Nintendo Switch: Thread 09

[wakka]

In fairness to Nintendo, although the WiiU was an unmitigated disaster, I'm not sure there was an obvious slam dunk way to follow the Wii. It was a system whose mass market success lived and died on a gimmick that temporarily captured the public's imagination. You say that you pray the next machine has a number '2', but the WiiU was exactly that. They tried to play it safe with a direct follow up and it was the most dangerous thing they could have done.

The Switch isn't in quite the same position as the Wii, but it's not totally dissimilar. The central conceit of the machine is what has supercharged its success.

Nintendo do best when they do what they did with the Wii, DS and Switch and give people something to get excited about with the hardware. Their software then seals the deal, but as we saw with the WiiU, it can't do the job on its own.

I personally think the Switch 2 is going to need an X factor to repeat the success of the first machine. A simple 'Switch Pro' with boosted internals would probably do OK but see declining interest, and only forestall the need for a bigger change.

[Neon Ignition]

The trouble with the Wii is that Nintendo exhausted its appeal with their sheer complacency in their later days of the system, it's always been my view that they left sales on the table with that system as they became so damned lazy counting the cash from it. With the WiiU it was pitched as a straight forward follow up but they completely failed with its marketing.

Many were unclear it was even a new console and the Gamepad pivoted it away from what had worked with the Wii so it appealed to neither those fly by night gamers who had moved on from the Wii or even more centralist gamers for who the pad was effectively a halfway house to what works now.

For me, if Nintendo always needs a gimmick to convince people to buy into its hardware it will mean there's a problem they need to address. It can't be good for the company to lurch from 100m sellers to 10m sellers on random guesses at what will strike a chord. If anything the system might have to be more conservative by nature because it will inevitably be a handheld orientated device and there's only so much wiggle room you can do before compromises become too great - presumably why things like motion controls etc in the joycons this gen have been such a none event. They have the portable appeal sewn up so should prioritise that unless they ever decide to get serious about cultivating a loyal userbase with a proper online and library support system etc like everyone else has wisely done.

[randombs]

I feel the Switch is their least gimmicky console post-GC.

Other than the graphical hit, the docked/portable USP doesn’t negatively affect its ability to play traditional games in the way the Wii’s remote and WiiU’s game pad. The joycons have the same number of action buttons/triggers as the other consoles and the joycon grip makes them feel like a traditional pad at no extra charge (for the pack-in pair, anyway).

I’d be happy with a more powerful Switch that doesn’t drop to 5fps in BotW’s Korok Forest.

[Neon Ignition]

Yep, the Switch is something where QOL improvements are the main thing needed. I don't even feel a big drive for more power either, I'd happily not see Switch 2 land till 2025 at least, it rarely needs to heavy power things

[Neon Ignition]

https://www.eurogamer.net/hideki-kamiya-teases-bayonetta-4-already-in-the-works

Bayonetta 4 seems to be on the cards

https://www.eurogamer.net/mario-kart-8-deluxes-dlc-wave-3-includes-maple-treeway

And Mario Kart 8 Deluxe Booster Pass Wave 3 gets a trailer and a release date of 07 December

[wakka]

For me, if Nintendo always needs a gimmick to convince people to buy into its hardware it will mean there's a problem they need to address.

But look at Nintendo's history. Theirs is a legacy of successful innovation. Again and again they've set the agenda for their competitors, despite being a fraction of the size. And when they try and step back and play it safe, it never translates into sales.

The example I always go back to is the launch of the DS and PSP. It was received wisdom at the time that the PSP would crush the DS. It was so much sexier and more powerful, a pocket PS2, and it was almost the same price. And yet we all know how that went.

Where the non-Nintendo games market has moved is to homogeneity. There is nothing to choose between the Xbox and PlayStation except a handful of exclusives. Nintendo doubling down on what these consoles deliver best is a surefire loser.

They're in a totally unique position where they don't have to ensure they've got an industry standard design because that's what's needed for CoD and FIFA - they've got the flexibility to do something different, and a proven track record in doing it.

I look at the Wii, DS, and Switch, and think, well, if that kind of consistency in releasing smash hits is a problem they need to address, it's a good one to have.

[Neon Ignition]

There's definitely a line up of successful innovative systems but I think the trouble with their approach is that for every Wii, Switch, 2DS etc there's a Nintendo 64, Gamecube, WiiU etc. They're gamblers because they feel they need to disrupt the market to have an impact when really they didn't need to, Nintendo has been squeezed out of the conventional market space because of bad mistakes. Had they not had their peak arrogance era the PlayStation would be a Nintendo product and the N64 would have been spinning discs. I don't feel the issue with their conventional system follow ups has been that they're conventional, more that they always came with some ludicrously bad caveat like how the Vita required specific overpriced memory cards. Just dumb decisions that left the market open to Sony and MS to muscle in.

The DS an interesting one but I think part of the reason the PSP was expected to beat it was because at launch the DS wasn't even being positioned as the future of Nintendo handhelds either, they were still married to the Game Boy line up and considered it an offshoot but then Nintendo and handhelds has been the one real constant throughout the years too which the Switch carries on.

I think part of the issue with these systems innovations is that they're typically consigned to the pages of history along with the system they were for. Likewise, their systems biggest enduring hits are ironically the more conventional titles available on the systems. It's not so much that they need a PS5 competitor but when I look at the Switch I don't feel like messing with it too much is wise.

Not even sure what they could do with it anyway given the nature of the machine short of it using a folding screen.

[wakka]

For what it's worth, I think if you're looking for a maximally conservative Switch sequel, you'll get it (and I agree that it shouldn't come for years yet). But I think it will perform worse commercially than the Switch and will only delay the need for a more interesting follow up.

Not even sure what they could do with it anyway given the nature of the machine short of it using a folding screen.

Me neither, but then I'm not a toy designer

I agree that there should be continuity to the dockable handheld approach, but I'm confident that within that framework Nintendo's designers can surprise (and hopefully delight) if given the opportunity.

[importaku]

3rd wave of mariokart 8 tracks drop on dec 7th

https://mobile.twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/1594692490740785155

[wakka]

Great to see Maple Treeway and Boo Lake in there.

[Neon Ignition]

It's one of the curiosities of the handheld space they're now in. It's still a declining market in many ways, one that they're king of but it'll be curious as to what's possible whilst keeping within an affordable space

[dataDave]

The hardware format is largely irrelevant, handheld/hybrid or whatever. Outside of attach rates, all that matters to them is that they're able to sell ten thousand million hundred billion games at full price. They've really ramped up the publishing lately. It seems like there's been a new game each month.

That new Pokemon just knocked Splatoon 3 into second place as the fastest selling game ever in Japan. Just over 4M sold within three days, with 10M sold worldwide. How many games are they selling each year globally? I don't even know how to count that high.

[Neon Ignition]

Hopefully these high sales figures keep Switch 2 kicked into the long grass (assuming b/c isn't a given).

[Nu-Eclipse]

I almost feel like Nintendo don't know where to go with regards to a "Switch 2".

It's quite clear IMO that Nintendo sure as hell don't want to ever make proprietary hardware from the ground up ever again. It also looks like there isn't much more that can be done with a mobile nVidia chipset - DLSS isn't that much of a game changer or we would've seen Nintendo utilize it by now if it was, surely?

[wakka]

The latest cost-effective mobile chipsets will be leaps and bounds more powerful than the old Tegra chip in the Switch, though. The next Switch can have much improved graphics and performance simply by using more recent off-the-shelf parts.