UFOs exist, or do they?

[wakka]

That's the genius of the UFO hypothesis's location.

[Neon Ignition]

One of the recent videos genuinely looks like a fly is on the screen, imagine the mind blowing experience that fly would have felt travelling at sonic speeds

[MartyG]

One of the recent videos genuinely looks like a fly is on the screen, imagine the mind blowing experience that fly would have felt travelling at sonic speeds

Insects can pull as much as 400G (it's estimated), that's not natural

[kryss]

As it says in the Fermi paradox, if we take only our current technology we could technically enhabit the galaxy in 10000 years. If aliens sent out probes that long ago we'd see them all over the place. Maybe we are.

The Milky Way is about 100'000 light years in diameter. We don't have the technology to safely travel 1 light year really.

[MartyG]

We barely have the technology to get to humans to Mars safely currently.

[Cassius_Smoke]

The Milky Way is about 100'000 light years in diameter. We don't have the technology to safely travel 1 light year really.

Missed a few zeros...
'Even at the slow pace of currently envisioned interstellar travel, the Milky Way galaxy could be completely traversed in a few million years.'

However, if aliens were the first dominant species on their planet, and their planet is as old as ours, they'll have millions of years head start on us. We had the dinosaurs for 360 million years.

[wakka]

Only a few million years? You should've said. Get your shoes on, then. ()

Have you read Extraterrestrial by Avi Loeb @Cassius_Smoke?

It came out earlier this year and presents the evidence for Oumuamua (which I'm sure you remember - the thing that whizzed through our solar system which we couldn't identify in 2018) being artificial, and therefore extraterrestrial in origin.

I actually felt it was very credible and really quite awe-inspiring to consider.

I'm not going to write another dull essay like my last rambling post in here, but the gist of the book is that Loeb hypothesises that Oumuamua was a probe, powered by a lightsail. It's tremendously tantalising, because of course we'll very likely never know.

EDIT: the only thing I would add is that while Loeb's hypothesis and evidence are of great interest, the book is padded with stuff about his life, career and upbringing which IMO is uninteresting and irrelevant. He's a massive fan of himself, as well.

But if you can get past that - or, borrow it as an eBook or something and just read the most relevant chapters - I think you would find it of interest.

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/29/flying-cars-will-be-a-reality-by-2030-says-hyundai-europe-chief

It's not aliens - it's flying cars!

[MartyG]

It came out earlier this year and presents the evidence for Oumuamua (which I'm sure you remember - the thing that whizzed through our solar system which we couldn't identify in 2018) being artificial, and therefore extraterrestrial in origin.

Well, apart from it tumbling around in space meaning any solar sails wouldn't have been effective as they'd never be pointing in one direction.

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence"

[wakka]

Well, apart from it tumbling around in space meaning any solar sails wouldn't have been effective as they'd never be pointing in one direction.

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence"

I read this six months back, so you're testing my memory now - but I think as I recall that he might disagree with the assumption that it was tumbling, and that instead had another explanation for its changeness in brightness. I think so, anyway, but I might be wrong. He does definitely deal with the tumbling though.

I'm ill equipped (and unmotivated) to personally mount a defence of his theories to be honest, but mention it only as an interesting read for an extraterrestrial hypothesis from someone with more of a scientific background. It's certainly more credible than secret saucer bases in the Nevada desert (as much as I love those stories!)

[teddymeow]

I will change my mind when iodroutioi;sjdr;ol;lknsdlkfngvkblhzkfdhyt from the planet **&%&746hghy634ngkek comes along and jkcfuyiuye84yuiosdhfui on us all.

I believe it's actually spelt "Lrrr" and the planet is Omicron Persei 8.

[MartyG]

I'm ill equipped (and unmotivated) to personally mount a defence of his theories to be honest, but mention it only as an interesting read for an extraterrestrial hypothesis from someone with more of a scientific background. It's certainly more credible than secret saucer bases in the Nevada desert (as much as I love those stories!)

Sure, but he totally loses credibility with his claim that it being an alien probe "is the only possible explanation" - I can only conclude from that that the book was sensationalised to sell more copies. It's the only possible explanation.

There is only one conceivable explanation: the object is a piece of advanced technology created by a distant alien civilization

It's not tho, is it? There's another conceivable explanation - it's just a weird shaped space rock.

[prinnysquad]

See, that’s what I mean. “The only possible explanation.” It’s a crass and myopic claim. Designed to shut down challenges, it’s illogical and not in the spirit of knowledge discovery at all.

Criticism of these absolute declarations works both ways.

[MartyG]

But we've already agreed that aliens visiting the earth is massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively unlikely to be aliens and massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively, massively likely to be optical illusion / atmospheric / military aircraft

I do think it's likely there is life elsewhere in the universe, just that based on current physics and observations (because it's the only thing we can base any reasonable scientific conclusion on, anything else is speculation and science fiction), is that the distances, time and energy needed to navigate those distances (and that they haven't said hello) make it far less probably than me winning the lottery this w/e.

There's a chap called Isaac Arthur who theorises a lot of how alien technology could be and how advance societies could live; it's well worth a look, he put up a video analysing the US UFO disclosures.

[Cassius_Smoke]

The Kardashev scale is another interesting read.
The theory being that advanced civilizations would either have to harness energy from the sun or elsewise contruct large structures which would disrupt the star and become visible to us.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale