UK XI: Please Sir... May I Have Some More?

[Protocol Penguin]

Farridge wanting to take over the official Tories and push them further to the right… Sounds like he wants to repeat what happened Canada, where the federal Tories were sidelined and later swallowed up by the much more right-wing Reform party. Hopefully Farridge will do so badly in the election that he will vanish into obscurity, although unfortunately that isn’t likely seeing as the media keep on amplifying him.

[Protocol Penguin]

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/nigel-farage-milkshake-clacton-election-reform-133828249.html

Give that woman a medal.

[fishbowlhead]

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/nigel-fara...133828249.html
Give that woman a medal.

My condolences to the poor milkshake having to touch that disgusting slug.

[QualityChimp]

Anyone else watch the (mass) debate last night?

I think these things are pretty pointless, if I'm honest, but fascinating to watch.
It felt a little frustrating because Sunak kept talking over Starmer or longer than his turn, but the host struggled to contain them both, but it felt like she was stricter on Starmer, but I think he got a bit fed up about playing by the rules.

Sunak made some interesting points, but there seemed to be a lot less of them in comparison to unsubstantiated claims about how his party will fix things, Labour are going to charge everyone £2000 in tax and generally making things up. He got a smattering of applause, but he also got laughed at a fair bit, especially when he spoke about National Service (or "Dad's Army" for young people as Starmer put it) and when he claimed NHS waiting lists were down, but Starmer pounced saying "You said you were good with numbers but 7.5 million is bigger than 7.2 million!"

It was frustrating to hear Sunak say "Nobody knows what Labour will do, but you know our plan and it's working."

At times Sunak looked stroppy, demanding Starmer answer his question, but not letting him answer.
At times, Starmer looked a bit battered, but that's from the format of the show.

Ultimately, I don't like these American-style debates as it prioritises personality over policies, and being able to run a country is not the same as being able to debate with someone, but if it engages people with politics, then that's something in its favour.

Both sides are claiming a victory, but viewers have made their minds up before watching, so doubt it swayed many people.
I tried to watch it with an open mind, but definitely wanted Sunak to mess up.

[Neon Ignition]

Yep, the only way it would make an impact for Sunak is if he somehow landed a KO blow on Starmer but the man has nothing. Starmer might still be being vague due to not having the manifesto launched but he's got nothing to lose from just batting Sunak away.

Sunak's entire argument can be summarised as:
"He has no plan, but we have a plan and our plan is working as that plan is a plan to plan and see that plan planned out with meticulous planning against their lack of plan. Our plan is a plan that can plan, plan for the future of plans and if you want a plan then stick with our plan not their plan which is to have no plan. We are a plan, they are not a plan, we have planned our plan and I am a plan, the plan is a man and that man is a plan called me the man plan with a planned plan for a man with a plan... uh... plan plan them no plan the plan my plan..."

"But what exactly is it you plan?"

"... um... ugh... plan"

[egparadigm]

Yeah it wasn’t great. I didn’t think Starmer did badly, which is how it has been spun slightly on (not by) the BBC. I did think it was a bit odd he didn’t deal with the £2000 tax claim earlier and more clearly. BBC now reporting that the Treasury sent a letter saying it wasn’t their figure. Tories lying again?

I don’t think the public will fall for it this time.

[QualityChimp]

I think he tried to deal with the £2K claim, but kept getting talked over.
He had to wait until after the adverts when the host clarified they both had to stop when asked (still didn't, but it was better).

On one hand some people will take away that repeated £2K claim as true, then others will hear today's news and see that the main line of attack from Sunak was, in fact, bollocks.

[egparadigm]

Yeah I think that’s true, he was probably behaving himself unlike Sunak. Some people were saying he seemed nervous but I thought he looked confident and unflappable, which is what you’d expect from a barrister.

The format is stupid, giving only 45 seconds for responses. Etchingham saying they wanted to cover many subjects. Why not cover fewer in more depth?

If anyone hasn’t seen it iI’d highly recommend Borgen for showing how the media can sensationalise and manipulate TV debates. I think it’s Series 3, Episode 7.

[QualityChimp]

I can imagine as a barrister, those debates are quite frustrating where you take your time to explain your point or counter the other side's.
Even in PMQs, it's raucous, but they still have to take turns to approach the box to speak.

Being able to just shout over the other person isn't a great for anyone.

[Neon Ignition]

There's no excuse for not blocking mics on these debates

[Neon Ignition]

Frank Hester donated further £5m to Tories in January, figures show | Frank Hester | The Guardian

[MartyG]

I don't think Sunak is convincing anyone who isn't a total loyalist tbh. It'd be nice to think these Electoral Calculus seat predictions are accurate (this is from today's poll tracking numbers) ...



But anything under 100 seats would be gravy.

[Neon Ignition]

I definitely think that the impact of Reform is being heavily overstated and they won't come out with much. Tapping into the anti-Tory stance is all they have, it's nothing like the groundswell that Brexit gave UKIP.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/article/2024/jun/06/rachel-reeves-under-pressure-from-shadow-ministers-to-raise-capital-gains-tax-to-revive-public-services

[Mayhem]

Wow they thinking the SNP will drop that much from all the recent crises and Labour will be the party with the most seats in Scotland?

[Protocol Penguin]

I don't think Sunak is convincing anyone who isn't a total loyalist tbh. It'd be nice to think these Electoral Calculus seat predictions are accurate (this is from today's poll tracking numbers) ...



But anything under 100 seats would be gravy.

LibDems are gaining on the Tories there. TBH, I would like to see the LibDems getting more seats than the Tories, admittedly an unlikely situation. The Tories almost inevitably going to go extreme right when in opposition, so having a moderate party (with centre-left elements) as the main opposition would be preferable to a ragtag collection of Powellites and libertarians.