Mario Kart (Wii)

[teddymeow]

If you had no coins, being hit by another kart caused you to spin out. I miss the coins too.

Didn't they increase your top speed by a teensy amount too? I seem to remember that's what they did in the GBA version anyway.

[elkatas]

there's a thread on gamefaqs where a guy claims the online although lag free is a big lie.

The guy doesn't even understand how modern net games work, and some of his claims are based on lack of knowledge (for example, POW does only hit those who are front of you). But anyways, I guess it is better that I explain how Kart's online works:

When Quake was released, it was first FPS that could over the net. Netplaying, however, didn't work smoothly due slow connections and net package loss. If even single package would disappear during the match, game would not have idea at all what player was doing. This wasn't never problem in LAN networks, as connection is pretty much rock solid, and package loss is extremely rare, but for the net games, it was serious problem.

In the later versions of Quake, ID Software introduced new and revolutionary concept for net playing. When packages would disappear, instead of doing nothing, game would guess most logical choice for missing frames. For example, if player was running forwards before package loss, it would be logical that he is still running forward during next two hundred milliseconds, right? Although not perfect by any means, this opened gates for more complex games, and made playing possible even with more slower / unstable connections. These days, this compensation technology is used in all online games, and it works better in some genres than others. For example, driving games are rather easy, because only information you need to handle is position of the players. Fighting games, in the other hand, are nightmare for online developer, as missing even three frames* can ruin the game.

Nintendo's net code isn't anything special, but Mario Kart Wii is simple game so far as online is concerned. There is no complex or random physics, every vehicle has identical (huge) hitboxes, and players tend to go only single way (forwards). In fact, the only things you need to track is player positions, status, and item launches.

Each player has session of the game. He gets positions of the other players, and info when weapon is launched. As there is no any kind of randomization how shell bounces from the wall, trajectory of the shell is identical when calculated on each players Wii. Same goes for everything else. The only problem comes when someone loses big amount of packages. In these cases, game is forced to guess what happened like every other driving game is.

For example, in one game, I threw shell towards enemy, and he drove over the cliff. Second later, he appeared in the front of me. Packages had disappeared during the journey, and game believed that player was driving straight, down from the cliff, when in fact, he had turned left**. It may affect the real outcome if connections have been really laggy, and loss lots of packages, but for 99 percent of time, it doesn't really matter.

* Of course if you don't mind telekinetic punches...

** I had similar problems with Forza Motosport 2 when my little brother was using bittorrent on the background. Cars were teleporting, I bumped into invisible cars, etc. Game just tried to compensate missing packages by guessing where cars where, and results were pretty abysmal.

[Keith]

So...

...is there any lag or not then?

[Psyduck]

As I said way back on page 14 http://ntsc-uk.domino.org/showthread...=86141&page=14
there's no input lag, but you can't just magically get rid of it altogether, so we get this scenario with lots of different "versions" of the game running.
It's absolutely nothing new, tetris DS did it, every online driving game will have done it, I remember the first ever online game I played - Jedi Knight - did it too. It works better for some genres than others, as the guy above described for fighters.

[Kieran76]

It's true the AI would rob you blind, thats why it took so long for me to finish it all on 150cc.

[Myth]

I dunno if this has been mentioned but if you use a controller to play press up on the d-pad to only spin the once and hardly lose any speed when someone lets off a POW.

I keep mashing it but I think you just have to do it as you're about to spin out.

[Dazzyman]

All I remember from when I got SNES MK it took me ages as it kept cheating to get all golds. Coins I thought where a nusience part of it and glad their not in it. Amazing game that I played split screen for years. I dont find the AI as cheating on this though if your good at this you really can get a descent lead and the very odd time a blue shell comes isnt that bad, as for the rest of the attacks their counterable. About 12-14hours on this got me all golds.

[ItsThere]

Thanks to Tak from on here I got this after it had sold out everywhere and I love it! Its just great fun! I even really like power sliding with the wheel from the get go. I think this does deserve the success its getting

[fuse]

Not been following the thread, and this might just be me getting my knickers in a twist, but I just got this today and since putting it in 15 minutes ago I have been blue shelled 6 times in the 3 races I've played. Not a fantastic first impression, to put it lightly.

The steering wheel is no better than I was expecting, which wasn't great, but it (the game) looks quite pretty, which is more than I was expecting after all the people harping on about how it would look worse than the GC one.

[SuperBeatBoy]

I love seeing all your Mii's literring all over the place. I found myself as a giant statue on Luigi race, i was blown away.

[Shin Gouki 2008]

Hardly. AI cheated so badly in 150cc. For example, Mario & Luigi could activate star when ever they wanted, computer opponents karts were faster than yours, and everybody had so insane reaction speed that they could hop even over red shells. Rubberbanding in later MK games is so much tamer.

But what about the multiplayer modes?

Multi player Super Mario Kart and time trials were the most fun you could have with friends.

Playing against other people is where your skills were really sharpened and when you realised just how damn incredible the game was.

The single player mode was still way better than what we've seen since too.

I was so disapointed by Mario Kart 64.

64 was dull. Super was edge of your seat nail biteing stuff with insane laughs all the way.

The games was so addictive and i've never played a multiplayer game like it since.

It's the greatest multiplayer game of all time imo.

[Psyduck]

Yep, 2 player match race on ghost valley 1 was the best thing ever.

In terms of "cheating AI" I'm not sure I really agree. The AI was never even pretending to be "just like you", some of them had weapons you couldn't get for a start, so it just had different rules. If you play it well you can win any 150cc cup, there's not much the AI can do to stop you tbh since there's no red/blue shells for it to use. It's just that it punishes you pretty severely for the smallest mistake. Same can be said for a lot of other games though.
I'm pretty sure the AI on this cheats too, I'm sure I've seen it hit a moving barrier, like the plants coming out of the pots in waluigi stadium I think, and then move off at full speed straight away once it's gone.

[Kieran76]

Is there anyway I can save my game data for when I play my copy if the game on another persons machine? I ahve saved my mii in my remote but I can't seem to be able to copy my game save onto a sd card.

[Brad]

I love seeing all your Mii's literring all over the place. I found myself as a giant statue on Luigi race, i was blown away.

Indeed. My mum keeps driving a car in front of me on one of the circuits (my daughter made Miis of Nanny and Grandad!).

[gamelife]

Hardly. AI cheated so badly in 150cc. For example, Mario & Luigi could activate star when ever they wanted, computer opponents karts were faster than yours, and everybody had so insane reaction speed that they could hop even over red shells. Rubberbanding in later MK games is so much tamer.

I agree about the super kart being pure skill, if you were the best racer you would win, simple as that. for me, mario kart wii is prob the worst one for multiplayer (online and offline) as the game has been turned into a pure battle game where the people who finish top usually have the rub of the green and manage to avoid being hit every second by some weapon or other.

im a player who admires driving skill - so time trials are the best for me. there hardly any skill in multiplayer - its all down to luck most of the time which makes the game kinda shallow and empty. ive been in first place so many times and then only to be pushed back to 7th/8th at the last second...horrible!