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Grand Theft Auto - San Andreas

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    One of the amazing things I've found is that San Andreas is finely tuned in comparison to the previous two games. If you pay close attention then you'll notice the cop ratings tend to go down a bit faster now, and that they aren't quite as aggressive on the first and second levels. Also when you scrape their cars or bump into them, they don't quite as often react (thankfully).

    There are subtle changes and tightening up of familiar elements all over the game if you look out for them. Bar the obvious technical difficulties I'm experiencing, the actual game design is top notch. Like a particularly strong Nintendo or Sega game, you can place faith and take for granted that certain aspects are going to be expertly balanced in the player's favour. Clearly a lot of attention has been paid to previous feedback as to where GTA III and Vice City failed.

    Secondly, another great example of the freedom and choice in the game is evidenced in the valet side-mission. After a narrative-based mission focused around this job, I immediately went back with my valet uniform and took it up. During the first couple of levels I noticed that various valets were taking up the cars, but I ignored them, expecting if I assassinated the competition the mission would fail. Eventually my patience broke and I decided to nail a couple waiting outside of the hotel. While I did so, they ganged up together and threw comments to 'not mess with valets'. I beat them to a pulp and rather than end this side-mission, the game intelligently fined me 20 seconds a piece for wasting the two guys.

    Now, this gameplay mechanic has pros and cons as to whether it's worthwhile dependent on context. For example, if you didn't have much time on the clock, killing the competition would serve no benefit. Whereas since I had a bit of time, this option afforded me the ability to service more cars quickly. At a small price.

    Then there was the final valet to take care of...

    So I drove my car into the carpark near the hotel and took him out. However, because I'd waited a few valet levels to do so within the side-mission, upon killing him, all the tips from his hardwork became available for me to scoop up from his dead body.

    Now do you see the immense amount of detail which even relatively minor aspects such as this have been given?

    If you don't assassinate the valets immediately, then you can let them milk their own tips and then kill them off at a latter stage of the side-mission, before snatching all their own takings. How utterly nasty and opportunistic is that?

    So... In this one mission, you're given a variety of choices and dilemmas you can choose to either take or pass up on, and I think those moments kind of symbolised what the game has produced successfully up to now.

    Apart from that, a special mention must also go to the radio stations again... Although it's been said before, the DJs react to the in-game environment, and from an intertextual standpoint, merge better with the player's situation/context far more effectively than in the previous games. An example of this would be K-Jah West, whose DJ commented on how it was going to be a rainy day and that people should take in their washing, whilst in the countryside I traversed at the time, buckets were pouring down from the skies. Not only that, (potential spoiler): but when the DA had been framed with the drugs in San Fierro during a mission, the DJ for Radio Las Santos, commented on the prosecution being caught with the dope in his car. What this does is effectively tie the narrative of the player's on-going situation to the background detail they saturate themselves inside of when they take a vechile to drive with. Another intuitive aspect of the audio context placement here is also in the game's sense of time. At 8am on the game's clock Playback's DJ commented how it was time to rise for the early morning, and he'd be playing music from Monday through until Sunday.

    It's all these details, and how they tie into the player's individual experience which puts this game above previous GTA's in my opinion. San Andreas seems to be much more aware and in touch with our sense of progress, together with a handling on the current narrative scope, no matter how minute or seemingly inconsequential. The personalised integration of this is an intelligent touch, and I feel it's an element which is reiterated both in terms of the choices we have, and the impact those choices make through how they're reflected back at us inside the game.

    For me, I find this highly impressive.

    Something I find less so, and I feel is beginning to bear down on these carefully thought out elements, are (in my opinion) needless technical troubles sliciing into what is otherwise a cleverly chereographed illusion.

    The game deserves better than random unstoppable crashes.

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      Actually scrap that. Have you guys got up to the 'Supply Lines...' mission yet?

      Balanced? Yes, and pink elephants fly through the cakehole sky. ft:

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        This is really, really good. ONe of the best games this gen. Level Design is incredible, Rockstar have just made it to legendry status. They are up there with all the great developers this industry has to offer. GTA3 was completley revolutionary, San Andreas finishes off this generation with a bang. Didnt expect this at all.

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          Aye. The satisfaction I just got from completing 'Supply Lines...' after around my 15th attempt was huge. It also helps that Zero's mission following on from that is superb in terms of design and execution.

