why all the Sony hating?

[dvdmike]

Thats a bit unfair. The PS2 is indisputably the best system for 2D games from the prevoius generation. Its not the whole of SCEI that has the attitude, it's just SCEA.

IMHO the dreamcast holds that title.
Sony hating stems from them being the people's console choice to pissing them all off (esp in the uk) by overpricing and deciding on late release dates for hardware

[Wools]

Firstly, I'm curious to know (and I'm not trying to start a flame war with you, Master Chief - I'm actually enjoying this discussion) why you've specifically edited the piece from my last post which you're quoting from...?

Secondly, I'm no Sony hater. At heart, I'm a Nintendo fan, but I have never, ever posted on MS/Sony threads with the intention of doing those companies a deliberate disservice. I'm just stating why I think that Sony are getting the stick that they're getting/ they deserve (delete as applicable).

Thirdly, for the record - I have seen the "PSP is dead already" thread and it is a sentiment that I disagree with considerably. As for thwe hypothetical notion that it would be shut down if it was a "Nintendo is dead" thread, well, that's up to MartyG and/or his colleagues to confirm/deny on this thread...

Just to cut down on space, I'm resourcefull me! No specific editing Sir, I just picked the most intresting quote of yours and used that. Check any other post and you'll see I dont use the whole post, only the points I wanted to respond to. No offence was meant!

I'm not trying to label anyone who argues against sony a zealot, as I hope it comes accross in my post I find some of Sony's practises shamefull. Sadly Sony seem to release a peice of arrogant PR every week but that has turned into a lot more of a heated debate and has become just plain silly.

I still completly disagree with that whole thread and the idea that it still survives. The original poster made a point their was to be no "?" in the title and geared it towards a discussion of why it was dead. Some of it was an intresting read but it was far outweighed by the communial bollocking some peole were enjoying.

[EvilBoris]

IMHO the dreamcast holds that title.
Sony hating stems from them being the people's console choice to pissing them all off (esp in the uk) by overpricing and deciding on late release dates for hardware

I think that is partially true, but I know that some of my own bias against Sony is that people i general are so in favour of the Sony consoles that they don't give any other consoles a go. This attitude is what has led Sony to suceed in europe especially. Even quite a few people have this attitude on this forum too, the love what Sony has given them so much that they put blind faith in the next generation version and overlook the rest. It has been somewhat reaffirming to see that so many people picked up 360s and have commented on how excellent the new features are.

[Dogg Thang]

Yes Sony's attitude should be discussed and put down, but the chance for every zealot and hater to put the boot in? Bugger off. There's already enough hate, cynasism and hardened posts on here already without the chance for fanboys to put somethng down in flames. I'm tired of it all I really am.

Yeah that's pretty much where I am too. Sony pull a lot of ****. They aren't alone in doing so. But rather than threads that say 'Sony copies MS's online rewards system' followed by a discussion, we end up with 'Sony to raise the bar in all time lows?' followed by playground propaganda - "disgusting rip off", "downright nasty", "(Cutand)PasteStation 3" and much more.

Like we'll all sleep better if the top guys at Sony can't afford that new boat this year but the top guys as MS can. That's really all that this amounts to - these are corporations. They make money. It's their sole purpose. Nintendo included.

Right now there is a clear double standard. Sony can't take a piss without getting flamed around here. Not just being called out on it. Flamed. And if other companies are criticised, people are out with their pitchforks and torches (can we forget this thread - http://ntsc-uk.domino.org/showthread.php?t=60654). I couldn't give much of a rats ass for Sony themselves but it really gets in the way of actual discussion. Sifting through the venom in threads in which Sony are mentioned gets tedious, DS sales in every second page of PSP discussion gets tedious, not being able to hold Nintendo to the same standards as either of the other companies gets tedious. It's not good for discussion.

[dvdmike]

Evilboris what you say is very true the ps3 pre-order file at work is nearly 3 times the size of the wii pile no matter what the price is it will sell but they have as a company got the the stage they knocked ninty from, and in the process found their old forgotten "we rule all" company motto

[lurch996]

Sony themselves have made like 3 good games this generation, it is absolutely pathetic in terms of output compared to other companies.

And how many good games did Microsoft make on the Xbox?

IMHO the dreamcast holds that title.

I dont consider the DC in the same gen as the PS2, but if I did, it would be a close call

[mackemansj1]

I think the sony hate isnt jack on all the ms hate when the xbox was just coming out. Sony have made a rod for there own backs, "borrowing" ideas and the sheer price tag and the if you dont by our machine pr speak.

[Wools]

Sony themselves have made like 3 good games this generation, it is absolutely pathetic in terms of output compared to other companies.

Most the the things sony produce (not just games) are adequate for what they do, but there are plenty of better alternatives. I feel the same about the PS2, the only reason the PS2 is a good games format is because the popularity of the PS1 spilled over and devs all around the world made it the console of choice.

