning yourself around the ball is to get extra power and angle on your shots and thats also possible in VT2. In Top Spin as you admitted you have to sacrifice power and angle if you want to get round the other side or further to one side of the ball making it pointless.
                                We had the same argument in the Top Spin 2 thread and your comments about Top Spin are completely incorrect. You cannot smash the ball when it is right at your feet. You're talking nonsense. If you could, the game would amount to little more than a bout of Pong.

                                In real life tennis, you could try and run around the ball like you can in VT but you would never hit the ball back with the same pace and accuracy. You are right that position is important in tennis (a point that Top Spin doesn't miss at all) but VT deals with it in a completely unrealistic way.

                                In real tennis you don't have time to think about position, move and hit a decent shot as your opponent plays his return, you need to anticipate position when you play your shot. On a real court, you never think 'Ooo, the balls coming to my forehand, but if I move from a backhand position I'll play a better shot' because by the time you get there, your muscles will be out of position and your shot will be either planted straight into the net or sent into orbit (unless you are hit a very defensive soft shot).

                                Watch what happens when real professional players are hit to their hand that they really didn't anticipate, they will fudge the shot nine times out of ten. Wii Sport tennis actually gets this right too (but allows a big let off by allowing the player to just waggle the pad due to the large area around the player where the ball can be hit).

                                VT allows you to move around a shot, hit it and still ping it back with pace to the very corner to the court. That's completely unrealistic. The point you're missing about Top Spin is that it isn't a test to move to or around the ball, it's about anticipation, general position and direction (very important in tennis), pressing the advantage, shot choice and strategy.

                                Top Spin will move your player for you, but gives the player more choice of shot based on risk/reward. The less chance there is for a winner, the more riskier shot is required. Or you can play a less risky shot but try to press the advantage, hoping to open up more of a gap later in the rally.

                                This is exactly like real tennis (which I used to play a lot). The comparison earlier in this thread between PES and ISS is somewhat fair. An even better comparison would be the difference between PES and Sensible Soccer. Top Spin gives you player with good shot ability and will automatically move the player towards the best position (to a degree) and let the player concentrate on everything else. VT allows complete control over position, but gives us players with unrealistic superhuman shot ability to compensate (the equivalent of Sensi's after touch). That makes it a fantastic arcade game, but to suggest it is realistic is a complete fallacy.

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