          Rockstar North have always been a special developer. Have been for well over a decade now.

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            OK, loving this now. Still stuck in LS but focusing on missions. I have played through OG Loc's missions up to when he is giving a house party and the Ballers invade Grove Street. Just want to know if I have to play through all the missions before I can get out of the ghetto or is there one thread I should complete?

            The Camera seems to be the main thing crashing me. Especially when I try to use it in teh middle of gun battles. I had the most insane picture during an early train jackin mission, the light was perfect, there was an explosion in the distance (my car) and bullets captured in mid flight. Ho hum It was one of those unrepeatable moments, I went in armed just with the camera (rookie error) and tried to use it as a gun.

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              I really cant do Zeros first mission, its bloody impossible to shoot down all those miniplanes..

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                Originally posted by mrsquare
                Andreas is brilliant.

                Go try Vice City again. PS2, Xbox, whatever, its not half the game that San Andreas is - it just seems blocky, dull and small. Once the SA map opens up, its incredible. Its not revolutionary, but its absolutely fugging brilliant, and does absolutely *everything* it promised.
                Don't say that man, gotta contend with GTA on xb.....not gonna have SA for ages !

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                  Think this has been posted before, but where are the bicycle courier missions in Los Santos exactly?

                  Cheers.

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                    I may as well just quote myself.

                    If you want to know where to find it then Raboi's Food Mart in Commerce (the commerce to the left of the map) is the place to look.
                    Highlight the next quote for a slightly more detailed guide.

                    There are two sections to Commerce. You want the one to the left. The food mart is near a large brown building with vertical striped windows running along it's lower section, and a lower building nearby containing archways.

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                      Originally posted by ThoseOfTheUnlight
                      I really cant do Zeros first mission, its bloody impossible to shoot down all those miniplanes..
                      The one after is even worse

                      And i found a Happy Shopper last night. Made me laugh

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                        Originally posted by DjSatansfury
                        The one after is even worse

                        And i found a Happy Shopper last night. Made me laugh
                        That's the one I did last night. T'was a nightmare of epic proportions, for 90 or so minutes.

                        Thankfully, Zero's last mission is excellent and: the fact you get given his shop and access to another bunch of side-missions with the RC plane at the back of his shop made up for the hassle somewhat.

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                          Originally posted by spagmasterswift
                          OK, loving this now. Still stuck in LS but focusing on missions. I have played through OG Loc's missions up to when he is giving a house party and the Ballers invade Grove Street. Just want to know if I have to play through all the missions before I can get out of the ghetto or is there one thread I should complete?
                          IIRC there is one more Grove St. mission after that before you progress to San Fierro. You should be out of Los Santos after that one.

                          Submarines, planes, valet missions? I'm probably about half-way through San Fierro and I feel I've not discovered **** yet. I am managing to loose myself in the hills all the same, dirt-bikes are the way to go. 8)

                          The dialogue is really excellent in this game, the bits with the psycho chick in San Fierro are quality.

                          The game is shifting a mad amount of scenery also, I don't see how people can bitch about the graphics when there's no loading between areas and the framerate makes it more than playable.

                          Comment


                            How many missions are there before you reach San Fierro proper? I'm still stuck in the outback, and as enjoyable it can be, I'm iching to get into the big cities

                            Found the moster truck yesterday, it's actually pretty difficult to use since you can bounce so high off oncoming traffic (and flip over if you aren't careful). Unrealistic physics, but it's quite fun. Also found the quad bike, but that was pretty ****.

                            The dirt bike is indeed the way to go......however push bikes are the best, since you can get up any hill just by pumping the X button.

                            I did a little check of stats last night, and was surprised to learn that I had only completed 31 missions

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                              Originally posted by DjSatansfury
                              The one after is even worse

                              And i found a Happy Shopper last night. Made me laugh
                              Heh just completed it... supply lines here I come, doesnt seem TOO bad!

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by JammyD
                                IIRC there is one more Grove St. mission after that before you progress to San Fierro. You should be out of Los Santos after that one.
                                Safe mate, as much as I want to spend time with my Grove St hommies theres bigger fish to fry. Stealthing through Baller territory with a knife is one thing, but I want to fly jet fighters!!!

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