EDGE mag 10/10s

[Ian(not Ian)]

Stealth isn't a new concept though. Remember there was a 'stealth' section in a link to the past on the Snes...........

Perhaps you're thinking of the opening section, 'sneaking' into the castle. You could avoid most of the the patrolling guards if you timed your advance right. Watch patrol - get ready - move when patrol was off in the other direction = stealth. Rudimentary, but stealth.

[Skull Commander]

Perhaps you're thinking of the opening section, 'sneaking' into the castle. You could avoid most of the the patrolling guards if you timed your advance right. Watch patrol - get ready - move when patrol was off in the other direction = stealth. Rudimentary, but stealth.

I was thinking of a castle bit. It's been ages since I'v played it. One to dust down and play again maybe.....

[Wools]

And since when did fps need to be strategic anyway?

They don't need to be, but they can be.

Have you heared of or played Operation Flashpoint?

[Brats]

I was thinking of a castle bit. It's been ages since I'v played it. One to dust down and play again maybe.....

I think you might be referring to OOT. That had a stealth bit to get into Zelda's castle.

[Tig]

Too much text in this thread.

All i will say is this. To me the reasons games like halo/GTA/Mario get 10/10 is because they are yardstick games which at the time are the best the genre has to offer and will be influential in all future titles in that Genre. Bearing that in mind, i don't see why The orange box or LBP are on the list.

LBP should be on the list, according to your reasoning - surely this game will be the yardstick for every 'user-content' focused game to come in future?

It's blown the lid on the idea of 'creative play' in videogames. I think that will prove a very influential milestone.

The problem for LBP, I think, is that most people instinctively pidgeonhole it into an age-old genre which is already established. IMO, the Create/Share portion of the game represents an entirely new sort of genre in itself, which is only just beginning.

The problem with attaching a numerical score to a piece of subjective entertainment is that people seem to translate 10/10 into the word 'perfect'. It isn't, it's a crock.

No game, film, music, whatever, will ever be 'perfect.' A 'perfect' score is when you get 10/10 in a maths test. It's applied to things that are more mechanical. If games have to be given scores, then the best mark MUST be achievable to lend the system any credibility, yet it doesn't signify that the game is 'perfect'. Otherwise we might as well scrub the 10 and mark games with the top possible score being 9, which sort of renders marking it out of 10 utterly pointless.

Looking at that list of games, I'd say most of them would be in 'best of' lists, which is indicative of their quality, without ever claiming that they were 'perfect'.

This post needs to be nailed to the door of every thread about review scores

[Richard.John]

Goldeneye was great, amazing even, back in '96. It's an unplayable mess now though due to the N64's fuzz o vision and low FPS. A PC emulation is the best place for it. Modern games wipe the floor with it.

[noobish hat]

nope.

[kernow]

People still consider edge worth reading? wow.

[DCharlie]

Just curious, and i can think of several very valid reasons why not (it's a package mainly, games original impact should be the key, etc but i want to ask anyways :

Ian, why would Orange box not be deserving of 10/10 if Half Life 2 (a game included in Orange box) is?

I assume HL2 gets it for what it achieved in that time frame of release?
Orange Box i think deserves it - Portal and HL2 and Ep 2 and TF2 all in the same package (we do not talk about Ep 1!!!) seems like a great deal.

I don't look at 10/10 as meaning "perfect", i see it as an indication of a -must play- game.

The biggest abomination on the list is GTA4, obviously not every one agrees with that but the other games i think have at least a strong case for being on that list, but GTA4 ? Possibly Halo 3 as well is questionable , though i think it suffered from people in our group just being Halo'ed out. We played Halo 1 lan'ed on a weekend basis, then Halo 2 a couple of times a week... by the time Halo 3 came out, we'd just reached saturation point.

[amorenod]

I think you might be referring to OOT. That had a stealth bit to get into Zelda's castle.

That bit was easy. The real OOT stealth section was the Gerudo fortress.

[Brats]

The problem for LBP, I think, is that most people instinctively pidgeonhole it into an age-old genre which is already established. IMO, the Create/Share portion of the game represents an entirely new sort of genre in itself, which is only just beginning.

Does it though? Surely something like Trackmania was there years before LBP. You played the game, unlocked currency which enabled you to buy race track pieces, dewsigned your own track and then uploaded it for others to share. What does LBP do that is so different?

[egparadigm]

Goldeneye was great, amazing even, back in '96. It's an unplayable mess now though due to the N64's fuzz o vision and low FPS. A PC emulation is the best place for it. Modern games wipe the floor with it.

It's definitely not unplayable. I completed it on 00 Agent a few weeks ago.

I agree that it hasn't aged well in certain respects, but once you get used to idiosyncratic controls (feels archaic post-Halo) it's still as much fun as it was.

In GoldenEye enemies couldn't see you if there was a two feet fence between you, infact they could only see Bond when there was nothing in front of their line of sight.

Except on the Aztec level - then they could shoot you from 200 metres, with pin-point accuracy. They could also shoot through walls and ceilings, which could be exceedingly annoying.

I also have to reiterate that Goldeneye is by no means still the best FPS. Personally, I think it was out-gunned by Halo at the very least.

With regard to the "best of the genre" argument: where does one genre begin and another end? Zelda: OoT was described as an RPG in N64 Magazine, but I think we can safely say Zelda is more of an action-adventure these days. Judging which is part of which genre would be almost as subjective as the score.

[Leon Retro]

EDGE used to claim that only "Revolutionary" games deserved a 10

If that were true - only these from the list would have deserved that accolade.

Super Mario 64 (Nintendo 64) - E35

The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (Nintendo 64) - E66

Halo: Combat Evolved (Xbox) - E105


This bunch[however good] didn't deserve a 10.

Gran Turismo (Sony PlayStation) - E55
Half-Life 2 (Windows PC) - E143
Halo 3 (Xbox 360) - E181
The Orange Box (Windows PC, PlayStation 3, Xbox 360) - E182
Super Mario Galaxy (Wii) - E183
Grand Theft Auto IV (PlayStation 3, Xbox 360) - E189
LittleBigPlanet (PlayStation 3) - E195

All of them are 9s at most.


I'd have given GoldenEye a 10. I think EDGE acknowledged that it probably did deserve a 10 afterwards.

I think it's a difficult to award a game a 10 these days. There aren't any games that seem revolutionary. That is just a fact resulting from the games scene being mature.

[eastyy]

Yeah i agree that....a 10 should be for games that are great but also that are revolutionary

i mean games like gta4 and halo 3 for example there excellent.....but i have played them before in previous guises.....and there just more polished now

[Ish]

Does it though? Surely something like Trackmania was there years before LBP. You played the game, unlocked currency which enabled you to buy race track pieces, dewsigned your own track and then uploaded it for others to share. What does LBP do that is so different?

Good point. I've not played TrackMania (I don't really do PC gaming other than Civ anymore) but read about it with interest.

Not having played it I can't answer this - is it a matter of increasing accessibility? User created content has been possible for years (pinball construction kit, Repton Infinity, the construction kits on Amiga, editors for Doom and Wolfenstein etc. etc. - the list goes on!). LBP is bringing the concept to a potentially incredibly broad audience. I really think time will tell as to LBPs "greatness" and level of success. Personally I love it and listed it as one of my GotYs, but I'll be very interested to see if I, and others, are still creating for it and playing it in a years time.