Retro news too small for its own thread

[Hirst]

I was messing around looking at Taito's website whilst digging up old information and discovered that they have the coolest "404 Page Not Found" page of any website in that you can play it: https://www.taito.co.jp/Error/404

[Tobal]

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a few notes from people that read through it.

*Sega Pluto, which was a Saturn with a built-in modem
*Sega seriously considered bringing Terra Phantastica to the west, but ended up bailing on it
*Sega of Japan was developing a Mickey Mouse game that got canned
*Sega of America genuinely believed that Saturn Sonic could be released in late '96
*Sony was spending double on marketing what SoA did
*Heart of Darkness was supposed to come out in summer '96 for Saturn, ended up being a PlayStation exclusive in '98
*Sega Sports was very understaffed compared to its competition at Sony and EA
*Elder Scrolls Arena was planned to get an exclusive Saturn port

[Hirst]

I had a good read through it the other day and it confirmed my opinion of Sega of America at that time as being a rudderless confused mess, spreading far too few resources over nonsense projects and not really doing a good job at promoting the unique strengths of the Saturn. It was pretty obvious from their own research that Sony was a giant who were prepared to throw almost unlimited resources at the PS1. Meanwhile they’re explaining that retailers don’t really understand what the point is of the Game Gear and the Nomad co-existing, but the solution is not to think “why are we even still doing these” but to argue to retailers why they should both exist, along with all the other legacy stuff they’re being expected to push. Going on about the Genesis 3 whilst also admitting there aren’t really any games coming out for it, so people are just buying old stock.

Just a dossier of raw uselessness.

[wakka]

I've had a skim through it too. To be honest, being in senior leadership at Sega of America during this period seems like a complete nightmare. The feeling that comes off the emails between team members is that they are under-resourced, under-prepared, and utterly outflanked by Sony.

There's a clear disconnection between development realities and marketing priorities. One document urges that Sonic 'must not miss' its Nov 8th, '96 release date, 'without compromising on quality', while others repeatedly state that Sega's upcoming games must demonstrate technical superiority over PlayStation. Still another expresses worried views that Psygnosis's upcoming ports will compare badly with PlayStation versions and asks that STI development staff be dedicated to helping to ensure that Saturn versions are superior.

Sega Sports is a key area of concern and emblematic of how unprepared Sega are for the generational shift and arrival of PlayStation. Having dominated the US sports videogame market in the 16 bit era, Kalinske seems depressed to lament to fellow execs that no NFL game is looking ready for fall '96* and that 'we missed last year, too'.

There are recommendations, at points, that hit software is sought via development first for the arcade and then later ported to Saturn. Looking back this represents a woeful misunderstanding of where consumer tastes were heading. SoA was still looking back to the arcade, when consumers were moving on to meaty single player adventures like FF 7, MGS, and Ocarina shortly after these exchanges were written. There is no possibility, judging by this correspondence, that Sega would ever have been ready to take those games on.

The great white hope throughout much of the correspondence seems to be internet connectivity. When in doubt in this era, Sega always seemed to turn back to hardware add-ons. It's interesting to reflect on how this emphasis was likely a driver behind Dreamcast's bundled modem and web software (despite Bernie Stolar at the time being keen to put a clear divide between the Sega of Saturn and the Sega of Dreamcast).

Of course we know with the benefit of hindsight that the NetLink did little for Saturn's fortunes - although at least it launched with Daytona USA CCE, rather than the mysterious (and unappealing) 'Roach Racer' that Kalinske mentions at one point as a potential launch title.

It's a pretty fascinating set of documents. I sort of get second hand stress from reading it. Oh, and there are two storyboards for a couple of truly atrocious adverts which never made it to fruition.

*they did manage to squeeze out NFL '97 in the end, but it didn't release till right at the end of November '96.

[Hirst]

On the old Bootleg Sampler demo, there was a demo video of a few random upcoming games and it flashed up a few titles without footage, one of those was Roach Racer. No screens/footage/any real info so I’m guessing it was just something that STI pretended they were hard at work on (that and reading the job paper).

[wakka]

It's interesting to think how much Nintendo's arse was saved during this gen by their market-leading first (and second) party software.

Sega were lacking a lot of things but it was maybe that which is the most obvious omission that comes across in the documents. Obviously Saturn has plenty of good games but it had nothing even in the pipeline that was suitable to compete with the kind of cinematic 3D single player quests that EAD and Sony's carefully cultivated third parties were producing. And there doesn't seem to be any vision regarding the need for that kind of software, either.

If Nintendo hadn't had the extraordinary skills of the people who made Mario 64, Ocarina, Goldeneye, etc at their disposal (and the leadership wisdom to give them the time and budget they needed to be make their games as good as they could be), I think N64 would have gone down the tubes just like Saturn did. Especially since their software was so much more expensive than PlayStation's, and the hardware launched so much later.

[Yakumo]

I think N64 would have gone down the tubes just like Saturn did. Especially since their software was so much more expensive than PlayStation's, and the hardware launched so much later.

In Japan the N64 did go down the tubes. It was even behind the Saturn.
Nintendo 64 sold 5.54 million while the Saturn did 6 million.

[wakka]

That's really interesting. I think I was dimly aware that the N64 had struggled in Japan but didn't realise it was to that extent.

I also had it in my head that Saturn had done better in Japan than it actually did.

[Yakumo]

That's really interesting. I think I was dimly aware that the N64 had struggled in Japan but didn't realise it was to that extent.

I also had it in my head that Saturn had done better in Japan than it actually did.

The Saturn sold more games per console than anything else to that point. Around 16 games pre console were sold in Japan.

[wakka]

Interesting. That's a massively high attach rate that probably goes some way to explaining Kalinske's enthusiastic endorsement of their success in Japan having visited Akihabara.

It probably also reflects that Saturn's software library was very, very suitable for a particular niche of gamer. It was broad appeal that they lacked.

[Hirst]

The Saturn sold more games per console than anything else to that point. Around 16 games pre console were sold in Japan.

It makes sense, I can imagine the typical Saturn owner in Japan being somebody who is pretty seriously into games and likely to have a decent-sized game library. The PS1 had a much larger library (and no doubt had people who bought hundreds of games for it), but I imagine their games-per-console was lower as they'd brought in the casual market and I imagine half of them only bought 3 games for it.

The N64 - and this is no way meant as a dig (and I think on most forums I'd get my head ripped off) - I really would struggle to come up with a total of 16 games I'd actually want for it. Whenever I see a "best N64 games" list it always seems to be about the same 10 or so (mostly in-house) games shuffled around into a different order. I really think their lack of respect for third-party companies came home to roost at that point, Square alone leaving them was a disaster. Even the ones that didn't barely gave them the time of day, I think Namco did one baseball game on it and got some random third-party to do a Namco Museum port.

I think whatever way the game was played, the PS1 was going to win. But I think the Saturn could and should have been a very credible second place - certainly in PAL territories. And I think even if they got third in the USA due to the might of Nintendo of America's very strong marketing, it should have at least been close. Sega of America were just useless at that time.

[Colin]

8-BitDo Neo Geo CD pads incoming......

https://www.8bitdo.com/neogeo-wireless-controller/

[CMcK]

Shame there’s no adapter to use those pads with a real Neo.

[Colin]

Does seem a major oversight that they'll hopefully remedy.

[speedlolita]

Could probably sync it via bluetooth with a BlueRetro device.