Sony aren't the ones to thank for Gitaroo Man, Metal Gear Solid etc, the developers are. If Sony didn't exist , these games would of been on another format.

Then surely three good games is better than none at all? Their are alternatives in the console industry and that gives you freedom to choose not to just stick to one. However the PS2 has a much bigger audiance than the Gamecube, Xbox, Xbox 360, DS and PSP. That gives developers much more possibilty's to reach a bigger audiance than their rivials.

So yes Sony are to thank for Gitaroo Man and Metal Gear. If it werent for a console no games could be played by anyone. Your argument is pretty flawed as you could apply what you said except put it to Microsoft or Nintendo.

Actually all you said was:
Q: There's only 3 good games on the PS2.
A: Well I have over 20. Am I wrong?

Q: The PS2 was only succesfull as the PSone was.
A: Possibly true, is that bad?

Q: Sony did not make Metal Gear Solid and Gitaroo. If Sony was not present they would be made on another format.
A: True yet if their was no market for these games they would not be made.

[ShadowDancer]

I nearly started this topic myself early this morning. I'm not sony's biggest fan, but i think they are getting a lot of unfair stick. I was a bit childish and wanted them to fail because i was fed up of them being the home console leader for so long and i honestly think that neither the PS1(x) or the PS2 has the games to warrant that.

However, it isn't sony's fault who buys the systems and the games, and they market things very well as stated all over gaming forums.

I hope they are given a run for the money this time, i think that would be more healthy for us all, and maybe they wont allow any old **** allowed to run on the ps3, well i doubt that, but sometimes my reasons for being down on sony aren't all sony's fault. I'm giving them a break.

[EvilBoris]

Actually all you said was:
Q: There's only 3 good games on the PS2.
A: Well I have over 20. Am I wrong?

Q: The PS2 was only succesfull as the PSone was.
A: Possibly true, is that bad?

Q: Sony did not make Metal Gear Solid and Gitaroo. If Sony was not present they would be made on another format.
A: True yet if their was no market for these games they would not be made.

Try reading it again I said Sony , as in SCE, SCEE, SCEA and SCEJ.

and for the record , there was no market for Gitaroo man , hence it's poor sales.

[Dogg Thang]

Hey, EvilBoris, let's not ignore Lurch's question - "And how many good games did Microsoft make on the Xbox?"

[Decider-VT]

I don't hate Sony but their attitude towards their customers leaves a lot to be desired. I don't particularly like having the high price of the PS3 justified to me by Ken Kutaragi with hollow promises that could never be fulfilled. I would doubt that playing games on the PS3 would differ that much from playing games on other systems, so the comparison he made between playing PS3 and dining in a fine restaurant is moot at best and insulting at the very worst.

I also disliked their justification of the PSP button design flaw as a "feature" that they initially refused to correct, nor do I like their proposal of "locking" purchased software to specific PS3 units, thereby killing the second-hand market. Sony's constant attempts to browbeat the consumer into buying their expensive proprietary formats (UMDs, Memory Sticks) also leaves a sour taste in the mouth and they appear to be doing it again with Blu-Ray. With that said, I believe they should be applauded for removing regional lockouts on PS3 software.

It's a shame, really. I know that the PS3 is likely to become the dominant format in the next generation but I'll certainly wait for a price drop before picking one up- I'll be having fun with my Wii and my 360 in the meantime.

[Wools]

Try reading it again I said Sony , as in SCE, SCEE, SCEA and SCEJ. And for the record , there was no market for Gitaroo man , hence it's poor sales.

Naa, I'm not going to do that.

So you meant Sony as a whole? That's what I meant as well! I did not section off and split their divisions. Anywho why does that matter?

Oh their was a market hence it sold. Very much Like Doshin the giant on the Gamecube and Ico on the PS2. Should Gitaroo Man be sold on the Gamecube? Popularity is not a barometer of how well suited any game is to it's host format. That's all down to a number of factors including the game itself, the hardware, marketing and the public.

[EvilBoris]

Hey, EvilBoris, let's not ignore Lurch's question - "And how many good games did Microsoft make on the Xbox?"

Did I say other companies as in Nintendo and Microsoft?

No, I said other companies. This includes capcom,konami etc
What I was saying is that Sony themselves don't appear to be capable of outputting a decent amount of high quality games. They repeatadly try and fail. Consider that Sony is a bigger company and should supposedly know the most intimate secrets of the hardware, what they have come up with has been somewhat of a letdown.

You seem to be misunderstanding my points here, I own a PS2 and I have played 10s of fantastic games on it. But I don't beleive any of these fantastic games to be a direct result of anything Sony has created.

I don't think Microsoft actually has a internal dev studio does it? other than making Flight Simulator and age of empires.

[Dogg Thang]

Okay - see, I didn't actually know the answer to that (which is why I prompted). So, how can you criticise Sony themselves for not delivering games to the PS2 when Microsoft doesn't seem to do that either? I think that was Lurch's point - you are holding Sony to a standard that you are not holding Microsoft to.